Selfish Ungrateful People

[LusciousLucy]

Sadly the Jobcentre and the Benefits system is so rotten and lost in itself with the cyclic perpetuation of allowing career jobless and people eligible for benefits to remain in that state something drastic has to happen to get everyone from the top down to change their ways and attitude.

Those of us that have done the JSA and Jobcentre visits know full well that the staff are often (I am not stating that every one is though before anyone jumps in to defend and then berate my experience and opinion) just as demotivated as many who come through the doors. It's not their fault, the systems in place are what is the basis of the problem.

It is going to take such a radical overhaul to sort it out but with us all being British with our history, our 'rights', everyone's personal opinions, political views and support for different parties and governments, anything that any new or future government comes up with to overhaul, fix or reboot is going to create a monstrous division (as it is already showing to do so).

It frustrates me that this history we have in this country and British attitude towards what we have all become accustomed to with the systems that were created in the middle of last century means that it is going to be insanely difficult to change mindset and approach to a much needed for overhaul and countrywide attitude change!

[LusciousLucy]

PS. Before anyone launches into a political rant/reaction against what I have just written, none of it was written to create a rise in anyone in particular ok? I'm just speaking from recent experience and observations of the country I live in and have every right along with everyone else to have an opinion about what has happened to the UK concerning the systems we have in place today.

Thank you.

[harderfaster]

hmmm. what about an office junior? i did that when i was 17, it would get him some good admin experience.

[eFestivals]

No, but it is relevant to the amount of jobs there are being created and the subsequent fluid change in average.

there's been no substantive change in the number without jobs for nearly 30 years.

[worm]

there's been no substantive change in the number without jobs for nearly 30 years.

[feral chile]

In all fairness I know some graduates doing similar things to this. I knew a graduate working at McDonald's full time for 18 months after her graduation. If there are graduates applying to these crappy roles, a school leaver with very few qualifications has sweet fa chance.

[llcoolphil]

It's not their fault, the systems in place are what is the basis of the problem.

[llcoolphil]

Is that true these days? it never used to be true in the past. A degree could be a disadvantage if you went for a non graduate job in the past, partly because the potential employer knew you were overqualified and likely to leave, and partly because you were seen as suspect - at the very least an underachiever with no ambition.

[feral chile]

Very much true - 3 people in our company with degrees, none working in graduate level jobs, all doing jobs that could be taken by substantially less qualified people. Now that so many people have a degree, why would you take on someone without one? If you create a million more graduates but only 100,000 more graduate level jobs, that's 900,000 people employers get to choose from

[llcoolphil]

Actually, now I think of it, there are 5 people in my office that I know of who have degrees, probably more, and I think the entry requirement was 5 GCSE's.

[worm]

The government's own figures show that 95% of all JSA claimants claim for less than six months

[worm]

Very much true - 3 people in our company with degrees, none working in graduate level jobs, all doing jobs that could be taken by substantially less qualified people. Now that so many people have a degree, why would you take on someone without one? If you create a million more graduates but only 100,000 more graduate level jobs, that's......

[Harsim]

which part of they've already put back via their NI contributions when they were working are you failing to grasp?

Benefits are NOT charity. They are something that people contribute towards, so that if they need it due to unemployment or illness they're able to claim it back.

Nope, that's you that is - by your branding of the unemployed as worthless scum who only deserve support if made to work as slaves.

All the drivel you're spouting is either factually wrong, or the values of early Victorian Britain. If you want those values, get up that f**king chimney you working class scum.

Edited January 14, 2011 by Harsim

[Greeny_Musicchild]

For me, your problem is assuming that those people are in the majority. I'm unemployed and actively trying to find a job everyday. I) I'm usually on the dole for a matter of weeks.

2 months now. I'm back at my parents, life is pretty shit right now. 300 applications is currently the norm in Nottingham for bar work, let alone anything better paid. Don't tell me i have to do community service if i have to do this for another 4 months. The last time i came off the dole (for 3 weeks) i got a tax rebate of £400, shouldn't we sort that sort of thing out before we start putting conditions on something that your average worker is perfectly entitled to?

Edited January 14, 2011 by Greeny_Musicchild

[eFestivals]

Im not actually talking about people that have worked and intend to work, im talking about the people that dont work, have no intention of working, and just exploit the JSA system. The people that live in a house, given to them by the goverment, and you are paying for it. People with TV's bigger than my bed, and every form of materialistic devices. People that have 4 children before the age of 20 to increase the money they are able to exploit from you and me.

While I dislike the fact that such people have found themselves in that position due to the previous tory govts which created the circumstances where that could happen, I'm also smart enough to realise that whether some people never work or not makes f**k all difference to the situation overall.

