Football 2011-2012

[The Nal]

Check out this bellend!

And this

Oh, and the Portuguese cops are after Utd over the Bebe transfer!

Edited May 11, 2012 by The Nal

[strummer77]

From one angle I agree with you, but unless the plan is for Agger to play left back and give Coates the centre, they need some cover for left back - Enrique has gone to shit, either opposing players have him completely sussed or his confidence has been blown somehow else.

[eFestivals]

Check out this bellend!

yep, defo a twat ... after all, there's not been a City 'revival', there's been a Utd slump.

City could have turned into a team of Lionel Messi's and it still wouldn't have won them the title from the time of his cry baby act. It's needed Utd to drop points.

And this

.... how many has Messi clocked up in the end?

Oh, and the Portuguese cops are after Utd over the Bebe transfer!

No quite that. They want to talk to Utd, but from what i've read any criminality in the transfer doesn't involve them, they're simply the buyers.

Who knows, maybe Utd will end up getting their money back. They bloody should, he's shit.

[eFestivals]

Johnson is brilliant on the left- arguably better than at RB!

True, I thought that was a genius doing of Dalglish's at the end of last season.

But I'd guess that Johnson wouldn't want to be that side permanently, if nothing else it would be likely to lose him his England place.

[strummer77]

True, I thought that was a genius doing of Dalglish's at the end of last season.

But I'd guess that Johnson wouldn't want to be that side permanently, if nothing else it would be likely to lose him his England place.

[Benj]

Well it was £20m we spent on him. And if we put it back in the bank... surely that means we wont know how much Carroll and Suarez cost until they leave?

Your logic is mad.

Edited May 11, 2012 by Benj

[pink_triangle]

I really think its time to pension Carragher off. He is likely to get worse not better and already isn't good enough in my opinion.

One podcast I get claimed man u end of season form is one of the worst of a team going for a title, unsure if this is accurate. While city probably will win, I think qpr have more chance than most, in cisse they have the biggest wild card in the league.

[Benj]

No quite that. They want to talk to Utd, but from what i've read any criminality in the transfer doesn't involve them, they're simply the buyers.

Who knows, maybe Utd will end up getting their money back. They bloody should, he's shit.

[The Nal]

.... how many has Messi clocked up in the end?

Edited May 11, 2012 by The Nal

[eFestivals]

Seems like dem new yanks may have some issues though-

http://www.mirror.co...-manager-827722

well, that's clearly a bullshit article, because Dalglish defo didn't have anything to do with buying Suarez, and probably nothing to do with buying Carroll either.

The general theme might be true tho, that he's not going to be given much to spend. After all, there has been a lot of spending in the last year or so.

It's hardly a weird thing to do. Utd spent £50M or whatever it was last summer - and on players that haven't all lived up to their fee - and it's unlikely that they'll spend the same again this summer. Will you be posting that the Glazers have lost faith with fergie on the same basis?

The normal trend with big spending by any club is that they do it once in a while, and then utilise who they've bought. And who any club buys in that way don't always make an instant impact, but they might later come good.

I don't have high hopes that all of Liverpool's spending since Jan 2011 will come good (who's does?), but there's defo some that we haven't seen the best of yet - Henderson, Coates, and quite possibly Carroll. So it's hardly dire all round.

And what does that article actually mean anyway? It says "a vastly-reduced budget for signings" - which could still mean signings of £50M (tho I doubt it'll be that much). After all, £50M is a "vastly reduced" amount from the £120M or so that's been spent since Fenway bought the club.

I said a week or three back that I reckon they'll spend around £25M-£30M on new players this summer, but with some of that spending financed by any sales (Cole & Aquilani perhaps, if they can find buyers), and I don't really see any reason to think differently. The squad still needs a bit of tweaking, and as long as the owners haven't downgraded their hopes of where they get the club to I can't see them blocking all spending.

[eFestivals]

No but as cover, possibly.

Enrique, Robinson

Agger, Coates

Skrtel, Carragher

Johnson, Kelly, Flannagan

That's a decent set of cover and a good defence, third best in the league despite Pepe's awful season. Maybe another young centre back, but I would in no way prioritise it.

We haven't lost games because of defensive mistakes, we've lost them because we're an impotent attacking force.

I'm not sure that Robinson is adequate cover.

And while the defence has been solid over the whole season, they were far less good in the second half.

But yeah, the main problem has been the conversion rate (rather than "impotent attacking"; they made heaps of great chances)- the worst in Europe apparently. I can't see that being repeated even if they played all of the same players next season, because while some was due to not-good-enough quality in the players an awful lot was done to just poor luck. Someone's got to have the poor luck just as some have the good.

[strummer77]

I really think its time to pension Carragher off. He is likely to get worse not better and already isn't good enough in my opinion.

