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The worlds gone mad.. Ban all Xmas songs


guypjfreak
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3 hours ago, Hugh Jass said:

Yeah I was in New York for work a few years back, during a break in a meeting some of the Americans were going out for a smoke and asked if I wanted to join them. Without thinking I replied “yeah I could murder a fag right now...”

The looks I received.

I'm sure that there are certain circles in the states that would have applauded you for such a statement. We, rather inadvertently, invited our neighbour's builder around for a drink on Friday night, not having known him (the builder) 5 minutes. My wife was slaughtered, and I wasn't far behind. Anyway, we did get on with the bloke. However, after a wild night and while doing a post mortem of the previously untethered proceedings, either my wife or myself (can't recall) said to the other 'Did you notice something so fleeting (as in less than a second) that the builder was about to go off on a racist one, but didn't'? Either myself or my wife agreed with the other, because that's what we both saw / felt, and were able to establish that it was at the same time.

So, what to do? There's no doubt in my mind that my recollection of events also includes that the afore mentioned fleeting moment of the builder, was witnessed by me looking at his face, and in particular his eyes. It also includes recognition that he was looking at me in exactly the same manner. I'm convinced that he went for it, saw my eyes, and withdrew. 

 

STOP PRESS, STOP PRESS - I was just about to say that I'd bet my arse stating that he knew that I knew. Now, can you imagine what's now going through my mind? Essentially I'm rattling my brains out to try to establish if that could possibly be considered homophobic. I don't think that it can. I know full well there was no intent for it to be the case. Maybe you think differently. Time will tell.

Anyway, to get back to the 'plot' (now, there's a laugh) - Later in the evening the event occurred that I (rather bravely! lol) ended up being in this bloke's company on my toad for almost the whole of the rest of the night. During this 'meeting of minds' he produced a crack pipe, asked if I minded, and then, when I said I didn't, asked if it was OK if he did. I said that it wasn't a problem, and that he should feel comfortable, and that he was a guest. Then he offered it to me again! Now that was odd then, and remains odd. Was he mentally clumsy, or was it something more sinister?

I'm afraid it goes on - soz. Later in the evening he told me about the activates of the underbelly of this quaint small English town. I informed him that if any of that shit came to my door that I would go ballistic. He then informed me that he wouldn't even be telling anybody that he'd been at ours. He knew where I was coming from. I like to further think that he went one step further to show his intent. He told me that a mutual person that we knew had told the whole town that we were 'speed freaks' I'm 99% certain that he gave me that as an act of his honest intentions. He even told me to steer clear of the bloke, and why.

Now, this is a man who has, to my minds eye, in the course of one evening about to have shown me his true colours vis a vis 'racism', and then gone onto provide me with some unasked for information that is very handy to know. This ammo,  has without doubt, helped in some of my decision making processes. 

So, to leave it at that, or not, I wonder!? It's now (via my wife actually, in a moment of pure lunacy, actually inviting him to Christmas dinner - to which he accepted) inevitable that our paths will cross. It'll happen sooner than that stated, I think, if truth be known. Do I bother trying to establish his views on race, I wonder? I can tell you know that he wouldn't be coming for Xmas dinner if he got the answer wrong. However, he knows that I know that he knows etc ie. he'll not slip up now. 

 

STOP PRESS. STOP PRESS - I've just told my wife (well, about 10 minutes ago) about this thread and the 'faggots' element of the 'altered' Pogues song. She, quite fantastically, blew up in a rage. Then she educated me. She said something along the lines of 'So, why hasn't , or isn't, anybody saying that it's wrong for him to come out with the words ' You're an old slut on junk'? She then went on to mention that there were fucking shed loads of songs out there that were staggeringly discriminatory towards women. She gave an example - this one;

 

And then she said that that was nothing, and that another and better example would be this one:

 

 

Then she returned to the Pogues song and said that there was no way that the BBC, or anybody else, should alter the lyrics. That the lyrics had been used to express a very heated argument between a couple, and that those are exactly the words that should be heard to express the intensity that Jem Finer and Shane MacGowan evidently meant to express.

Food for thought.

