PEARL JAM

[Cultseeker]

but nirvana (mores the shame) not pearl jam made grunge commerical.

[pogal]

You really are being simple mate.

I think they all added to the movement of grunge. And Louder Than Love was a HUUUUUUUUGE help to Nevermind. I have no obsession, I'm just facing the facts. You are the one with an obsession of hailing Nirvana as iconic gods of grunge (just like Kerrang and other ill-informed music rags).

Mevins

Tad

My Sisters Machine

Willard

Grunge Truck

Flipper

Green River

Mother Love Bone

Pearl Jam

Soundgarden

Mudhoney

Alice In Chains

etc etc

A movement. No one singular band. All played their part. No one is valued above another in that respect.

[Olivavu]

All it goes to show is that they were the ones that made it front page.

[thomasowen]

Look at nu metal - nu metal was around, but Limp Bizkit brought it to the masses. Same with modern punk with Green Day, Offspring and later Blink 182

[Olivavu]

are you trying to make me sick. Please dont mention nu-metal or nu-punk when Im around.

[pogal]

are you trying to make me sick. Please dont mention nu-metal or nu-punk when Im around.

[Cultseeker]

I'll still never understand why Deftones have been labelled nu-metal...they're so much better than that.

[Olivavu]

I agree. Far more in common with Soundgarden than Nu-metal. I remember thinking that when I first heard them. Slow, strong and percussion led noise - very UltramegaOK.

[Cultseeker]

All I'm saying is that it's the same point with Nirvana. They did make it easier for every other grunge band because people wanted to hear grunge after Smells Like Teen Spirit, and by God, record companies wanted to promote it and get it out there because it was making money!

Suddenly people are agreeing with me to some extent after the arguing, does that mean I may have expressed a point the way I intended?

[pogal]

I agree. Far more in common with Soundgarden than Nu-metal. I remember thinking that when I first heard them. Slow, strong and percussion led noise - very UltramegaOK.

Pogal - in essence you're of course right about Nirvana. No one disputes their popularity, which has grown over time. But you put it across as a sweeping statement, as if SG and PJ couldn't have made it without Nirvana. Which I absolutely disagree with. Nirvana weren't as big as SG or PJ at the time of release, that took some time to etablish entirely (unless of course you believe Kerrang).

[Cultseeker]

After Nirvana, kids started looking for more like them and found the rest, and yes, they may have thought they were better than Nirvana once they found them (hence Ten selling more in the long term) - but I don't think their importance in spearheading the grunge 'revolution' of mainstream music can be denied.

Edited July 24, 2006 by Cultseeker

[Olivavu]

Green River/Mudhoney - Forming the base and taking it to the Local scene

Soundgarden - Taking it to the rock world

Nirvana - Taking it to the world

Pearl Jam - Taking it around the world

[pogal]

I don't at all like this whole 'spearhead' bit. It was started long before Nirvana. Therefore, Nirvana owed these other bands as they would not have been given this platform. My point is that it is best seen as a communal thing. Green River making the scene happen and shape the community of Seattle as a viable outlet, Soundgarden for being the band with the credentials for picking apart at mainstream rock and shaping an identity for grunge bands, Nirvana for being the mainstream representatives in their simple interpretation of the grunge sound and Pearl Jam for keeping it all alive and taking it beyond its original sound and concept, yet sticking to its integral principles.

Green River/Mudhoney - Forming the base and taking it to the Local scene

Soundgarden - Taking it to the rock world

Nirvana - Taking it to the world

Pearl Jam - Taking it around the world

Each step taking the mainstream stakes that little higher.

It wasn't a Nirvana bandwagon. It really wasn't.

[Olivavu]

They were absolutely massive when grunge broke. It was Guns n Roses vs Nirvana.

[Cultseeker]

What I mean by spearheaded it was that they were the first to achieve the massive mainstream success.

[Olivavu]

As I've said, I'll buy that. Don't think that anyone was ever arguing with that. More people are aware of Pearl Jam now though. Certainly stateside.

I remember it all.

Oh the memories.

Before the dark times.........................Before Oasis.

[pogal]

That's the only point I've ever tried to make!

Badly expressed no doubt, which I apologise for, although it makes perfect sense to me when I write these things...

[Cultseeker]

I didn't mind Oasis when I was a kid. 'Definitely Maybe' was an album I enjoyed. I don't care much for it at all now...I find them to be one of the most limited, overrated bands ever...still, they piss all over Cold-f**king-play...

[deutsche Harru]

I remember the first time I heard of pearl jam - it was on wayne's world 2. Oh yes

[pogal]

Oasis was a reference to the avalange of sh*te Brit-pop that took precedence over decent rock music in the British press during the mid to late 90's and beyond. Something that still bothers me.

Edited July 24, 2006 by pogal

[Olivavu]

I remember the first time I heard of pearl jam - it was on wayne's world 2. Oh yes

[Cultseeker]

Oasis were definitely Britpop's Nirvana...

[pogal]

"Aerosmith and Pearl Jam!"

Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaargh!!!!

They're awful!!!

Don't be foolish...see them for the overbloated pile of w*nk that they are!!

Please...before it's too late and you fall into the realms of bad taste!!

...and taste doesn't get much worse than Coldplay!

[Olivavu]

Well, I have to disagree with you - they really did put on a fantastic show at Glastonbury, even though I expected it to be awful. I certainly enjoyed it far more than the White Stripes' set, which I was looking forward to.

As far as "bad taste" goes, I am by no means a fan of Coldplay, it's really not my thing. But I don't think someone who likes them necessarily has bad taste, I can see their appeal, it just doesn't do it for me.

[Paulaviki]

Well, I have to disagree with you - they really did put on a fantastic show at Glastonbury, even though I expected it to be awful. I certainly enjoyed it far more than the White Stripes' set, which I was looking forward to.