Bob Vylan Chants

[Skip997]

1 minute ago, danbailey80 said:

 

 

This would likely be the problem the Eavis' had being pacifists etc. 

 

 

Emily used the antisemitism card, completely incorrectly and inappropriately. Far from helping, it’s actually inflaming the situation 

[DeanoL]

7 minutes ago, The_Fish said:

 

What happens to the Jews in israel if there is no IDF?

You set up a new defensive organisation actually focused on defence? 

 

One could argue that you just need to reform the IDF, but at some point when an organisation has committed so many atrocities you have to wipe it clean and start again. 

 

Like after WW2 the existing German army was disbanded and a new one set up.

[gizmoman]

6 minutes ago, danbailey80 said:

For a lot of people I've discussed It with, they simply wish he'd said something like 'Stop' or 'f**k the IDF'. not 'Kill'. This is their only issue and. they def hate the IDF. They know it's not anti jew. It's just the whole 'killing' thing.

 

This would likely be the problem the Eavis' had being pacifists etc. 

 

 

I watched it live, seen them a couple of times before so knew what to expect, he kept the message at an "acceptable" tone throughout much of the set, but did mention being live on the BBC a couple of times, he only made the "kill the IDF" and "from the river to the sea" comments towards the end of the set, ensuring they wouldn't get cut off early. In my view it was a deliberate act to get the most publicity, justifiable if you want to raise awareness I suppose but it has backfired, would have been better to keep it at a reasonable level. "no more genocide", "justice for Palestine", that kind of thing. 

[steviewevie]

6 minutes ago, DeanoL said:

You set up a new defensive organisation actually focused on defence? 

 

One could argue that you just need to reform the IDF, but at some point when an organisation has committed so many atrocities you have to wipe it clean and start again. 

 

Like after WW2 the existing German army was disbanded and a new one set up.

Israel's method has always been to attack first as part of defence...pre-emptive...wipe out any threat. It's worked well for them so far as they are still there and have a lot more land than they had under the original partition. Trouble is...it doesn't really look like defence..it just looks like they are attacking their neighbours and destroying Palestinians....because that is what it is.

[lazyred]

45 minutes ago, DeanoL said:

No one condemned the murder of Jo Cox on stage either at the weekend. Or the behaviour of Russell Brand. 

And no one called for the hostages release. This is also an ongoing war crime.

[Superscally]

58 minutes ago, lazyred said:

How much of Gaza is destroyed is down to how long Hamas keep going.

 

Sadly, you're right, because the world won't grow a pair and stop Israel. 

[Superscally]

19 minutes ago, DeanoL said:

You set up a new defensive organisation actually focused on defence? 

 

One could argue that you just need to reform the IDF, but at some point when an organisation has committed so many atrocities you have to wipe it clean and start again. 

 

Like after WW2 the existing German army was disbanded and a new one set up.

This.

[The_Fish]

15 minutes ago, DeanoL said:

You set up a new defensive organisation actually focused on defence? 

 

One could argue that you just need to reform the IDF, but at some point when an organisation has committed so many atrocities you have to wipe it clean and start again. 

 

Like after WW2 the existing German army was disbanded and a new one set up.

 

That's a lot more convulated than came be shouted in chants. Death to the IDF has a consequence of millions of dead Jews in israel. That's why it's a lot more offensive than chanting 'Free Palestine' or 'End the Genocide' etc. 

[steviewevie]

21 minutes ago, DeanoL said:

You set up a new defensive organisation actually focused on defence? 

 

One could argue that you just need to reform the IDF, but at some point when an organisation has committed so many atrocities you have to wipe it clean and start again. 

 

Like after WW2 the existing German army was disbanded and a new one set up.

I mean...Germany just got filled up with US forces and nukes on one side and Russian ones on the other.

Maybe they could do something similar.

You have to remember that there are still groups/countries in that region that do not recognise Israel and want it gone.

 

[Superscally]

5 minutes ago, lazyred said:

And no one called for the hostages release. This is also an ongoing war crime.

I did. So did a lot of people. This issue is that the Israeli government are happy for them to die. They are only one step less expendable to them as the prisoners of the Russian state sent to be in the meat grinder assaults. They are the excuse. Like the Jordanian foreign minister said, the Arab world has a plan for peace. Could the Israeli government clearly demonstrate theirs please?

 

Just now, The_Fish said:

 

That's a lot more convulated than came be shouted in chants. Death to the IDF has a consequence of millions of dead Jews in israel. That's why it's a lot more offensive than chanting 'Free Palestine' or 'End the Genocide' etc. 

That is not the consequence. Were the Tory party memos quoting "Death to the Labour Party" calling for the murder of MPs and activists? 

[steviewevie]

Maybe there should be an international intervention...UN/western/Arab/Turkish troops in there to police that border and help set up and administer a Palestinian state...but that would take the UN actually doing something.

[danbailey80]

31 minutes ago, Skip997 said:

Emily used the antisemitism card, completely incorrectly and inappropriately. Far from helping, it’s actually inflaming the situation 

Yes I agree. But I’d maybe Glastonbury festivals not just Emily. Having reread their statement they did not need to say antisemitism at all. 

[Blisterpack]

2 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

Maybe there should be an international intervention...UN/western/Arab/Turkish troops in there to police that border and help set up and administer a Palestinian state...but that would take the UN actually doing something.