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7 hours ago, Yoghurt on a Stick said:

Then she returned to the Pogues song and said that there was no way that the BBC, or anybody else, should alter the lyrics. That the lyrics had been used to express a very heated argument between a couple, and that those are exactly the words that should be heard to express the intensity that Jem Finer and Shane MacGowan evidently meant to express.

Food for thought.

This kind of makes sense, the artist has decided that wording reflects the characters in the song, why should the BBC change them?

But if the lyrics we're a heated argument where the characters said "fuck", "shit" or the n word I'd expect the BBC to edit them out or play an alternative radio-friendly version (and not still play the original on radio 2!).

Maybe R1 should have all the family-friendly radio edits & R2 can play unedited originals of things like fairytale of New York and WAP.

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8 hours ago, Yoghurt on a Stick said:

I'm sure that there are certain circles in the states that would have applauded you for such a statement. We, rather inadvertently, invited our neighbour's builder around for a drink on Friday night, not having known him (the builder) 5 minutes. My wife was slaughtered, and I wasn't far behind. Anyway, we did get on with the bloke. However, after a wild night and while doing a post mortem of the previously untethered proceedings, either my wife or myself (can't recall) said to the other 'Did you notice something so fleeting (as in less than a second) that the builder was about to go off on a racist one, but didn't'? Either myself or my wife agreed with the other, because that's what we both saw / felt, and were able to establish that it was at the same time.

So, what to do? There's no doubt in my mind that my recollection of events also includes that the afore mentioned fleeting moment of the builder, was witnessed by me looking at his face, and in particular his eyes. It also includes recognition that he was looking at me in exactly the same manner. I'm convinced that he went for it, saw my eyes, and withdrew. 

 

STOP PRESS, STOP PRESS - I was just about to say that I'd bet my arse stating that he knew that I knew. Now, can you imagine what's now going through my mind? Essentially I'm rattling my brains out to try to establish if that could possibly be considered homophobic. I don't think that it can. I know full well there was no intent for it to be the case. Maybe you think differently. Time will tell.

Anyway, to get back to the 'plot' (now, there's a laugh) - Later in the evening the event occurred that I (rather bravely! lol) ended up being in this bloke's company on my toad for almost the whole of the rest of the night. During this 'meeting of minds' he produced a crack pipe, asked if I minded, and then, when I said I didn't, asked if it was OK if he did. I said that it wasn't a problem, and that he should feel comfortable, and that he was a guest. Then he offered it to me again! Now that was odd then, and remains odd. Was he mentally clumsy, or was it something more sinister?

I'm afraid it goes on - soz. Later in the evening he told me about the activates of the underbelly of this quaint small English town. I informed him that if any of that shit came to my door that I would go ballistic. He then informed me that he wouldn't even be telling anybody that he'd been at ours. He knew where I was coming from. I like to further think that he went one step further to show his intent. He told me that a mutual person that we knew had told the whole town that we were 'speed freaks' I'm 99% certain that he gave me that as an act of his honest intentions. He even told me to steer clear of the bloke, and why.

Now, this is a man who has, to my minds eye, in the course of one evening about to have shown me his true colours vis a vis 'racism', and then gone onto provide me with some unasked for information that is very handy to know. This ammo,  has without doubt, helped in some of my decision making processes. 

So, to leave it at that, or not, I wonder!? It's now (via my wife actually, in a moment of pure lunacy, actually inviting him to Christmas dinner - to which he accepted) inevitable that our paths will cross. It'll happen sooner than that stated, I think, if truth be known. Do I bother trying to establish his views on race, I wonder? I can tell you know that he wouldn't be coming for Xmas dinner if he got the answer wrong. However, he knows that I know that he knows etc ie. he'll not slip up now. 

 

STOP PRESS. STOP PRESS - I've just told my wife (well, about 10 minutes ago) about this thread and the 'faggots' element of the 'altered' Pogues song. She, quite fantastically, blew up in a rage. Then she educated me. She said something along the lines of 'So, why hasn't , or isn't, anybody saying that it's wrong for him to come out with the words ' You're an old slut on junk'? She then went on to mention that there were fucking shed loads of songs out there that were staggeringly discriminatory towards women. She gave an example - this one;

 

And then she said that that was nothing, and that another and better example would be this one:

 

 

Then she returned to the Pogues song and said that there was no way that the BBC, or anybody else, should alter the lyrics. That the lyrics had been used to express a very heated argument between a couple, and that those are exactly the words that should be heard to express the intensity that Jem Finer and Shane MacGowan evidently meant to express.