The simple fact is that until such time as the jobs gap has been closed by the creating of 2M extra jobs, whether one person is unemployed for their lifetime or 45 people each are unemployed for a year makes no difference. What DOES make a difference is how happy that one or that 45 people are with their lot - and it's surely better to have one person reasonably content to be permanently unemployed than it is to have just one of those 45 alternative people to be pissed off about being unemployed for that year.

The new system allows people to claim for 6months, then after 6 months they have to do public service. Im sure anyone who seriously puts their mind to it can find some form of employment within 6 months.

Not 'anyone' - not until the number of jobs matches the number of people needing them. That fact gets to show that what you say is an impossibility.

[diddly-dee]

And some words of wisdom in mitigation/defence of the workshy which the wage slaves would do well to remember:

"Any damn fool can beg up some kind of job; it takes a wise man to make it without working."

"It was true that I didn't have much ambition, but there ought to be a place for people without ambition, I mean a better place than the one usually reserved. How in the hell could a man enjoy being awakened at 6:30 a.m. by an alarm clock, leap out of bed, dress, force-feed, shit, piss, brush teeth and hair, and fight traffic to get to a place where essentially you made lots of money for somebody else and were asked to be grateful for the opportunity to do so."

"The nine-to-five is one of the greatest atrocities sprung upon mankind. You give your life away to a function that doesn't interest you. This situation so repelled me that I was driven to drink, starvation, and mad females, simply as an alternative."

Charles Bukowski, 1920-1994

[worm]

And some words of wisdom in mitigation/defence of the workshy which the wage slaves would do well to remember:

"Any damn fool can beg up some kind of job; it takes a wise man to make it without working."

"It was true that I didn't have much ambition, but there ought to be a place for people without ambition, I mean a better place than the one usually reserved. How in the hell could a man enjoy being awakened at 6:30 a.m. by an alarm clock, leap out of bed, dress, force-feed, shit, piss, brush teeth and hair, and fight traffic to get to a place where essentially you made lots of money for somebody else and were asked to be grateful for the opportunity to do so."

"The nine-to-five is one of the greatest atrocities sprung upon mankind. You give your life away to a function that doesn't interest you. This situation so repelled me that I was driven to drink, starvation, and mad females, simply as an alternative."

Charles Bukowski, 1920-1994

[Harsim]

I completely agree with Charles Bukowsk, very clever indeed.

But people should be inspired, people should have dreams, people should strive to better themselves.

By giving people money to sit at home, when they have no aspirations to do anything with their life, you are not encouraging people to make the best for themselves.

I'm not saying people should get a 9-5 job. But i find it so saddening that people are so wrapped up with drink, drugs, the need for materialistic possessions they don't need, slowly their lives fly past them.

[feral chile]

I completely agree with Charles Bukowsk, very clever indeed.

But people should be inspired, people should have dreams, people should strive to better themselves.

By giving people money to sit at home, when they have no aspirations to do anything with their life, you are not encouraging people to make the best for themselves.

I'm not saying people should get a 9-5 job. But i find it so saddening that people are so wrapped up with drink, drugs, the need for materialistic possessions they don't need, slowly their lives fly past them.

Edited January 15, 2011 by feral chile

[Uncle Liam]

I commented back (quite reasonably as I think the NHS is worth defending at all times) and got deleted for my trouble.

Awesome.

This is from a girl in my old hometown. The same hometown where I had a night out with some school 'mates' before xmas and had to endure the most horrific racism i've heard in a while. Examples such as "did you know such and suchs sister is marrying a Muslim, if he tries to blow himself up near me I'll shoot him" and "do you want to see a picture of me and my baby?" as he proceeds to pass a picture around of him with a sub machine gun. Perfectly acceptable though because he's in the army.

[dakyras]

Just bringing this topic back to my original rant about stupid people.

One of these army folks was telling me during this night out about how he had to to delete his facebook page because, and again I quote "Facebook ruins lives." Lo and behold, less than a month later his facebook page has been reactivated.

I deleted him as soon as I saw him.

[llcoolphil]

.....a well educated society you're creating across all economic stratifications.

Edited January 17, 2011 by llcoolphil

[rachbon]

That rather f**ks up any opportunities the less well educated might have had

[worm]

That rather f**ks up any opportunities the less well educated might have had.

Edited January 17, 2011 by worm

[llcoolphil]

Clearly not if, as you suggest, degrees count for shit in terms of jobs.

One minute it's too many people educated for jobs, the next it's the less well educated being without opportunities.