Sustainability of the Festival?

[BenG92]

10 minutes ago, willgooneday said:

The festival needs to show it's moved on from those days - book Pearl Jam (who expressed an interest a few years ago iirc and probably would do it)  as a headliner and have it go down well any you open a door for your Foos etc. 

You can also pay Pearl Jam to play a 2 hour show, put them on a bit early, and Eddie will probably give you a free extra half an hour just because he's mad for it. Pixies on below them because that's the go-to and if Smashing Pumpkins can sub Download, Pixies sure as hell can.

[Andre91]

16 minutes ago, willgooneday said:

I can't see MCR ever playing Download again - yes 2007 is a long time ago but.

I think they absolutely will. They’d get a hero’s welcome these days if the Doghouse this year was anything to go by. Thousands of people each night lost their shit whenever anything by them came on. 

[willgooneday]

5 minutes ago, Andre91 said:

I think they absolutely will. They’d get a hero’s welcome these days if the Doghouse this year was anything to go by. Thousands of people each night lost their shit whenever anything by them came on. 

But i doubt they know that unless Gerard Way was there this year. He is in the country so maybe? There over-arching memory is going to be having bottles hurled at them. The fact they've done arenas this year kinda confirms that to me. 

[BenG92]

They DESPERATELY need to tap into that 2000s emo/punk kid market. There's so much on offer. MCR, P!ATD, Paramore, Fallout Boy, Avril, The Used etc. P!ATD are selling £108 floor tickets at arenas right now.

3 minutes ago, willgooneday said:

But i doubt they know that unless Gerard Way was there this year. He is in the country so maybe? There over-arching memory is going to be having bottles hurled at them. The fact they've done arenas this year kinda confirms that to me. 

Sure but that was a hell of a long time ago. Panic got bottled at Reading 2006 and came back to play 3 times since, once as a co-headline with Kendrick Lamar. 

[NorthernSoul52]

23 minutes ago, BenG92 said:

They DESPERATELY need to tap into that 2000s emo/punk kid market. There's so much on offer. MCR, P!ATD, Paramore, Fallout Boy, Avril, The Used etc. P!ATD are selling £108 floor tickets at arenas right now.

Sure but that was a hell of a long time ago. Panic got bottled at Reading 2006 and came back to play 3 times since, once as a co-headline with Kendrick Lamar. 

Bang on the money. Also, to be honest, feel the MCR reunion setlists have teetered towards the heavier side of things so far too. Was at the third night of Milton Keynes and they sounded crunchy when it came to the riffs. (They have also studiously avoided Sing, Planetary (GO!), I Don't Love You - arguably among their pop-orientated singles - in favour of harder album cuts, to a point.)

Feel you could easily throw up a ninety-minute MCR set that would thrill the clientele. I'm less sure about Panic! At the Disco's pull at Download, for example - feel they've gone a little too far in the pop direction in MCR's absence, and that they possibly wouldn't have the depth of pop-punk pulling power that Fall Out Boy might have - but that's more personal opinion than (this is) gospel.

[willgooneday]

12 minutes ago, NorthernSoul52 said:

Bang on the money. Also, to be honest, feel the MCR reunion setlists have teetered towards the heavier side of things so far too. Was at the third night of Milton Keynes and they sounded crunchy when it came to the riffs. (They have also studiously avoided Sing, Planetary (GO!), I Don't Love You - arguably among their pop-orientated singles - in favour of harder album cuts, to a point.)

Feel you could easily throw up a ninety-minute MCR set that would thrill the clientele. I'm less sure about Panic! At the Disco's pull at Download, for example - feel they've gone a little too far in the pop direction in MCR's absence, and that they possibly wouldn't have the depth of pop-punk pulling power that Fall Out Boy might have - but that's more personal opinion than (this is) gospel.

P!ATD have had a huge line up change and are essentially a pop band these days. being just Brandon's latest obsession stylistically. The first two 'solo' albums wouldn't have gone down well at Download but the new one sounds more likely there old stuff from the first single. 

 

[Spiral_Low]

43 minutes ago, BenG92 said:

They DESPERATELY need to tap into that 2000s emo/punk kid market. There's so much on offer. MCR, P!ATD, Paramore, Fallout Boy, Avril, The Used etc. P!ATD are selling £108 floor tickets at arenas right now.

