Glasto politics: Non covid news

[mattiloy]

So nobody else feeling uncomfortable with the tories using the MPs murder by an islamic terrorist to advance creeping authoritarianism through social media id?

Just like using the extinction rebellion to push through the police and crime bill, much of which was irrelevant to countering the tactics used by those protests but had much broader implications.

It stinks.

[maelzoid]

41 minutes ago, Alex DeLarge said:

Removing online anonymity won't solve anything.

I don't know what any of you look like or even most of your real names, yet I've never encountered even 1% of the nasty, close-minded racist views I see people I personally know post on Facebook.

I left Facebook quite a while ago, because it had become so toxic. I've had to cut off friends from twitter, because I find their posts so infuriating (pro-brexit / anti-vax - usually lies). It is so easy to post misinformation, yet requires quite a bit of effort to refute with well-sourced facts. And honestly, life is too short.

All joking aside, I think this forum is one of the nicest places on the internet. The vast majority here are able to share differences of opinion without devolving into insults or worse.

Let's keep it that way.

[maelzoid]

29 minutes ago, mattiloy said:

So nobody else feeling uncomfortable with the tories using the MPs murder by an islamic terrorist to advance creeping authoritarianism through social media id?

On a practical level, it's an absolute non-starter.

Remember the multi-billion pound ID card fiasco?

Remember the tories attempts to age-restrict porn on the web?

The technical challenge of such a scheme is far beyond what this government is capable of.

But I would like them to take seriously online abuse in the form of pursuing perpetrators in the courts. As previously mentioned, so much abuse is not from anonymous sources, yet it proliferates because there is no accountability for it.

[steviewevie]

13 minutes ago, maelzoid said:

I left Facebook quite a while ago, because it had become so toxic. I've had to cut off friends from twitter, because I find their posts so infuriating (pro-brexit / anti-vax - usually lies). It is so easy to post misinformation, yet requires quite a bit of effort to refute with well-sourced facts. And honestly, life is too short.

All joking aside, I think this forum is one of the nicest places on the internet. The vast majority here are able to share differences of opinion without devolving into insults or worse.

Let's keep it that way.

twat

[fred quimby]

13 minutes ago, maelzoid said:

 

All joking aside, I think this forum is one of the nicest places on the internet. The vast majority here are able to share differences of opinion without devolving into insults or worse.

Let's keep it that way.

Bites tounge

 

😉 

[efcfanwirral]

12 hours ago, Ozanne said:

It won’t happen, like everything with this government they need to talk like they are going to take tough measures to cover up the fact that they don’t have a clue. Nothing will happen. 

 

55 minutes ago, mattiloy said:

So nobody else feeling uncomfortable with the tories using the MPs murder by an islamic terrorist to advance creeping authoritarianism through social media id?

Just like using the extinction rebellion to push through the police and crime bill, much of which was irrelevant to countering the tactics used by those protests but had much broader implications.

It stinks.

I was just about to come on and say this. While dots can be connected, this hysterical crusade against Internet anonymity in response to this particular situation does feel a bit odd and out of place. It's a bit tenuous for them to go so all in about it 

Edited October 19, 2021 by efcfanwirral

[SwedgeAntilles]

54 minutes ago, mattiloy said:

So nobody else feeling uncomfortable with the tories using the MPs murder by an islamic terrorist to advance creeping authoritarianism through social media id?

Just like using the extinction rebellion to push through the police and crime bill, much of which was irrelevant to countering the tactics used by those protests but had much broader implications.

It stinks.

100%. Stinks of shock doctrine politics. 

[steviewevie]

 

[Alex DeLarge]

11 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

 

Don't think you can win over someone who starts a sentence with 'well if it's fake news or not...' tbf

[Ozanne]

1 hour ago, mattiloy said:

So nobody else feeling uncomfortable with the tories using the MPs murder by an islamic terrorist to advance creeping authoritarianism through social media id?