Food for thought.

Can I get an abridged version for those of us with less than four hours to spare please?

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4 minutes ago, Hugh Jass said:

Can I get an abridged version for those of us with less than four hours to spare please?

The first bit was about meeting a gentleman who may have been about to say something racist and is now invited for Christmas Dinner, and the complexity of the situation. 

The second part is below - 

 I've just told my wife (well, about 10 minutes ago) about this thread and the 'faggots' element of the 'altered' Pogues song. She, quite fantastically, blew up in a rage. Then she educated me. She said something along the lines of 'So, why hasn't , or isn't, anybody saying that it's wrong for him to come out with the words ' You're an old slut on junk'? She then went on to mention that there were fucking shed loads of songs out there that were staggeringly discriminatory towards women. She gave an example - this one;

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2 hours ago, Kalopsia said:

The first bit was about meeting a gentleman who may have been about to say something racist and is now invited for Christmas Dinner, and the complexity of the situation. 

The second part is below - 

 I've just told my wife (well, about 10 minutes ago) about this thread and the 'faggots' element of the 'altered' Pogues song. She, quite fantastically, blew up in a rage. Then she educated me. She said something along the lines of 'So, why hasn't , or isn't, anybody saying that it's wrong for him to come out with the words ' You're an old slut on junk'? She then went on to mention that there were fucking shed loads of songs out there that were staggeringly discriminatory towards women. She gave an example - this one;

Good point 

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I believe the radio 1 version is also cutting the word "slut".

"BBC Radio 1 is to air a censored version of the Pogues’ Fairytale of New York that removes the words “faggot” and “slut” from Kirsty MacColl’s verse."

https://www.theguardian.com/music/2020/nov/19/fairytale-of-new-york-pogues-censored-radio-1-radio-2

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On 11/22/2020 at 6:33 PM, guypjfreak said:

1...All I Want for Christmas Is You” by Mariah Carey

2..“Last Christmas” by Wham!

3..“It’s Beginning to Look a Lot Like Christmas” by Michael Bublé

4...“Mistletoe” by Justin Bieber

5..“Santa Tell Me” by Ariana Grande

6...“It’s the Most Wonderful Time of the Year” by Andy Williams

7...“Do They Know It’s Christmas? (1984 Version)” by Band Aid

8..“Fairytale of New York (feat. Kirsty MacColl)” by The Pogues

9.“White Christmas” by Bing Crosby

10.. “Let It Snow! Let It Snow! Let It Snow!” by Frank Sinatra

11...Just like Christmas' by Low 

12....its Christmas so we'll stop .. By Frightened rabbit 

13....Merry Christmas everyone by Slade

14.... Elton John’s step into Christmas

15...Pearl jam.. Don't believe in Xmas 

 

Talking about crackheads and Xmas.. Anymore or shall we kill it.. 

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On 11/23/2020 at 8:10 AM, Simsy said:

But if the lyrics we're a heated argument where the characters said "fuck", "shit" or the n word I'd expect the BBC to edit them out or play an alternative radio-friendly version (and not still play the original on radio 2!).

I'm not sure that I need to ask my wife (which I'm not going to do right now because I 'need' a rest. She can, by her own admission, 'talk' to people at such length that a point arrives whereby it all becomes unpleasant for the listener. I've only just fielded one attempt at one of 'those' off, so I'll be fucked if I'm 'going back in' and allow another attempt) on this. I'm fairly confident that she would say the same for those words that you mention. That these are the words that people use in real life when drunk, angry, both, etc. I'm pretty sure that she's arguing against the shackling of true expression ie. if everything is censored then it will waters down all 'art'. ie if the 'N' word should be banned from use, then carte blanche it should not be allowed to be used by black people in songs, comedy, films, poetry, and other avenues that I can't think of right now, which it is.

If anybody's really interested then I will ask to see if I'm right, as this is an important area for discussion. Whether that discussion leads to progress, I'm not sure about.

 

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On 11/23/2020 at 8:48 AM, Kalopsia said:

The first bit was about meeting a gentleman who may have been about to say something racist and is now invited for Christmas Dinner, and the complexity of the situation. 