[Benj]

Will you be posting that the Glazers have lost faith with fergie on the same basis?

[strummer77]

well, that's clearly a bullshit article, because Dalglish defo didn't have anything to do with buying Suarez, and probably nothing to do with buying Carroll either.

[strummer77]

Oh and our director of communications has left the club. As was said on here, head's would role over the poor handling of the Suarez statements. There it is.

[The Nal]

Oh and our director of communications has left the club. As was said on here, head's would role over the poor handling of the Suarez statements. There it is.

[Benj]

You were on about Kenny though and mentioned the summer and the previous winter window. You set the time period not me or Efests. Now you're trying to change it to include the Torres purchase...

Kenny didn't buy Torres so can't be responsible for the purchase money of Torres. He inherited him for nothing and sold him for £50m which went on to fund two new players. It's an on running cycle.

Edited May 11, 2012 by Benj

[strummer77]

Are you saying NET SPEND! as anything more than an arbitary ruler is flawed? Surely not.

[Benj]

I've said that since my first post on the subject. I said actually wages and the bigger picture needed to be included. I simplified it to purely net spend when you at first appeared to struggle with moving beyond simply outlay...

Edited May 11, 2012 by Benj

[Benj]

Director is mis-communication more like.

LFCs new jersey is nice.

[strummer77]

As a non blind sort, how much influence do YOU think Dalglish had on the signings made following Hodgson's departure in early Jan?

[eFestivals]

Comolli asked Dalglish if he would have Carroll on the day Torres was leaving. Dalglish said 'Can you do it?'. Comolli went and negotiated it. As is documented by Lambias of Newcastle.

It's not really Carroll as a player that's the problem though, it was the massive fuck off fee.

The fee is of course stupid. But if the story that came out of the Torres price being based on what they'd buy Carroll for, then it's far less stupid than it first looks.

As for Dalglish's part in the decision to buy, what you've said there means very little ... any manager who was losing their prime striker with a very short time to go before the window shuts would want their buyer to go and buy just about anyone - and would be more interested in whether someone is coming in than who is coming in, on the basis that someone is better than no one.

And that "can you do it?" seems to bear that out. It's not "yes, get him, that's the player I want", is it?

We've not been as good second half, but Lucas not shielding that defence has something to do with it.

Yup, tho I'd say that Enrique turning to shit isn't irrelevant either. Teams have been getting down that side ever since he did, tho he's not helped by the poor defensive play of the players who have been in front of him most of the time (Bellend, and Downing).

But perhaps I'm being a bit unfair on Enrique there for defensive mistakes, cos Agger getting injured won't have helped either.

But looking back most losses/draws are by one goal... Take for example West Brom, it wasn't Johnson's mistake that cost us because we should have been able to concede 2 or 3 and still win that game.

Yup. If Liverpool had hit the average conversion rate - they don't even need a good conversion rate - things would be wildly different with their goals scored, games won, and league position.

I find it impossible to believe they'll have such a poor conversion rate over another season, and that's a part of the reason I feel things are hugely less dire going forwards than Benj wants to imagine.

[eFestivals]

Will you be posting that the Glazers have lost faith with fergie on the same basis?

Nope

At least you're able to admit you're trolling.

[eFestivals]

Kenny didn't make ANY SIGNINGS EVER, it was all done by other far more qualified people than him and he would have not been consulted.

nowhere have I said he wasn't consulted.

What I have said is that his part in some - if not all - of the buys will have been small, and very probably with no part in the fee that was paid.

It was Commilli's job to deal with buying players. Why have him in that role if everything about buying players is then all down to Kenny?

Im just simply proving my point that NET SPEND! can be massaged as and how you like, as I and Neil have proven.

get the fuck out of here.

There's naff all to massage with net spend. It's simple maths, but far too simple for you to manage as you keep proving.

Money spent minus money that comes in from sales. There is only one net spend figure.

Bit like poor Jordan Henderson, can't take the pressure of playing for der mighty red men!

He's a kid. On the same basis you've had loads of failures in recent seasons.

[eFestivals]

Adam... Dalglish's I think.

I really don't think so. They were in for Adam when Woy was still manager.

Everything about what happened at the time gets to look like an agreement was made to buy Adam in the summer if Blackpool went down.

Bellamy... Mainly Dalglish.

who's ever that was, that's a very good deal. He was free, without a signing on fee, and on comparitively cheap wages (£50k a week).

Bellend even turned down double the wages at QPR to come back to Liverpool. That's the sort of club-love any team would want of a player.

(Bellend is a player I hate, but I can't knock that deal.)

No idea on who drove the others, but Commilli won't have had an irrelevant part in any of them - his job was to identify and buy players.