Football 2010-2011

[eFestivals]

exactly. i'm sure everyone of us could come up with 20 more effective midfielders in the past 3 or 4 years. i don't remember much of hleb at all, which tells you what a impact he made.

and come on neil, get out your stats. you can't accuse me of being lazy and not searching up on these heavy bands at glastonbury and then tell cbc to go and find these stats himself if he doesn't believe you. double standards much?

Give me your Opta login then.

Oh, don't you have one? Funnily enough, nor do I.

I've tried googling for the Uni of Brum research and not found it. Which might be down to it not actually having been Uni of Brum that did the research - I can't be sure now who did.

[eFestivals]

You really are paranoid about these 'real' fans you go on about aren't you...perhaps you should attend some matches yourself. You might learn something and lose your paranoia...two birds one stone...

I guess that when opposing fans are heckling your lot on a Saturday afternoon, you take all their chanting literally.

Meanwhile, you've just proven the truth of "real fans" being arseholes yet again. Do keep it up.

[Steve P]

Perhaps, but considered more than objective enough for managers to place an awful lot of faith in how they're done.

Ignore the time we're talking about and jump a few steps down the line why don't you....?

As Hleb was so good, Barca bought him!!!!

What happened after that is not relevant to him being rated as the Prem's most effective player, and which caused Barca to buy him.

[eFestivals]

Where he started only 5 games before being loaned out to Stuttgart?

And 'boro bought Mido, what of it?

They bought him. They bought him cos they believed him worth buying. Care to point out where that's wrong?

[TheGayTent]

You think the Barcelona President looked up the Opta Index and bought Hleb on the basis he was top of the list?

[ampersand]

And 'boro bought Mido, what of it?

They bought him. They bought him cos they believed him worth buying. Care to point out where that's wrong?

[eFestivals]

Yes Opta stats do tell you a lot. Distance covered, successful tackles, pass completion etc. What they don't tell you is what a player is really like. Top coaches may look at the stats to find out info on players, but they watch them play live numerous times. Hleb left as his agent was agitating for a move. Barca, like every club, have made mistakes in their signings and Hleb was one of them. Hleb's contract was running down so they got him on the cheap.

Again, if he's so good why did he do nothing at Stutgardt last season? Surely the germans would have loved to sign him, after all they love "efficiency"

I agree, the stats can never tell anyone everyone about a player. But that's mostly an irrelevance in this instance, cos they told Barca enough to want to buy him.

And buy him at £11M, despite being "on the cheap" (which is actually a fair wedge for a player itching for a move with only a year on his contract) and clearly a player that Wenger wasn't too unhappy to see leave.

For whatever reasons, he didn't work out at Barca. That's something aside to his time prior to that.

[Cardboard Box City]

They bought him. They bought him cos they believed him worth buying. Care to point out where that's wrong?

[eFestivals]

You think the Barcelona President looked up the Opta Index and bought Hleb on the basis he was top of the list?

Top of the list for the Prem is all I've said, cos he was.

You, just like me, have no actual knowledge of the reasons they bought him, but I'd be very surprised if the stats wasn't something in the mix that helped them make up their minds.

[ampersand]

I don't think they'll have bought him on the strength of OPTA stats tho.

Are you sure that the thing you saw wasn't just talking about the previous weekends games because there's seemingly nothing to suggest he was an overly effective player two seasons in a row?

[TheGayTent]

I guess that when opposing fans are heckling your lot on a Saturday afternoon, you take all their chanting literally.

Meanwhile, you've just proven the truth of "real fans" being arseholes yet again. Do keep it up.

[eFestivals]

you suggest they bought him based on these stats. surely the fact they realised he was a flop and shipped him out proves that these stats aren't worth shit?

The stats are clearly worth a hell of a lot more than "shit" - otherwise no one would be prepared to pay the far from small sums required to get access to them.