Sure but that was a hell of a long time ago. Panic got bottled at Reading 2006 and came back to play 3 times since, once as a co-headline with Kendrick Lamar. 

As you point out yourself Panic are a big Reading/Leeds band now. If there's already a festival catering for that then why bring it into Download, which caters for the harder rock and metal side of things? In fact Reading and Leeds stopped catering for the Download goers (the odd band like RATM aside) quite some time ago....I don't really get why people want Download to turn into another version of it.

[Andre91]

51 minutes ago, willgooneday said:

But i doubt they know that unless Gerard Way was there this year. He is in the country so maybe? There over-arching memory is going to be having bottles hurled at them. The fact they've done arenas this year kinda confirms that to me. 

Copping said on a podcast last year that he had offered MCR to headline as part of their reunion but they couldn’t make it happen, which I assume is due to them doing their own shows. 

[Andre91]

Panic aren’t coming near Download. They’re an R&L headline band now. Yeah, their older stuff fits DL well but they are a pop band now (and much better for it). 

[NorthernSoul52]

1 hour ago, Andre91 said:

Copping said on a podcast last year that he had offered MCR to headline as part of their reunion but they couldn’t make it happen, which I assume is due to them doing their own shows. 

That is interesting. If the case, would potentially suggest they are open to it once the initial reunion run this year is cleared.

Starting to think it might be worth nailing them into the "likely" category for next year.

[gabrielomachado]

Hellfest only got NIN because they let Trent curate the lineup with bands that appealed to their music, i would lose my mind if Download did the same

something like: NINE INCH NAILS / Placebo / Rob Zombie / Ministry / Killing Joke / Skynd / Health

[beetchez]

Could P!ATD or Paramore be a sub for MCR? Or are they considered "headline or nothing"? You could have an "emo" day while the remaining days are standard Download.

MCR / P!ATD / Bright Eyes / Alexisonfire / Pierce The Veil / The Used / Badflower

 

Other days are BMTH, A7X, Metallica (hopefully just once).

Edited June 29, 2022 by beetchez

[beetchez]

The "Where's SOAD?", "Off to Bloodstock then" crowd would no doubt hate it.

[gabrielomachado]

18 minutes ago, beetchez said:

The "Where's SOAD?", "Off to Bloodstock then" crowd would no doubt hate it.

really don't see that friday happening but i would absolutely love it. there' s a strong emo revival happening right now and Download should ride that wave. Put MCR to headline, Paramore to sub (if it's possible) maybe even Yungblud to 3rd down

[Andre91]

5 hours ago, beetchez said:

Could P!ATD or Paramore be a sub for MCR? Or are they considered "headline or nothing"? You could have an "emo" day while the remaining days are standard Download.

MCR / P!ATD / Bright Eyes / Alexisonfire / Pierce The Veil / The Used / Badflower

 

Other days are BMTH, A7X, Metallica (hopefully just once).

Both headline or nothing. Massive, massive bands. 

[NorthernSoul52]

5 hours ago, gabrielomachado said:

really don't see that friday happening but i would absolutely love it. there' s a strong emo revival happening right now and Download should ride that wave. Put MCR to headline, Paramore to sub (if it's possible) maybe even Yungblud to 3rd down

I like this. I like this very much. 

[Andre91]

Paramore’s return will be just as big as MCR’s. 

[BenG92]

Yeah, Panic are probably a bad example then as they're far too big to sub now and they'd have to do a specifically old school setlist to make the emo revival lineup work. Maybe it's the same with Paramore if they're only playing a few older songs at the moment, I dunno, haven't kept up with them but I know they're big. MCR can do it though.

That day festival in Vegas is absolutely bonkers. Yes, it's £266 but it's in Vegas and you get MCR, Paramore, BMTH, Avril, ADTR, Bright Eyes and a few dozen more. 

[jump]

13 hours ago, justanothername said:

A big thing that sticks in my mind is why go to Download over any other of its competitors? For metal you've got Bloodstock, for fresh rock acts you've got 2000trees, for hardcore you've got Outbreak, for the weirder stuff you've got ArcTanGent, for the more extreme stuff you've got Damnation, for old school punk you've got Rebellion, for kerrang artists you've got Slam Dunk and even the denim dinosaurs have got Ramblin Man. 

