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When will covid end ? Please be nice and respectful to others


crazyfool1
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21 minutes ago, zahidf said:

 

 

Always most likely to go this way. 
I do think people will have no issues having one every late autumn/ early winter (especially the millions who have flu shots at that time of year anyway) but getting people to have one quarterly of their own volition? Doubtful.

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1 hour ago, balthazarstarbuck said:

Always most likely to go this way. 
I do think people will have no issues having one every late autumn/ early winter (especially the millions who have flu shots at that time of year anyway) but getting people to have one quarterly of their own volition? Doubtful.

Yearly, targeted mainly at those who usually need the flu jab, available to others who want it but no mandates, no domestic vaccine passports and no coercion or threats and it'd be a sensible solution

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NHS to start sacking unvaccinated staff in two weeks. As two jabs are required by April 1st that means staff have until Feb 3rd to get the first one.

80,000 workers could go.

Edited by lost
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1 hour ago, lost said:

NHS to start sacking unvaccinated staff in two weeks. As two jabs are required by April 1st that means staff have until Feb 3rd to get the first one.

80,000 workers could go.

They'll still only actually let them go April 1st though, and there's plenty of time to reverse it. 

I think I'm in the minority who thinks it's madness, but apparently it makes it safer for patients. 

I'd happily be treated by an unvaccinated medical professional. Actually, I'd actively choose to because I don't feel any more or less safe based on people's vaccination status. Would i get that choice? No, there'd just be nobody there instead. 

It's a rule based on the absolute fabrication that the vaccine stops transmission. And we're on the sane end of the spectrum compared to the vaccine passport countries

Edited by efcfanwirral
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59 minutes ago, efcfanwirral said:

They'll still only actually let them go April 1st though, and there's plenty of time to reverse it. 

I think I'm in the minority who thinks it's madness, but apparently it makes it safer for patients. 

I'd happily be treated by an unvaccinated medical professional. Actually, I'd actively choose to because I don't feel any more or less safe based on people's vaccination status. Would i get that choice? No, there'd just be nobody there instead. 

It's a rule based on the absolute fabrication that the vaccine stops transmission. And we're on the sane end of the spectrum compared to the vaccine passport countries

I had a dentist appointment today and I couldn't of cared less what there vaccination status was.  Never crossed my mind.

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11 hours ago, efcfanwirral said:

They'll still only actually let them go April 1st though, and there's plenty of time to reverse it. 

I think I'm in the minority who thinks it's madness, but apparently it makes it safer for patients. 

I'd happily be treated by an unvaccinated medical professional. Actually, I'd actively choose to because I don't feel any more or less safe based on people's vaccination status. Would i get that choice? No, there'd just be nobody there instead. 

It's a rule based on the absolute fabrication that the vaccine stops transmission. And we're on the sane end of the spectrum compared to the vaccine passport countries

The vaccine reduces transmission a bit. But yeah, I think something more is going on here - it's basically a purge of people from the NHS that don't believe in medical science. Whether you think that's a good thing or not is down to the individual.

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3 minutes ago, DeanoL said:

I know you won't wear one but people less triggered by them probably will. 

I just don't see the evidence on the street...  Even with the restrictions in place you have around 15% (or so) not doing it...

When the mask mandate went down to just recommended only about 5% continued to wear them.

I guess you don't get out much ?

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4 minutes ago, DeanoL said:

The vaccine reduces transmission a bit. But yeah, I think something more is going on here - it's basically a purge of people from the NHS that don't believe in medical science. Whether you think that's a good thing or not is down to the individual.

wel...

That NHS doctor who said he didn't want it had sound reasoning...  He had been previously infected and felt he had antibody protection so little need to have it.

That is pretty sound science.

And if the vaccine does not halt the spread then there is little to consider beyond your own personal position / safety.

It quiet a leap to say they don't believe in medical science.

Also I would imagine that biggest part of that 80,000 are not medical staff and possibly support staff like porters / security etc.

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47 minutes ago, DeanoL said:

The vaccine reduces transmission a bit. But yeah, I think something more is going on here - it's basically a purge of people from the NHS that don't believe in medical science. Whether you think that's a good thing or not is down to the individual.

A bit yes but is that worth actually putting your health service into danger of being overwhelmed after spending two years restricting our lives to avoid that very thing? 

This will have a knock on effect on future restrictions too - they do this they aren't gone for good. 

As I said I don't care about their "beliefs" and share some of them  - but mainly I want them to be there vs not there for ideological reasons. There are enough people who would have no problem being treated by them to find a different solution, but we won't have that choice. 

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3 hours ago, Barry Fish said:

I just don't see the evidence on the street...  Even with the restrictions in place you have around 15% (or so) not doing it...

