news & politics:discussion

[steviewevie]

 

[Skip997]

So we're still counting pennies while the world burns

[Guest]

10 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

ok, well they were not forced into the 28bn pledge...they themselves came up with it. I guess the argument will be that the situation has changed and they can't guarantee that amount will be spent...which hardly instils confidence they will meet any targets, it's not as if everything has got cheaper.

Is it really the £28b that’s the issue for you? Take that out of the equation and what do you think?

[Guest]

11 minutes ago, Neil said:

impossible to meaningfully commit to without time travel to know the future situation for how much money is available to be spent - tories could poison pill it with the next budget.

Labour don’t even know the state of the government finances so they can’t really fully commit to spending plans. If they ever announced a policy without any plans for how it would be funded then there would be uproar. 

[steviewevie]

4 minutes ago, Ozanne said:

Is it really the £28b that’s the issue for you? Take that out of the equation and what do you think?

a big gaping hole called cost.

[lazyred]

6 minutes ago, Ozanne said:

Is it really the £28b that’s the issue for you? Take that out of the equation and what do you think?

Its the fiscal rules that need to change in particular the rule about debt falling after five years. They can still reduce the deficit on current spending and use the borrow to invest rule for the green plan 

Edited February 1, 2024 by lazyred

[steviewevie]

 

[Guest]

1 minute ago, steviewevie said:

a big gaping hole called cost.

There we go then, damned either way. 

[Neil]

5 minutes ago, Ozanne said:

Is it really the £28b that’s the issue for you? Take that out of the equation and what do you think?

I think without it labour would struggle to grow the economy by enough to increase public spending by enough l.

[steviewevie]

3 minutes ago, lazyred said:

Its the fiscal rules that need to change in particular the rule about debt falling after 5 five years. They can still reduce the deficit on current spending and use the borrow to invest rule for the green plan 

what are the fiscal rules? 

But yeah, that 5 year rule would be quite the restriction...extend to 10 years (2 terms) and they'd have a lot more room to do stuff.

Edited February 1, 2024 by steviewevie

[steviewevie]

3 minutes ago, Ozanne said:

There we go then, damned either way. 

I guess...as Skip says shouldn't worry about counting the pennies...

[Skip997]

The dream of continual growth on a planet with finite resources and susceptible to collapse due to human greed is what's killing this planet.

As a species we actually deserve what's coming 

[Guest]

4 minutes ago, lazyred said:

Its the fiscal rules that need to change in particular the rule about debt falling after five years. They can still reduce the deficit on current spending and use the borrow to invest rule for the green plan 

Labour’s fiscal rules will differ from the Tories within a year just like they did last time round. They can amend certain rules so that the policies will be able to fit within the rules. 

[Skip997]

1 minute ago, steviewevie said:

I guess...as Skip says shouldn't worry about counting the pennies...

We haven't got time to count the pennies

Last time I checked you can't eat or drink money, esp when it's 1's and 0's on a server

[steviewevie]

8 minutes ago, Skip997 said:

The dream of continual growth on a planet with finite resources and susceptible to collapse due to human greed is what's killing this planet.

As a species we actually deserve what's coming 

it's not even that, although obviously that doesn't help...it's the fact we are burning fossil fuels for energy right now...if we suddenly somehow switch our energy source to something which doesn't pump greenhouse gases into the atmosphere then in theory we can keep on growing without f**king the climate..in theory.  And to switch to these alternative sources is massive, easy to say just stop using gas/oil/coal...easy peasy...but we're so reliant on it in so many ways...heat/transport/steel/cement...it will take a while to switch. I agree we need to cut back on consumption, but surely at moment no.1 priority has to be finding and using greener energy. And I have said this a few times, it is good that UK has ambitious net zero goals, but need China/India/USA to get moving rapidly or we're not going to get anywhere...and need to persuade the developing countries to stop developing and stay poor.

[Guest]

Saying ‘we deserve what’s coming’ probably isn’t the best way of trying to get people on side. That’ll turn people off your cause pretty quickly. 

[steviewevie]

didn't even have to wait a week...

 

[steviewevie]

when comes to the next election I'm sure people will think, yes, I will vote Labour...fiscal prudence is just what the country needs.

[Guest]

7 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

didn't even have to wait a week...

 

Like night follows day. 

[Crazyfool01]

f**k it I’m voting Lib Dem now 

[steviewevie]

I might vote Tory. May as well be honest with myself.

[Neil]

1 hour ago, Skip997 said:

The dream of continual growth on a planet with finite resources and susceptible to collapse due to human greed is what's killing this planet.

As a species we actually deserve what's coming 

growth isn't just growth in stuff - growth in personal services is also growth! can also be growth in prejudice and ignorance and then we do deserve what's coming.

Edited February 1, 2024 by Neil

[steviewevie]

1 minute ago, Neil said:

growth isn't just growth in stuff - growth in personal services is also growth!

Trees grow too.

[steviewevie]

 

[Neil]

immigration and spending is about to swing round to focus on labour  again, cos....

Quote

Home Office asks for emergency £2.6bn after asylum seeker hotels overspend

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2024/feb/01/home-office-asks-for-emergency-26bn-after-asylum-seeker-hotels-overspend

 

Edited February 2, 2024 by Neil