Selfish Ungrateful People

[RABun]

Those that lost EMA - at least they have an education service

Those that lost a job - at least they have a welfare state that means they wont starve

The disabled that lost benefits - at least they aren't just left to die.

Where do you want to stop with the 'always someone worse off' argument? All that argument does is lower what we might expect from life in a civilised country. In 2011 there are some things we should be able to take as a given, not be expected to express gratitude for. In one of the top 10 wealthiest natio ns in the world, Id say that list of givens should be quite extensive

[worm]

There was somne arse on there the other day who had a bit of a sniffle pretending he had cancer. What sort of world do we live in eh?

Edited January 6, 2011 by worm

[llcoolphil]

Aye, there's quite a few witless people who can't see the joke too.

'Some people say I'm a hypocondriac, but they don't have cancer do they' is a fundamental classic in black humour Chief.

[worm]

I couldn't agree more thought it was a brilliant line

[Harsim]

Excellent point

If i wasnt a bit scared of being beaten up i would have gone a bit ballistic at someone i used to go to school with last night.

She's not on my friends list but she commented on another friends status.

My friend said:

" a whole month of not going out, can i do it?"

to which this other girl said

"Who can afford to go out no V.A.T has gone up, along with the cost of every day living,this governnment are a bunch of w*nkers........ xx"

I typed out the following but didnt press send

"Yeah Jo, forget the people who are about to lose their public sector jobs, forget those people who can't afford to keep warm and fed throughout the winter because they've lost disability benefits, or the low income family kids who cant get to college because they've lost their EMA....shock f**king horror, 30 somethings cant afford to go out binge drinking!!! how could they let it happen!!!" :angry:

Edited January 7, 2011 by Harsim

[eFestivals]

EMA was a complete joke, it was an idea introduced to encourage young people to stay in education as long as possible.

while there's lot that can be criticised about EMA, there was a FAR greater point to its introduction than that, which passed most people by at the time and is well of the radar of most people now.

It's main purpose was to allow the right to benefits to be removed from people aged 16 to 18. Politically they wouldn't have been able to abolish the right to those benefits without giving an alternative method of support to that age group, and while EMA is universal it's still cheaper to the govt than the benefits that were paid to them previously.

But I suspect it was always introduced as a temporary measure, so that a few years down the line it could be removed as its being, because it's easy to consider it as unnecessary as you've done, while the same is not true for benefits that people require to survive.

[Harsim]

while there's lot that can be criticised about EMA, there was a FAR greater point to its introduction than that, which passed most people by at the time and is well of the radar of most people now.

It's main purpose was to allow the right to benefits to be removed from people aged 16 to 18. Politically they wouldn't have been able to abolish the right to those benefits without giving an alternative method of support to that age group, and while EMA is universal it's still cheaper to the govt than the benefits that were paid to them previously.

But I suspect it was always introduced as a temporary measure, so that a few years down the line it could be removed as its being, because it's easy to consider it as unnecessary as you've done, while the same is not true for benefits that people require to survive.

[feral chile]

I can understand this, its a valid point. But EMA was an easy way to deal with the situation.

But now an efficient idea has been announced, if people are going to claim benefits they will have to earn it by doing public service. Regardless of their age.

Edited January 7, 2011 by feral chile

[eFestivals]

I can understand this, its a valid point. But EMA was an easy way to deal with the situation.

But now an efficient idea has been announced, if people are going to claim benefits they will have to earn it by doing public service. Regardless of their age.

Returning to Victorian workhouse values is as far away from 'progressive' as it's possible to be.

The vast majority of people only end up in such situations if society is unable to offer them gainful employment at a living wage. The simple fact is that society is not able to offer that reasonable alternative: you cannot fit 3M+ people into less than 1M jobs.

[LondonTom]

Returning to Victorian workhouse values is as far away from 'progressive' as it's possible to be.

The vast majority of people only end up in such situations if society is unable to offer them gainful employment at a living wage. The simple fact is that society is not able to offer that reasonable alternative: you cannot fit 3M+ people into less than 1M jobs.

Edited January 7, 2011 by LondonTom

[Uncle Liam]

You tell (student x) who I taught last year , from the arse of Cambridgeshire, who battled through his GCSE's in 08-09 and now has an offer from Kent (and others) whose parents couldnt have afforded the money it would have cost them to pay for the bus fare to college each week that EMA is a waste.

EDIT: You can also tell my cousin who is currently in the first year of a degree at QUB whose dad spent five years off work because off (according to the doctor) the worst nervous breakdown she'd ever seen that EMA is a waste.

