JBarbour
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Posts posted by JBarbour
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This forum has gone mad. Like all of a sudden its OK to force yourself on women and attack people. Like I shouldn't have an opinion on that matter or call it out.
18 minutes ago, dentalplan said:Slowthai didn't 'force himself on' Katherine Ryan. It was a poor joke that went even more sour when traded from a comedian to a drunk rapper. Read a report from someone who was there.
Absolutely no need to call someone a 'scumbag' and accuse them of normalising rape culture for using the words of the people involved and the people who were there to outline how that incident was completely different to the actions of Die Antwoord.
To try and justify someones scumbag behaviour is a scumbag thing to do. I was the one calling out DA, whereas a number of others including @Andre91 where happy for the scumbags to be on the line up as their art should be separated from their wrong-doings apparently.
21 minutes ago, Andre91 said:Maybe the topic is something that you should take the time to look into. You might learn something, which is always good.
So if I learn about it, it makes all this OK?
19 minutes ago, ace56blaa said:I really admire you morals and conviction, I don't want to anyway suggest your wrong to be mad at Slowthai. But am Slightly upset that you are trying to suggest i am normalizing rape culture, when i didn't condone anything slowthai did, I didn't suggest in anyway it was normal. I said you or anyone else had the right to still be angry. - I tried to be measured and calm in my arguments, bringing in statements from Katherine Ryan, I'm sorry if you think I should disregard everythings she's saying because you assume it is to protect slowthai when she has no reason to protect slowthai. I believe her in the situation, but also acknowledge that even though she was victim her forgiveness doesn't mean anyone else has to.
"Katherine Ryan wants fans to uncancel Slowthai after he harassed her on stage at last year’s NME Awards, confessing she was worried about him amid the backlash he received."
"She was also accused of normalising sexual harassment."
"After the event, she said she felt “motherly concern” towards the rapper and “regret” about the potential effects of the exchange on his career. "
https://www.nme.com/features/tv-interviews/katherine-ryan-the-duchess-netflix-nme-awards-2747971
“I’m vehemently against ‘cancel culture’”
“It didn’t bother me but it was very difficult to watch as a feminist,”
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Just now, atomised said:
3 pages about a festival nobody was particularly interested in
And only a few posts about the actual festival. The rest are people discussing the positive and negatives of rape culture it would seem. This forum is just weird lately. 😂
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Just now, Andre91 said:
You didn’t answer my question. Do you believe in prison rehabilitation?
I'm not an expert in that field, I'm not sure what how to rehabilitate, re-educate abusers and scumbags.
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7 minutes ago, Andre91 said:
I’m guessing that the idea of prison rehabilitation is a no-go for you?
Slowthai‘s isolated incident was a disgrace, of course, but it isn’t like he has said that he did nothing wrong or laughed it off. He has seemingly apologised sincerely and addressed his behaviour, understood how damaging that kind of behaviour is and wants to make an effort to learn from it and better himself. He has also clearly communicated with Katherine Ryan who has also forgiven him for his actions.
Are people not supposed to learn and grow from their misdemeanours?
So we should just forget about all the bad things people have done?
I am not allowed to comment on it or have an opinion on the matter?
Should it be normal to force yourself on women, attack people and then apologise?
I'm not a fan of cancel culture but I also not a fan of people just shrugging things off. People can call other people out for their shitty behaviour and attitudes.
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1 minute ago, ace56blaa said:
Okay so your argument is just gonna vague points with no evidence? - This type of discussion requires nuance and you just keep throwing around unbacked up statements. - I don't think this is a case of someone getting away for something because it is societal norms. - I think you have to let people make mistakes (within reason) and learn from them and apologize, show that they've changed. There doesn't seem to be any pattern of behaviour here?
The situation itself seems to be more complicated than it seems, I believe Katherine Ryan is telling the truth when she says there is more context, I don't believe she'd have any reason to try and protect him, "didn't want him to self destruct" seems like weird speculation to make when all indications show that Katherine Ryan is a no holds bar comedian who doesn't hold back and I doubt would do so to protect a male ego?
I'm not saying you have to forgive or like him, but to suggest festivals should stop booking him for it seems an overreaction that suggests that we can't let people grow or change. - They same way people should be allowed to apologize for bad old tweets and grow from them.
I don't think someone should be given the benefit of the doubt or given a second chance if the situation is as serious as die Antwoord who show a pattern of behaviour, no indication of an apology and actual full on crimes commited and gotten away with.
What are you even talking about?
You are trying to normalise rape culture? It's OK to try and force yourself on women, then attract someone that calls him out for his actions, and then just apologise the next day? You sound like a bit of a scumbag.
It's all on video like with DA, go and watch it again. Then come back here and says that's OK.