I know that Download draws bigger names but for most if not all of those festivals have been growing loads as Download just seems to stagnate. Doesn't seem like it'll be long until these festivals catch up.

Yep, apart from Pilot I've not been to Download for a few years as it's become abit boring now. There are so many great smaller festivals about where it feels like it's more like a party and less hard work than the major fests.

However a decent major rock festival in this country is the dream!

[willgooneday]

One obvious factor is 2024 is going to be wide open 

 

Can surely rule out Maiden, Biffy, KISS on this year and if the rumours are all true for 2022:. Slipknot, Metallica and Bring Me the Horizon.

Might get GNR back, MCR a possibility and maybe SOAD! That'd cater to most Downloaders right? 

Edited June 29, 2022 by willgooneday

[BenG92]

Just now, willgooneday said:

One obvious factor is 2024 is going to be wide open 

Can surely rule out Maiden, Biffy, KISS on this year and if the rumours are all true for 2022:. Slipknot, Metallica and Bring Me the Horizon.

Might get GNR back, MCR a possibility and maybe SOAD!

It's Download, I'd never rule out them bringing back a headliner that played 2 years previously

We'll see how '23 goes, if it's more of a celebration of 20 years with a lot of legacy acts then '24 desperately needs to be something very different to kickstart a new generation of Download. Even once they bump BMTH up they can't rely on just them. '24 should see Ghost at the top 100%

[jump]

7 minutes ago, BenG92 said:

It's Download, I'd never rule out them bringing back a headliner that played 2 years previously

We'll see how '23 goes, if it's more of a celebration of 20 years with a lot of legacy acts then '24 desperately needs to be something very different to kickstart a new generation of Download. Even once they bump BMTH up they can't rely on just them. '24 should see Ghost at the top 100%

They should have gone with Ghost this year to be honest, one because they are fucking awesome live and two to strike whilst the iron is hot or whatever that phrase is.

Five Finger looked ready years ago however as they have waited so long they are starting to cool off much like when Biffy did finally headline and are now a bad word to the Downloaders. When a band is shit hot and big enough is when they should headline to cement their headline status so all the Status Quo fans can't complain they aren't headliners. 

It's fucking lucky they bumped A7X and Slipknot when they did otherwise they never would have.

[willgooneday]

4 minutes ago, jump said:

They should have gone with Ghost this year to be honest, one because they are fucking awesome live and two to strike whilst the iron is hot or whatever that phrase is.

Five Finger looked ready years ago however as they have waited so long they are starting to cool off much like when Biffy did finally headline and are now a bad word to the Downloaders. When a band is shit hot and big enough is when they should headline to cement their headline status so all the Status Quo fans can't complain they aren't headliners. 

It's fucking lucky they bumped A7X and Slipknot when they did otherwise they never would have.

Wasn't at least one if not both of them bumped due to a drop out? Download never has been and never will be the most progressive bookers on the planet - the difference is other fests use to force their hand a bit.

 

 

 

[jump]

21 minutes ago, willgooneday said:

Wasn't at least one if not both of them bumped due to a drop out? Download never has been and never will be the most progressive bookers on the planet - the difference is other fests use to force their hand a bit.

 

 

 

Nah, Download was good at bumping bands up that looked like headliners before the other major festivals like A7X, My Chemical Romance, System, Slipknot etc. It's only the last 10 years that they have decided to book the old shit more at the expenses of the younger shit, literally their first year at the height of nu-metal they booked Limp Bizkit to headline.

Edited June 29, 2022 by jump

[Spiral_Low]

Still think you are all focusing way too much on headliners. The way the festival sustains itself is by helping grow bands to fill the big slots, be it headliner, sub, third or whatever. And they need to start lower down on bill first.

Personally I think they need to utilize main stage mid afternoon slots more. Put bands like Spiritbox and Jinjer on like 5th and 6th on main stage. Also have bands like Bloodywood and Zeal & Ardor on early. These are all bands on the up atm that appeal to a metal crowd and some of the rock crowd too. Showcase the talent, help them grow, and they could be filling big slots in the future.

And there's new bands like Heriot and Ithaca emerging - don't just tuck them away on 4th stage, give them slots on 2nd even if it's opening or whatever.