The Sun wants us to grass on our scrounging neighbours :)

[oafc0000]

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/features/3091717/The-Sun-declares-war-on-Britains-benefits-culture.html

Found the article pretty funny...

Me thinks they can both expect their JSA to be cut etc...

Chris quit his job and neither are interested in finding a job... How f**king stupid can they be... He must of lied when claiming surely Reckon they can expect a visit

[minute5072]

hard-working Sun readers

[Alcatraz]

The scary thing is, David Cameron has publicly come out in support of it

[sifi]

Oaf, I know that it was suggested that you consider sources other than your diet of reality television on which to base your arguments, but I don't think the Sun is neccessarily the way to go ....

[eFestivals]

In about 1980, there was a TV programme about similar "benefit scum" (it might have been Panorama, tho might have been another similar documentary programme, I forget now).

Anyway, people watching it back today would be rather surprised to recognise the main 'example' of these 'benefit scum' used in the programme - he goes by the name of Danny Baker (yes, that one). He was paid to act as a benefit claimant and present made-up bollox of how great his life was on the dole.

It's from this faked programme that much of the myth of dole scroungers has been developed.

Edited August 13, 2010 by eFestivals

[oafc0000]

Oaf, I know that it was suggested that you consider sources other than your diet of reality television on which to base your arguments, but I don't think the Sun is neccessarily the way to go ....

[oafc0000]

It's from this faked programme that much of the myth of dole scroungers has been developed.

Edited August 13, 2010 by oafc0000

[eFestivals]

We can talk all day about the level of the problem but to call it a myth is a bit laughable really...

in the scheme of things its defo a myth - even the Sun's campaign makes that clear is your brain is switched on.

80% of the benefits 'loss' is not down to "scroungers" at all, but is the result of govt administrative incompetence.

And against the £1Bn or so which is down to fraud needs to be balanced the amount of unclaimed benefits - which means that if the Scum means all that they say and their campaign has the desired result, the result of their campaign is a huge extra cost to the country in extra benefit payments and not any saving.

After all, they say "Social security should be a safety net for those in need .... No one begrudges those who genuinely cannot find work despite their best efforts."

[oafc0000]

in the scheme of things its defo a myth

[RABun]

I love how the Sun is up in arms because they got £300 worth of B&Q Vouchers to decorate their house. The council do that when the house is in a state as its cheaper and more time efficient to get people to decorate it themselves than to pay a team of people to do it.

Also they don't explain how they bought the Xbox etc, very unlikely they could pay for it with their benefits so it was probably a present, or bought on credit with an extortionate catalogue or a provi loan. And who's business is it what they spend their money on?

I really don't think £17k a year is very much considering that includes all their rent, council tax, bills, food etc. I would think it very likely that certain bills etc aren't being paid because, the money gets spent down the pub or on fags, rather than the fact that they have too much money in benefit. They do include child benefit in that calculation too which everybody gets whether they are a rich or poor.

Why don't they make child benefit means tested? would that not save a fortune?

[sifi]

Why don't they make child benefit means tested? would that not save a fortune?

[oafc0000]

Why don't they make child benefit means tested? would that not save a fortune?

Edited August 13, 2010 by oafc0000

[oafc0000]

And I think it's telling - that both parents have to go out to work these days.

[sifi]

We certainly have no choice if we want to keep this house and have holidays together etc...

[oafc0000]

Right - and I can't imagine your lifestyle is particularly extravagent.

[eFestivals]

Why don't they make child benefit means tested? would that not save a fortune?

Nope, it wouldn't.

The costs of administering the means testing would outweigh any savings. This is long established.

[eFestivals]

It would

not correct I'm afraid.

The costs of administering the means testing would outweigh any savings. This is long established.

[oafc0000]

Nope, it wouldn't.

The costs of administering the means testing would outweigh any savings. This is long established.

[sifi]

not correct I'm afraid.

The costs of administering the means testing would outweigh any savings. This is long established.

[Steve P]

Also they don't explain how they bought the Xbox etc, very unlikely they could pay for it with their benefits so it was probably a present, or bought on credit with an extortionate catalogue or a provi loan. And who's business is it what they spend their money on?

[eFestivals]

I thought it could be fairly easily applied using a tax code deduction at source, or something like that.

that's not means testing tho - that's only income testing.

Essentially, true means testing would end up being the same thing as exists for tax credits currently - it works on income, and what are considered necessary expenses for a person's situation (living costs, number of kids, etc) against that income.

But if tax credits are to be continued with, then it wouldn't be hugely difficult to merge child benefit into that tax credits system - and that would avoid the costs of means testing for child benefit.

[RABun]

The readers of The Sun, The Mail and The Express of course. The obvious way forward is if you're on benefits is that you don't get any money paid to you, just have utilities bills paid and recieve a food parcel once a week. Surely nobody would think that was unfair

[oafc0000]

i say bring back the workhouse, 2 bowls of gruel a day and us hardworking people would get cheap goods.

[smog]

They probably got a couple of hundred quid from The Sun too. He should get a ps3 \o/

£17k doesnt seem a lot with 2 kids though and its not like he could just walk in to a job at the minute.

Edited August 13, 2010 by smog

[Budweiser]

Also they don't explain how they bought the Xbox etc, very unlikely they could pay for it with their benefits so it was probably a present, or bought on credit with an extortionate catalogue or a provi loan. And who's business is it what they spend their money on?

I really don't think £17k a year is very much considering that includes all their rent, council tax, bills, food etc. I would think it very likely that certain bills etc aren't being paid because, the money gets spent down the pub or on fags, rather than the fact that they have too much money in benefit. They do include child benefit in that calculation too which everybody gets whether they are a rich or poor.

Why don't they make child benefit means tested? would that not save a fortune?