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1 minute ago, ace56blaa said:
Um, that doesn't answer my question, I agree that Slowthai was an arsehole for what he did. But if it was one isolated incident and this is what Katherine Ryan has to say about the incident:
‘People are quick to judge a situation they didn’t see first-hand,’ she said. ‘When we take little clips of something and put them on the internet, it can easily be taken out of context.’
She added: ‘I really admire Slowthai and think that situation was missing a lot of nuances once it got on social media. ‘I was in a performative position where I was almost playing a character of myself. I was being a stand-up comedian. He was in a performative position where he was being a rock star. ‘It was like a pantomime and it’s very different if that interaction had taken place at a bus stop. It’s a show. It’s all about the comedy of that night, and I think people took it the wrong way.’
- I don't think Katherine Ryan is the be all and end all on whether the actions should be forgiven or not, but I don't agree that anyone should be deemed a lowlife when they make a isolated mistake like this, especially if they apologize and learn from the situation. - I've seen nothing else from slowthai that seems to suggest he is like this beyond these events.
But if you have actual conversation to add to topic beyond the simply un backed up statement "he's a raging left that like to try and force himself on women" I wanna hear it, If I'm wrong and there's anything else out there about Slowthai, i retract my statements,
She responding in that way because she didn't want him to self destruct, he's a young lad and the world had just seen how he treats women when he's had a few beers, then gets aggressive with anyone that called him out.
He was getting hammered for it on social media, but she was also getting abuse from the fan boys and girls.
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This is a great advertising tool for the ALT LDN promoters, wondering if we helping sell many tickets with this discussion 😄
@eFestivalsmaybe this thread needs nuking
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2 minutes ago, ace56blaa said:
Again, is there more Slowthai stuff beyond the NME awards. Which he apologized for which seemed sincere. ?
I don't wanna minimize his actions, but neither did he, there's the difference he took accountability and learned from it. ? Die Antwoord flat out deny the accusations despite the evidence. -
He's a raging lefty that likes to try and force himself on women
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15 minutes ago, thewayiam said:
I also find it crazy that people can be so happy with Slowthai on lineups. Another low life scumbag
What a lowlife he is. How quick the industry forgets, but gotta fill up these cock fest line ups some how. Bookers forget women on line ups but all about them rapey acts. DA takes the prize for worse booking of this year though.
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16 minutes ago, Newjem said:
Because I don't get it then... is Michael Jackson ok for you or not? Because so many artists got accused of so many horrible things and some of it is taken seriously and some of it isn't which is quite confusing for me.
The problem of black face is complicated. Each culture/nation have a different approach. It's obviously considered racist in the US and UK but I live in a country where you could see black face in one of the prime time TV shows until quite recently (its a show where singers and actors impersonate other famous singers including African Americans) and noone considered it racist over here. That's because we've never used slaves, had colonies or seperated people of colour from white majority. But back to Die Antwoord... they did the black face quite a long time ago. If people didn't care back then why would they care now?
How many times do we have to go over this?
This thread is about ALT LDN that booked the band. I have no opinion on other acts at the moment and I have already stated any act that is an arse hole shouldn't be booked for festivals.
This thread is like rape culture. It's OK because it's the norm? Let's compare the band to every other act that's done something wrong? Should we be booking any lowlife just because its been normalised due to societal attitudes?
I can see you are finding this difficult to grasp.
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3 minutes ago, Newjem said:
If you're using this logic... did DA get convicted for anything you've mentioned so far? Besides the homophobic part of course because there's a video.
They are on video being homophobic and have done music videos in black face. Ffs. Isn't that enough? Then accusations on top of all the other shit.
Why are people defending this? I really don't get it.
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1 hour ago, foolee said:
Does anyone on this thread like or still listen to Michael Jackson?
Why is he booked for a festival?
Have you seen the list of things DA have done and been accused of? They are disgusting people.
Now I'm no MJ fan but did he get convicted?
This forum/website has hit new lows. The Glastonbury section is bad enough.
it's OK to support abusers because there are other abusers?
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3 minutes ago, Newjem said:
I used to be a fan (like 5-6 years ago), now I don't care really.
But why don't you (and other artists) mention Playboi Carti then? He's on the lineup as well. He was arrested for domestic abuse, assaulted a driver in Scotland and last year arrested for carrying drugs and weapons. He's OK?
He's another arsehole then! Maybe this whole shitty event should be cancelled.
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20 minutes ago, Newjem said:
I'm not defending them. My point is that lots of them are still being booked for gigs and festivals or getting at the top of the charts but you only trash talk about Die Antwoord. Also if all these things about them are true, shouldn't they be like in prison or something? These are quite serious offences...
I don't know if you noticed but this thread is about a festival DA have been booked for and artists are coming out asking the organisers to reconsider their booking. Do I have to list every act that ever done anything wrong every time I mention them?