Just like using the extinction rebellion to push through the police and crime bill, much of which was irrelevant to countering the tactics used by those protests but had much broader implications.

It stinks.

Yeah it’s grim, the Tories will use this as an excuse to drive home measures that won’t solve the problem and will if anything make lives worse for people.

It’s happened in every fascists state where a right wing government will use a recent event to curtail freedoms and erode democracy. 

[fred quimby]

1 hour ago, mattiloy said:

So nobody else feeling uncomfortable with the tories using the MPs murder by an islamic terrorist to advance creeping authoritarianism through social media id?

Just like using the extinction rebellion to push through the police and crime bill, much of which was irrelevant to countering the tactics used by those protests but had much broader implications.

It stinks.

Yep was chatting to someone about this the other night. 

Think this is happening everywhere. 

Not sure why they were not biting at this when we have so much racial abuse online (Yes I do know really) and to use these very rare events to move on it seems well normal actually. Sadly they will try to implement something that will obviously not work. Show me your ID will certainly stop those extermist groups around the world radicalising people. and when something else happens then more control. Not even convinced they want it to be Authoritarianism, but will happen by randomness of each action

[fred quimby]

3 minutes ago, Ozanne said:

Yeah it’s grim, the Tories will use this as an excuse to drive home measures that won’t solve the problem and will if anything make lives worse for people.

It’s happened in every fascists state where a right wing government will use a recent event to curtail freedoms and erode democracy. 

Don't be fooled, Labour would be doing this too, infact are not the Totaletarian states that came from far left the worst for it

[Ozanne]

27 minutes ago, fred quimby said:

Don't be fooled, Labour would be doing this too, infact are not the Totaletarian states that came from far left the worst for it

Yes you are right the authoritarian states of the left are doing it too, maybe I should’ve said authoritarian instead of right wing. 

[steviewevie]

I might be a lone voice on here but I think the internet and social media needs regulating, so much dodgy bullshit (e.g. Starmer and Saville case) and way too much power for certain companies and individuals.

[fred quimby]

7 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

I might be a lone voice on here but I think the internet and social media needs regulating, so much dodgy bullshit (e.g. Starmer and Saville case) and way too much power for certain companies and individuals.

I don't think you are wrong, I have no idea what that looks like but I think it can be looked at and regulated.

Terrible that Facebook did thier own research (A good thing) into how their platform impacts teens. When they find out that it harms them they do fuck all about it. Much like the tobacco industry

[Haan]

1 hour ago, Alex DeLarge said:

Don't think you can win over someone who starts a sentence with 'well if it's fake news or not...' tbf

 

[steviewevie]

probably not enough, but at least it's a start...and hopefully other countries will pledge similar stuff at COP26 (not looking great at moment though).

 

[steviewevie]

I see Steve Baker has tired of researching Europe and Covid and has now joined NetZeroWatch, basically set up to oppose govt net zero policies. What is it with Steve Baker..?

[gigpusher]

3 hours ago, mattiloy said:

So nobody else feeling uncomfortable with the tories using the MPs murder by an islamic terrorist to advance creeping authoritarianism through social media id?

Just like using the extinction rebellion to push through the police and crime bill, much of which was irrelevant to countering the tactics used by those protests but had much broader implications.

It stinks.

Yes it's very uncomfortable. I understand that many trolls use anonymous accounts and can do real harm to other people and their mental health and of course that is wrong and something should be done about it. I often see celebrities talk about people using anonymous accounts and hiding their opinions behind fake identities and think how lucky they are to be able to say all of their opinions without any fear of any consequences. I used to work for a company that had a very strong social media policy which basically said you couldn't say anything about a client that could bring them into disrepute. Given that they had huge numbers of clients in all sorts of industries it would have made it very difficult for me to comment on a lot of political or environmental issues without there being a chance that someone could interpret me as having a go at a client and possibly getting fired. 

