prove me wrong...please

[audio farm]

I'm just dying to know all about the variety of emotions that Thom Yorke conveys! Misery, angst, depression, self-doubt. Wow! So varied. I think you are confusing "serious, slightly miserable" music with "varied".

[cejx]

First few off the top of my head: Jez Wiliams, Andy Cairns, Nick Cave, Burt Bacharach, Mike Mills, Guy Garvey, Stevie Wonder, Damien Rice, Thom Yorke. All from very different musical spheres but with one thing in common - the ability to construct music that conveys and elicits a variety of emotional responses.

Cover bands or orchestra are different as there is no pretence. You know what material is being played and choose to buy/watch/listen accordingly. With a lot of pop acts at the moment, the "act" is just a pretty face(s) with a so-so voice being used as a puppet for a music factory. I think there was a song nominated for an Ivor Novello this year that was female artist (Cheryl Cole?) but the songwriting nomination was to a team of 17 anonymous writers. That just seems wrong to me, music should be art, not manufactured goods. Take That originate from this base, had a huge period in time when they didn't exist and since reforming have been given the sheen of journeyman credibility which I feel is undeserved.

I'm not saying I'm right or anyone is wrong - as I said, it's my opinion.

[jimmyt]

this is getting rudiculous now...how can you possibly even compare radiohead and take that?!?!

im obviously coming from a biased point of view (being a big radiohead fan) but find it silly they can even be mentioned in the same breath...thats efestivals forums for ya i guess.

at least thom yorke can write a good lyric!!

take that lyrics: ' So I got busy throwing everybody underneath the bus

And with your poster 30 foot at the back of Toys-R-Us'

COME ON! They are w*nk...END OF!

[eFestivals]

Take That are a great pop act. What is wrong with that? Gary Barlow has incidentally won 5 Ivor Novello awards and was voted the best UK songwriter.

.... and until the last week or two, Westlife had sold more records in the UK in the last decade than any other act. What of it?

A popularity vote is that and only that. It says nothing of quality.

As for winning an Ivor, they've also been won by the following 'great' songwriters....

The Darkness

Craig David

Spice Girls

Mike Stock

Ted Heath

Christina Aguilera

Mike Batt (I'm guessing for The Wombles)

James Blunt

Gary Glitter

Ronan Keating

Leona Lewis

[jimmyt]

.... and until the last week or two, Westlife had sold more records in the UK in the last decade than any other act. What of it?

A popularity vote is that and only that. It says nothing of quality.

As for winning an Ivor, they've also been won by the following 'great' songwriters....

The Darkness

Craig David

Spice Girls

Mike Stock

Ted Heath

Christina Aguilera

Mike Batt (I'm guessing for The Wombles)

James Blunt

Gary Glitter

Ronan Keating

Leona Lewis

[sifi]

Bob Dylan has never won an Ivor Novello award for songwriting.

A Pulitzer Prize, yes. Forty Seven Grammies, yes. Voted in the Time Magazine's "Men of the Century", yes. The White House award for contributions to Civil Liberties, yes.

But no Ivor Novello.

You can shove that award right up your arse, whoever brought it up as a reason why TT should play.

[thelizardking]

Bob Dylan has never won an Ivor Novello award for songwriting.

A Pulitzer Prize, yes. Forty Seven Grammies, yes. Voted in the Time Magazine's "Men of the Century", yes. The White House award for contributions to Civil Liberties, yes.

But no Ivor Novello.

You can shove that award right up your arse, whoever brought it up as a reason why TT should play.

[eFestivals]

what does..?

Who knows.

But the types of people with very little interest in music who are the types that in the main buy Westlife records and Take That records defo aren't the types who'd be able to recognise musical quality.

And before the TT fans start, yes, it very definitely *IS* the case that people who don't normally buy music make up the majority of the TT sales - otherwise the numbers of albums sold would hit those sorts of levels all the time and not just when a boy band has a new release.

[jimmyt]

Who knows.