Maybe do a quick google search?
Trash talking? How else should I speak about the racist, homophobic, abusers? You sound like a closet fanboy.
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4 minutes ago, Newjem said:
Well, you're way too specific and yes, that's what DA have done and it should destroy their careers. And yes, it seems like half of the industry did some shit - abuse, rape or other crimes like drug dealing, carrying weapons, robbery... Some of them only got accused of it, for some there is evidence. Some of them are forgotten, some of them got away with it and are praised even today by fans and mainstream media. And these are often role models for teenagers.
I can make a list for you if you want...
I don't get your point. You are going to defend abusers by listing other abusers? None of these people should be on festival line ups or being booked for gigs.
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8 minutes ago, Newjem said:
Nowadays it seems like half of the industry have done some shit in their past. If I used your logic, I wouldn't be able to enjoy music at all these days.
Most the industry trafficking woman and abusing them because they look like their daughter? Grooming teenage boys? Being homophobic to other artists? Doing black face in music videos?
I don't see a whole lot of that going on, especially from one group, do you?
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14 minutes ago, Andre91 said:
I said I would go and see them at a festival, not that I would pay to see them at their own show. I certainly wouldn’t purchase any of their music physically. I know that streaming obviously is a financial contribution but it is minimal compared to tickets, merch and physical copies of their work.
It’s the same for other artists I like, Brand New for example. I’ve already got my physical copies, I won’t buy any more. I chucked my t-shirt away when the stuff about him came out.
If their ideology doesn’t pervade their music, I’m usually alright listening to them. I’m not listening to Screwdriver or some NSBM band. I still listen to Down and Pantera regularly despite thinking Phil is a piece of shit for his racist beliefs. Again, I’m not buying anything other than streaming. I’ve got my vinyls already.
I think your initial response was purposely snarcy and you could have just said what you have above initially. Separating the art from the artist is a contentious topic but both sides of the argument are valid.
I don't beat around the bush. I'm straight in for the kill, or snarky as you call it! 😆
I get people liking music and maybe being naive to someones personal life, but its well documented with these two arseholes. Its shameful for the likes of Live Nation to be booking them when they already get flak for their pale and male line ups.
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2 minutes ago, Andre91 said:
Choosing not to listen to an artist because of events surrounding them is absolutely. Choosing to still listen to their music is also absolutely fine. Don’t be an arse about it.
You can do whatever you want. You are however enabling these abusers, racists and homophobes by supporting them. So if that's what you feel comfortable with crack on.
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3 hours ago, Andre91 said:
I can listen to their music just fine and would absolutely go and see them at a festival.
You into Gary Glitter and watching reruns of Jimmy Savile hosting TOTP? Still into Lost Prophets?
Don't mind a bit of racism and homophobic behaviour?
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4 minutes ago, efcfanwirral said:
The problem is you don't really hear of this happening to other festivals - they seem to be able to cope with wind and rain...
When the weather becomes extreme no British festival can cope tbf. I've been to Glastonbury when stages had to shut down on a couple of occasions. Boardmasters got fully cancelled in 2019. Boomtown carried on the same year but the first day was ropey with stages being blown on to festival goers and had to put the acts on smaller stages. Been to Leeds where they have cancelled all the late night entertainment because of rain. IOW has had issues over the years.
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2 minutes ago, Zebes said:
Cheers for that!
Looking at where the car parks are it's still going to be a fair trek for some. Not me though, campervan field now at my age 😂
Yeah the car park to some camp sites looks a bit of a ball-ache especially if its bad weather. Looks like have to walk through or at the side of the arena. Suppose its not Glasto / Boomtown massive so won't be much of an issue.
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1 minute ago, Zebes said:
Are these plans available to view online somewhere? Sounds like a good idea anyway. It should cut down the walk from the car parks to the campsites quite a bit
https://www.derbyshiredales.gov.uk/images/Y/Plans_of_site_layout_and_licensed_area.pdf
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6 minutes ago, Zebes said:
I've heard talk of them returning to the old site but using some of the fields on the current site for parking
Just had a look at the plans. It looks like they are using 50/50 old site and new site. Straddling between them. Car parking and half the camping in the new site they took on in 2018. Arena and other half of camping in the old site pre 2017. Considering the capacity is 10k less that might reduce the amount of space they actually end up using.
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6 minutes ago, efcfanwirral said:
And...a general question for who went in 2018 and 2019. My last time was that fateful year in 2017, what's changed? Does anyone know what measures have been put in place to avoid such a catastrophic situation where bands cancel and we get sent home because it rains?
They changed sites. More drainage has been put in.
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ALT LDN
in other UK festivals
Posted
😆 OK enabler