When the mask mandate went down to just recommended only about 5% continued to wear them.

I guess you don't get out much ?

How many people do you think regularly wear them in places like Japan and so on?

2 hours ago, Barry Fish said:

wel...

That NHS doctor who said he didn't want it had sound reasoning...  He had been previously infected and felt he had antibody protection so little need to have it.

That is pretty sound science.

But that protection won't be as broad as that of a vaccine and will wane more quickly. If he'd been infected a few months ago then it'd be perfectly reasonable to put off getting vaccinated for a few months more, but not to decide not to take it entirely.

I don't care that much if some NHS IT guy has the vaccine or not but given the choice I'd rather not have treatment proscribed for me by someone who thinks vaccines are pointless.

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4 minutes ago, DeanoL said:

How many people do you think regularly wear them in places like Japan and so on?

But that protection won't be as broad as that of a vaccine and will wane more quickly. If he'd been infected a few months ago then it'd be perfectly reasonable to put off getting vaccinated for a few months more, but not to decide not to take it entirely.

I don't care that much if some NHS IT guy has the vaccine or not but given the choice I'd rather not have treatment proscribed for me by someone who thinks vaccines are pointless.

A choice being taken away from all of us. Can't even go private as it applies there too - so much for the free market...

And yeah i agree even if its the right thing to do the non public facing roles, especially those at admin only centres it's a bit pointless. Similar to the Australian mandates for people who work 100% remotely 

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Its only front line according to the telegraph article I quoted yesterday:

Quote

All frontline staff are required to have two jabs by April 1, meaning the first dose must have been administered by Feb 3. More than 80,000 – six per cent of the workforce – remain unvaccinated despite repeated efforts to boost take-up.

NHS guidance to employers says all frontline staff who have not been vaccinated should start being called into formal meetings from Feb 4 and warned that they face dismissal. Dismissal notices will start being issued from that day, with the notice period ending on March 31.

 

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1 hour ago, DeanoL said:

How many people do you think regularly wear them in places like Japan and so on?

But that protection won't be as broad as that of a vaccine and will wane more quickly. If he'd been infected a few months ago then it'd be perfectly reasonable to put off getting vaccinated for a few months more, but not to decide not to take it entirely.

I don't care that much if some NHS IT guy has the vaccine or not but given the choice I'd rather not have treatment proscribed for me by someone who thinks vaccines are pointless.

You know we live in the UK right ? The idea we are suddenly going to adopt a full on Japanese culture is laughable.

The science tells us he will probably retain T Cell protection and won't suffer serious health issues if reinfected.  We knows this.  You are largely talking about upfront protection from infection - something the vaccine only offers 30% protection against after a few months.  

So you want 30% protection against just infection traded in for 80,000 NHS workers out of a job.

You are losing your mind...  

Really... you care about the IT guy 🙂. on your bike mate 😛 

Edited by Barry Fish
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5 minutes ago, Barry Fish said:

You know we live in the UK right ? The idea we are suddenly going to adopt a full on Japanese culture is laughable.

The science tells us he will probably retain T Cell protection and won't suffer serious health issues if reinfected.  We knows this.  You are largely talking about upfront protection from infection - something the vaccine only offers 30% protection against after a few months.  

So you want 30% protection against just infection traded in for 80,000 NHS workers out of a job.

I literally said I didn't think there was a medical justification for it.

I just think not taking the vaccine is stupid, and someone that doesn't take the vaccine when offered is stupid, and I don't want stupid people involved in taking care of me in life threatening situations. 

Now if it's worth creating a potential staffing crisis in the NHS in exchange for getting rid of it's 80000 most stupid front-line workers I'm not so sure on. And I do think that's what is going on here. They're dressing it up as being about transmission of COVID, but it's actually just NHS bosses taking the opportunity to purge the ranks. I totally agree with you guys there.

I'm just not yet convinced one way or another on if such a purge is a good or bad thing. Had we not done a Brexit and so were already facing a staffing crisis I think it'd be an easier question to answer.

As for the masks thing - your posts seem to go back and forth between telling me that masks will never catch on as a thing as it's utterly impossible given our culture, and then posting links about people saying there might be continued mask restrictions. The mask restrictions are popular because some people want them and that's why you're seeing these articles saying people support them, or that they'll keep them past end of January.

You know I agree with you on how pointless they are without social distancing, but you seem to be pushing this point that as a culture we're desperate to throw them in the bin, while posting loads of links saying the opposite. I know *you* are desperate to get rid of them but you're not indicative of the general populace. Which should be obvious to you given how traumatic you find them versus how easy to put up with most of us find them.

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