There are many whistle blowers that only feel comfortable exposing truths about their industry because of anonymity. 

[steviewevie]

13 minutes ago, gigpusher said:

Yes it's very uncomfortable. I understand that many trolls use anonymous accounts and can do real harm to other people and their mental health and of course that is wrong and something should be done about it. I often see celebrities talk about people using anonymous accounts and hiding their opinions behind fake identities and think how lucky they are to be able to say all of their opinions without any fear of any consequences. I used to work for a company that had a very strong social media policy which basically said you couldn't say anything about a client that could bring them into disrepute. Given that they had huge numbers of clients in all sorts of industries it would have made it very difficult for me to comment on a lot of political or environmental issues without there being a chance that someone could interpret me as having a go at a client and possibly getting fired. 

There are many whistle blowers that only feel comfortable exposing truths about their industry because of anonymity. 

yeah, but on social media you just don't know who is a legit whistleblower or just totally fake.

[gigpusher]

1 minute ago, steviewevie said:

yeah, but on social media you just don't know who is a legit whistleblower or just totally fake.

True. I'll be honest I don't think we are able to handle the world we have created for ourselves. It would be good to trust people to do the right thing but not enough people do that. I just think when you decide to make a law you have to see what the positives and negatives will be, whether it could work practically or not before you make these decisions. 

I mean in my example I know all the basic info that I would need to create a twitter id about loads of people. Aunts, uncles, cousins etc. If I really wanted to vent about something what would stop me setting up an id as them and potentially getting them into trouble instead. 

In terms of whistle blowers what measures would you have to have in place before you could trust what someone says? We all know that these days you do have to investigate a little more and not take things posted on social media at face value. 

 

[maelzoid]

1 hour ago, Haan said:

 

I found this headline so intriguing, i had to read the article:

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/british-public-wrong-about-nearly-everything-survey-shows-8697821.html

[steviewevie]

20 minutes ago, gigpusher said:

True. I'll be honest I don't think we are able to handle the world we have created for ourselves. It would be good to trust people to do the right thing but not enough people do that. I just think when you decide to make a law you have to see what the positives and negatives will be, whether it could work practically or not before you make these decisions. 

I mean in my example I know all the basic info that I would need to create a twitter id about loads of people. Aunts, uncles, cousins etc. If I really wanted to vent about something what would stop me setting up an id as them and potentially getting them into trouble instead. 

In terms of whistle blowers what measures would you have to have in place before you could trust what someone says? We all know that these days you do have to investigate a little more and not take things posted on social media at face value. 

 

Personally I wouldn't trust a whistleblower story unless it was from mainstream media - and Guardian in particular has ran with many of these over the years, and on twitter I only really believe and follow main stream media journalists accounts for news. I know some people do not trust msm at all, and I think good to be sceptical, but I trust them far more than any anon on facebook or twitter.

And I just think there's so much other bad stuff out there. Instagram seems to be particularly bad for some vulnerable teenagers, and then there's all that porn being the main sex education for kids and now all the sexual assaults and rape being reported at schools etc.

[gigpusher]

8 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

Personally I wouldn't trust a whistleblower story unless it was from mainstream media - and Guardian in particular has ran with many of these over the years, and on twitter I only really believe and follow main stream media journalists accounts for news. I know some people do not trust msm at all, and I think good to be sceptical, but I trust them far more than any anon on facebook or twitter.

And I just think there's so much other bad stuff out there. Instagram seems to be particularly bad for some vulnerable teenagers, and then there's all that porn being the main sex education for kids and now all the sexual assaults and rape being reported at schools etc.

But for every negative there is a positive as well so it's a tricky situation. There's a lot more support and communities for people now for example victims of sexual assault can much more easily speak to people who have been through the same as them and can through anonymised accounts feel more comfortable telling their story. I think the trouble is we have created a very complex and difficult world that needs much more international cooperation and nuanced laws but the people making the laws don't even understand the technology. 

[steviewevie]