Musical Integrity

[sifi]

Jones wrote the riff to Black Dog.

[The Nal]

Jones wrote the riff to Black Dog.

[ampersand]

Jones wrote the riff to Black Dog.

[ampersand]

it's not a great song (imo). It's a riff with a slightly unusual time signature (that Bonzo had problems with understanding... apparently). I'd love to see someone try and dance to it....

Zep are an intersting case in point. I really like a lot of their stuff, but they fall short of being close to my heart.

[sifi]

Babe I'm gonna leave you is my fave Zep song.

And the rover has the filthiest riff ever recorded.

Edited November 9, 2010 by sifi

[ampersand]

Babe I'm gonna leave you is my face Zep song.

And the rover has the filthiest riff ever recorded.

[The Nal]

Babe I'm gonna leave you is my fave Zep song.

And the rover has the filthiest riff ever recorded.

[sifi]

How many more times is worth a mention.

And all of side two of III

[llcoolphil]

I literally disagree with everything here.

Example (of the thousands I could use) – Rock Bottom by Robert Wyatt. A tough listen but a great album. Was made after he paralysed himself. But if you didn’t know that, the album would sound totally different. So it is important.

Same for John Lennon singing How Do You Sleep (about Paul) but if you didn't know that..... etc etc.

Some music ok to listen to, sounds nice etc and you dont have to dig any deeper, but some music is benefited massively from a deeper knowledge of whats going on.

[ampersand]

Was listening to Physical Graffiti on the way into work. Black Country Woman. Great over taking music!

[llcoolphil]

They are yeah, but Phil was saying that he doesn't need to know the motivation behind the song. I do, as the good stuff usually has a good story behind it.

[The Nal]

Knowing what inspires a song and musical integrity aren't the same thing surely? I can see that a lot of Billy Bragg's early material is set against a background of Thatcher in government. I dont know whether he just wrote those songs to make a few quid or whether he was just singing protest songs though.

[worm]

Musical integrity my arse. It's music. Why does it matter if I know what motivates an artist to do what they do - and why does it matter what his motivation is? If I like what they're doing, I don't need to know why they're doing it. And, as in OLF's example of The Fall above, if I dont like what they're doing, knowing how honest and explorative they're being isn't going to make me like them anymore - a gazillion albums and you couldn't make a single volume greatest hits collection out the lot.

[eFestivals]

Given that your appreciation has absolutely no impact upon the music being consumed

Of course it does.

If there's no appreciation by a person then it's unlikely to be 'consumed' by that person, it is?

[The Nal]

And we're off and running...........

[ampersand]

And we're off and running...........

[RABun]

And we're off and running...........

[worm]

Of course it does.

If there's no appreciation by a person then it's unlikely to be 'consumed' by that person, it is?

[llcoolphil]

I agree, couldn't take them seriously if he wrote them on the back of that just to make money.

[llcoolphil]

I don't expect anything of much depth from James Blunt.

[eFestivals]

So you take him seriously now because he sings protest songs. You really enjoy his music because you love what he stands for and how he expresses that lyrically and musically. Then, on his deathbed, he tells you he's voted tory once or twice in his life.

Does that invalidate all the enjoyment you have had of his music?

Does it invalidate it just a bit because he's only done it once or twice and we're all allowed an odd mistake? And if so, by how much?

Or does it mean that from the point you make the discovery you can't enjoy it anymore, especially given the music is still lyrically and musically identical to that you've been enjoying for 20 years?

It's not music, but....

There's a particular author who I used to love, and read many of his books. I took much of what he was saying as a confirmation of my own views on much of life.

Then I started to read some of his non-fiction books, and discovered that I'd taken him completely wrongly, and he was making Hitler look like a Marxist in comparison.

Has it spoilt my enjoyment of the writings of his that I'd enjoyed so much? You can be damned sure it has, because I can no longer view his words as I used to despite them being the same words that I'd previously enjoyed. The meaning I took from his words that gave me that enjoyment has gone.

I wouldn't think that things are any different with anyone's relationship with music. The enjoyment is gained thru what it means to you, and if it suddenly means something different because you know more about the artist, then the appreciation you have of that art is also different.

[llcoolphil]

do you still like all the same music you listened to 10, 15 years ago?

for the same reasons?

[worm]

And as you've said, a big part of why you like your music is nothing to do with the music

[The Nal]

No, not at all. But I cant think of a single occassion where the integrity of the artist has anything to do with it. My enjoyment of music isn't affected by what motivates someone to make the music I enjoy. Especially given that what we know through a marketing team and what is really the truth may very much not be the same thing.

[ampersand]

it's like the old gary glitter point. do i enjoy christmas rock and roll any less cos we know he's a paedophile? of course not, it's the same bloody song.