That was not a million miles away from what the Oslo accord would have delivered. Arafat was up for it but was pressured by his hardliners (and Iran) to reject.

[steviewevie]

1 minute ago, Blisterpack said:

That was not a million miles away from what the Oslo accord would have delivered. Arafat was up for it but was pressured by his hardliners (and Iran) to reject.

extremists on both sides were against it...and now they're in charge.

[The_Fish]

7 minutes ago, Superscally said:

That is not the consequence. Were the Tory party memos quoting "Death to the Labour Party" calling for the murder of MPs and activists? 

 

Israel is surrounded by enemies, if they have no defence then they will be invaded and brutally murdered.

 

A Tory memo saying "death to the labour party" would more likely have had a consequence of the death of democracy in the UK, at least in the short term whilst other parties tried to find support. Not sure how that's relevant though.

[Superscally]

4 minutes ago, The_Fish said:

 

Israel is surrounded by enemies, if they have no defence then they will be invaded and brutally murdered.

 

A Tory memo saying "death to the labour party" would more likely have had a consequence of the death of democracy in the UK, at least in the short term whilst other parties tried to find support. Not sure how that's relevant though.

They can have a defence force, but either the current leaders are rotten or the majority of it is. Like has been said, Germany had to start from scratch. In the short term, there could be peacekeepers and if Israel agreed to a fair two nation solution, the enemies would wither. Israel is a spoilt brat and needs some grown ups to tell it how to behave or suffer the consequences.

 

The second point is relevant because your point was completely irrelevant as Bob wasn't calling for the death of hundreds of thousands of people either. 

 

Edited July 2, 2025 by Superscally

[lazyred]

57 minutes ago, DeanoL said:

Okay. And how do you identify Hamas? They're not an army, they don't wear uniforms. So if you want to invade Gaza and take out Hamas, there's only one way to actually be sure you've done that, and that is to kill every single person living there. Because any of them could be Hamas.

 

I'd argue that is genocidal intent, even by your definition.

They are/were the governing authority in Gaza. They are the ones attacking Isreali troops and holding hostages and executing the brave Palestinians who oppose them.

[Blisterpack]

3 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

extremists on both sides were against it...and now they're in charge.

True, though Yitzhak Rabin did get it through on the Israeli side despite the opposition. I do think you are right though, international pressure - especially now from the very influential Arab nations - will end all this. They need to be more proactive though. 

[The_Fish]

1 minute ago, Superscally said:

The second point is relevant because your point was completely irrelevant as Bob wasn't calling for the death of hundreds of thousands of people either. 

 

He was calling for the death of it's defence forces which has a consequence of millions of dead Jews.

 

It's different to condemning their actions (some of which are horrific and completely indefensible). 

[Superscally]

1 minute ago, lazyred said:

They are/were the governing authority in Gaza. They are the ones attacking Isreali troops and holding hostages and executing the brave Palestinians who oppose them.

...and controlling the narrative inside Gaza. Hamas are bastards full stop. Maybe "D**** to Hamas" as well in whatever form that takes? Even Hitler knew when they were beat, though he took the shithouse way out. I genuinely would like to know Hamas' ideal endgame now more than Israeli government's as that seems very clear already.

[Blisterpack]

4 minutes ago, Superscally said:

They can have a defence force, but either the current leaders are rotten or the majority of it is. Like has been said, Germany had to start from scratch. In the short term, there could be peacekeepers and if Israel agreed to a fair two nation solution, the enemies would wither. Israel is a spoilt brat and needs some grown ups to tell it how to behave or suffer the consequences.

 

The second point is relevant because your point was completely irrelevant as Bob wasn't calling for the death of hundreds of thousands of people either. 

 

Israel has agreed to a series of two state solutions. Got them nowhere. 

[Skip997]

2 minutes ago, Blisterpack said:

Israel has agreed to a series of two state solutions. Got them nowhere. 

When? Have you got evidence? 
 

My memory is of Israel disagreeing to any two state solutions 

[Superscally]

2 minutes ago, The_Fish said:

 

He was calling for the death of it's defence forces which has a consequence of millions of dead Jews.

 

It's different to condemning their actions (some of which are horrific and completely indefensible). 

You know that's not what he was actually calling for. Death to an organisation is not the death of individuals within. Complete and utter bollocks. He has himself said that.

1 minute ago, Blisterpack said:

Israel has agreed to a series of two state solutions. Got them nowhere. 

Based on their interpretations of what is fair, NOT what the WORLD (who gave them the land, or should I say, stole the land) thinks is fair. If I say you can have a piece of cake and then you stick your finger in another slice and say "mine now", you know that's not cool, right? 

[steviewevie]

4 minutes ago, Blisterpack said:

True, though Yitzhak Rabin did get it through on the Israeli side despite the opposition. I do think you are right though, international pressure - especially now from the very influential Arab nations - will end all this. They need to be more proactive though. 

I expect because it's a mess and an inferno and they don't want to go near it.

It all still seems to come down to the US to do the heavy lifting, with Qatar and Egypt playing mediators.

[BobMahelp]

Other festivals are removing Bob Vylan off the lineup. I don’t agree with his comments at all but I f**king hate cancel culture.