But the types of people with very little interest in music who are the types that in the main buy Westlife records and Take That records defo aren't the types who'd be able to recognise musical quality.

And before the TT fans start, yes, it very definitely *IS* the case that people who don't normally buy music make up the majority of the TT sales - otherwise the numbers of albums sold would hit those sorts of levels all the time and not just when a boy band has a new release.

Edited November 30, 2010 by jimmyt

[thelizardking]

I'm definitely not arguing - I'm being a bit of an arse here because I really do hate manufactured rubbish with a passion - but can we please include The Killers, KOL, etc. in the category of music bought by people that don't really like music? Pretty much all of my friends who never go to live music, don't listen to music at home and watch X-Factor have KOL and Killers albums. I'm not saying their music is all crap (not ALL of it) but it definitely is music for people that don't really like music. You know, the sort of people that own an ipod touch or, even worse, "don't get mp3 players because all [their] music fits on their phone."

[jimmyt]

Im confused where you're coming from now, you backed up Take That earlier in the thread now you're saying that

[eFestivals]

that's a fairly skewed logic there

Really? How?

It's very VERY easy to see that the vast majority of people buying the new Take That album are not people who normally buy music. The weekly sales of music of all kinds prove this is the case.

So it's a very reasonable assumption to conclude from that that these are people with little interest in music - because otherwise they'd show that interest more of the time than they do.

Would you say that someone with little interest in (say) books and who rarely reads is perfectly placed to state which are good books and which aren't?

[ivan]

I still say if Glasto got TT it would be a huge coup for them and would help the BBC viewing figures

and more promotion for Glastonbury !

I would go and watch a couple of songs !

And to be honest would prefer them to the Sunday Oldie slot that bores me to death - Except if they got

Dolly then I would be at the front !

[sifi]

And to be honest would prefer them to the Sunday Oldie slot that bores me to death -

[sifi]

Na.

I've got it in my head that you had to have had a hit in the sixties to qualify for the oldie slot.

* quickly runs off to check when Hot Buttered Soul came out *

[sifi]

Oh, I see. I think Slash is in the "token rock act" slot, much like the Quo were the year before.

Not that I watched the Quo.

[jimmyt]

Oh, I see. I think Slash is in the "token rock act" slot, much like the Quo were the year before.

Not that I watched the Quo.

[ian the worm]

A lot of this thread relates to what music people think is COOL and what is UNCOOL. Which is where the subjectivity of personal taste comes in. Would you like to see an UNCOOL band at Glasto?

[sifi]

Why don't people love Quo?

Edited November 30, 2010 by sifi

[jimmyt]

A lot of this thread relates to what music people think is COOL and what is UNCOOL. Which is where the subjectivity of personal taste comes in. Would you like to see an UNCOOL band at Glasto?

[sifi]

A lot of this thread relates to what music people think is COOL and what is UNCOOL. Which is where the subjectivity of personal taste comes in. Would you like to see an UNCOOL band at Glasto?

[cejx]

Really? How?

It's very VERY easy to see that the vast majority of people buying the new Take That album are not people who normally buy music. The weekly sales of music of all kinds prove this is the case.

So it's a very reasonable assumption to conclude from that that these are people with little interest in music - because otherwise they'd show that interest more of the time than they do.

Would you say that someone with little interest in (say) books and who rarely reads is perfectly placed to state which are good books and which aren't?

[sifi]

I think that those that haven't bought the album(s) can't really say either way if they are good or bad, and if you're harping back to the time of their 'manufacture' 20+ years ago as a reason to why you think they are shite, then thats just being misinformed.

[jimmyt]

I have interest in music.

I buy music.

I play music

I bought the new take that album.

I think that those that haven't bought the album(s) can't really say either way if they are good or bad, and if you're harping back to the time of their 'manufacture' 20+ years ago as a reason to why you think they are shite, then thats just being misinformed. If you've listened to the albums and still think they're shite - then fair enough - at least your are basing that on what you've just heard rather than what you read second hand.

[sifi]

that displays as much awareness of Status Quo's music as some are showing towards Take That