Anyone who criticises EMA frankly knows jack shit about sixth form education. And before anyone says anything, Sixth Form education is what I do for a living.

Edited January 8, 2011 by Uncle Liam

[rachbon]

So you think long term unemployed should sit around doing nothing?....During my placement year which I didn't get a job it done my nut in not doing anything, if the government offered me dole money for a few hours of community service I would have took it!

I don't think its returning to Victorian values, I think it helps get people motivated and back to work as they are in that mentality rather than a mentality of watching Jeremy Kyle, which the vast majority as you probably would rather be out there earning but can easily slip into a shity mentality of no doing anything.

The vast majority of people who want to get back to work will probably welcome something to do, if they don't at the time given people a purpose than sitting around getting reject from post after post has got to be better.

[LondonTom]

it's ridiculous that anyone would think this is a good idea.

if unemployed people are going to be forced to work, then there must be jobs there. is there are jobs there, then they should be employed and paid at least minimum wage!

people claiming JSA shouldn't be treated like criminals and be forced to work for no wages. there's nothing right about it.

[saratink]

As for EMA, the vast majority of people at the sixth form I wen tot who got it were better off than me as their parents had split up so it looked like they were worse off and most spent it on games rather than education or travel enabling them to go get extra education. Good idea in principal but like most things run by the government poorly executed.

[rachbon]

Why? So those claiming JSA should sit around doing nothing is what your saying? I don't think we are talking a serious 9-5 job, but a couple of hours every few days wouldn't do them no harm would it? Its not treating them like criminals, criminals are treated far better in this country thanks to the left and so called human rights but thats something entirely different two wrong ideas don't make a right.

Maybe it could be waived if they found themselves some volunteer work for a charity (I am specifying charity, as somehow we'd have to prevent business's from trying to get free employment via JSA).

Edited January 8, 2011 by _rachelbon

[worm]

Why? So those claiming JSA should sit around doing nothing is what your saying? I don't think we are talking a serious 9-5 job, but a couple of hours every few days wouldn't do them no harm would it? Its not treating them like criminals, criminals are treated far better in this country thanks to the left and so called human rights but thats something entirely different two wrong ideas don't make a right.

Maybe it could be waived if they found themselves some volunteer work for a charity (I am specifying charity, as somehow we'd have to prevent business's from trying to get free employment via JSA).

Edited January 8, 2011 by worm

[llcoolphil]

studying animation production at Bournemouth.

[llcoolphil]

So you think long term unemployed should sit around doing nothing?....During my placement year which I didn't get a job it done my nut in not doing anything, if the government offered me dole money for a few hours of community service I would have took it!

I don't think its returning to Victorian values, I think it helps get people motivated and back to work as they are in that mentality rather than a mentality of watching Jeremy Kyle, which the vast majority as you probably would rather be out there earning but can easily slip into a shity mentality of no doing anything.

The vast majority of people who want to get back to work will probably welcome something to do, if they don't at the time given people a purpose than sitting around getting reject from post after post has got to be better.

As for EMA, the vast majority of people at the sixth form I wen tot who got it were better off than me as their parents had split up so it looked like they were worse off and most spent it on games rather than education or travel enabling them to go get extra education. Good idea in principal but like most things run by the government poorly executed.

[Harsim]

Wow that's going to make the world a better place. I might really object to my tax money subsidising you to study cartoons at university. And before you say I dont subsidise you, I do because your fees dont cover the cost of your course.

Edited January 8, 2011 by Harsim

[LondonTom]

why does it matter what they're doing all day? no one has the right to judge what anyone does in their spare time whether they're in employment or not.

don't you think that if there is work available, people should be employed to do that work and be paid for it? rather than keep them unemployed and make them work for free.

it costs less to pay someone JSA and make them do the work, then to employ them and pay them minimum wage. that's why it would be done, it's got nothing to do with motivating people.

[feral chile]

Of course if work is available they should be employed to do that, but there isn't is there?

Edited January 8, 2011 by feral chile

[LondonTom]

Oh cool, if there's no work available, the unemployed won't be able to do any then will they?

That's what unemployed means, after all.

[grumpyhack]

im now 20 and living independently, studying animation production at Bournemouth.

[feral chile]

It can mean that, it can also mean lazy f**ks who don't want to work or don't wish to go for the work that is available as they feel its beneath them no? Its not a black and white area where the rich are oppressing the poor :S. So why exactly is giving people on JSA a few hours of community work and charitable work a bad idea? Stuff that might not otherwise get done?

[saratink]

Using legs to get to school/college? What if you live in a town that doesn't have a school or a college?!