There's all sorts of reasons why he might have "flopped" there, not necessarily due to him being regarded as shit. What we can be sure of is that they didn't think him shit when they splashed £11M+ on him.

and also, people saying that rooney is overated cos he doesn't perform at the world cup. gyan performed great at the world cup and is on his way to sunderland. would this not suggest that performing consistantly highly in the prem and champions league is worth more than a handful of games at the world cup?

From one angle yep, there's a long history of players performing well at the WC but being shit for the team that spunked lots of money on that player on the basis of their WC performances - Diouf and Diao being prime examples.

[TheGayTent]

Top of the list for the Prem is all I've said, cos he was.

You, just like me, have no actual knowledge of the reasons they bought him, but I'd be very surprised if the stats wasn't something in the mix that helped them make up their minds.

[eFestivals]

Are you sure that the thing you saw wasn't just talking about the previous weekends games because there's seemingly nothing to suggest he was an overly effective player two seasons in a row?

100% certain, yep.

As ever, just because it passed the "real fans" by doesn't mean you know more. The whole "real fans" thing that you like to regard yourself as is the biggest crock of shit in football.

[eFestivals]

How amusing. You know whenever i read your posts in this thread the following phrase often comes into my mind:

touche my friend.

[eFestivals]

is there not a premiership team of the year done by many well respected organisations/publications? surely he must feature in these for his two seasons...

not if the people doing those sorts of things are basing their choices on the narrow and mostly meaningless type of things that the "real fans" here regard as indisputable measures of a player.

If he was as poor a player as some have suggested why did Barca want him?

[Cardboard Box City]

is there not a premiership team of the year done by many well respected organisations/publications? surely he must feature in these for his two seasons...

[eFestivals]

Anyone with a brain would assume correctly that the Opta Index had sweet FA to do with helping making up their minds.

Really?

Then who exactly are the people paying tens of thousands of pounds each year for access to their stats if not football clubs?

[TheGayTent]

Really?

Then who exactly are the people paying tens of thousands of pounds each year for access to their stats if not football clubs?

[Cardboard Box City]

The whole "real fans" thing that you like to regard yourself as is the biggest crock of shit in football.

[eFestivals]

The stats the clubs are really interested are the physical ones. Which is why they all spend lots of time and money on ProZone.

They really couldn't give a w*nk about Opta.

Which you'd know if you actually spent any time being interested in the game rather than spouting piffle on your website.

So, I ask again ... who are the people spending tens of thousands of pounds each year for access to the Opta stats if it's not football clubs?

I'll give you a bit of a clue: it's not me.

[ampersand]

especially when deriding someone who has first-hand knowledge of the player in question.

[TheGayTent]

So, I ask again ... who are the people spending tens of thousands of pounds each year for access to the Opta stats if it's not football clubs?

I'll give you a bit of a clue: it's not me.

[Cardboard Box City]

yeah, you'll realise this when you're coughing up £20

[eFestivals]

That has more to do with supporting a team, what we're talking about here is rating a player - I, and the only others on here who's opinion I'd value in terms of PL players, feel that seeing a player play in the flesh is the best way to get a feel for how good a player is.

given that many of those people are the ones that believed England had a decent chance of winning the WC (while I said I'd be surprised if they made the last 16 don't forget ), it just gets to prove that that your credit them with far more than they deserve.

But of course you would do. Otherwise you'd have to admit that watching players in the flesh each week gives you no greater insight than any "armchair fan" (which I'm not I'll remind you).

You're quoting things that only you have seen (vaguely) and forcefully presenting them as why you're right meaning that they're not open to interpretation - not exactly the best source I'd have thought, especially when deriding someone who has first-hand knowledge of the player in question.

I'm quoting something that I've seen. Because it happened. Because it's true.

At no point have I said those stats aren't open to interpretation - in fact I've said the exact opposite.

Meanwhile, you "real fans" are swimming in the shit of your own ignorance by not knowing that Hleb was given that rating, even if you think the studies of those who are watching players in the flesh each week to a far greater depth than you will ever manage are worthless.

Get over it. Do you "real fans" have anything more to offer than that ignorance and the continual utter bollocks about your own prowess?