The second part is below - 

 I've just told my wife (well, about 10 minutes ago) about this thread and the 'faggots' element of the 'altered' Pogues song. She, quite fantastically, blew up in a rage. Then she educated me. She said something along the lines of 'So, why hasn't , or isn't, anybody saying that it's wrong for him to come out with the words ' You're an old slut on junk'? She then went on to mention that there were fucking shed loads of songs out there that were staggeringly discriminatory towards women. She gave an example - this one;

Thank you for saving me a job. :)

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On 11/23/2020 at 4:15 PM, maelzoid said:

@Yoghurt on a Stick

Let me get this right... You've invited a racist crackhead you've only just met around for Christmas dinner?

Not really. I'm not a grass, but I do like the truth / clarity etc, so have to tell you (sing like a canary!)that it was my wife that invited the bloke around for Xmas day dinner, not me, or not even us jointly. 

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Nice to see everyone getting on.. 

So 3 family's in one bubble.. Its already causing trouble in my tribe... One wants to break the rules the other is trying to keep to them and we're stuck wanting to just bend em.... Nightmare 

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On 11/23/2020 at 12:09 AM, Yoghurt on a Stick said:

I'm sure that there are certain circles in the states that would have applauded you for such a statement. We, rather inadvertently, invited our neighbour's builder around for a drink on Friday night, not having known him (the builder) 5 minutes. My wife was slaughtered, and I wasn't far behind. Anyway, we did get on with the bloke. However, after a wild night and while doing a post mortem of the previously untethered proceedings, either my wife or myself (can't recall) said to the other 'Did you notice something so fleeting (as in less than a second) that the builder was about to go off on a racist one, but didn't'? Either myself or my wife agreed with the other, because that's what we both saw / felt, and were able to establish that it was at the same time.

So, what to do? There's no doubt in my mind that my recollection of events also includes that the afore mentioned fleeting moment of the builder, was witnessed by me looking at his face, and in particular his eyes. It also includes recognition that he was looking at me in exactly the same manner. I'm convinced that he went for it, saw my eyes, and withdrew. 

 

STOP PRESS, STOP PRESS - I was just about to say that I'd bet my arse stating that he knew that I knew. Now, can you imagine what's now going through my mind? Essentially I'm rattling my brains out to try to establish if that could possibly be considered homophobic. I don't think that it can. I know full well there was no intent for it to be the case. Maybe you think differently. Time will tell.

Anyway, to get back to the 'plot' (now, there's a laugh) - Later in the evening the event occurred that I (rather bravely! lol) ended up being in this bloke's company on my toad for almost the whole of the rest of the night. During this 'meeting of minds' he produced a crack pipe, asked if I minded, and then, when I said I didn't, asked if it was OK if he did. I said that it wasn't a problem, and that he should feel comfortable, and that he was a guest. Then he offered it to me again! Now that was odd then, and remains odd. Was he mentally clumsy, or was it something more sinister?

I'm afraid it goes on - soz. Later in the evening he told me about the activates of the underbelly of this quaint small English town. I informed him that if any of that shit came to my door that I would go ballistic. He then informed me that he wouldn't even be telling anybody that he'd been at ours. He knew where I was coming from. I like to further think that he went one step further to show his intent. He told me that a mutual person that we knew had told the whole town that we were 'speed freaks' I'm 99% certain that he gave me that as an act of his honest intentions. He even told me to steer clear of the bloke, and why.

Now, this is a man who has, to my minds eye, in the course of one evening about to have shown me his true colours vis a vis 'racism', and then gone onto provide me with some unasked for information that is very handy to know. This ammo,  has without doubt, helped in some of my decision making processes. 

So, to leave it at that, or not, I wonder!? It's now (via my wife actually, in a moment of pure lunacy, actually inviting him to Christmas dinner - to which he accepted) inevitable that our paths will cross. It'll happen sooner than that stated, I think, if truth be known. Do I bother trying to establish his views on race, I wonder? I can tell you know that he wouldn't be coming for Xmas dinner if he got the answer wrong. However, he knows that I know that he knows etc ie. he'll not slip up now. 

 

STOP PRESS. STOP PRESS - I've just told my wife (well, about 10 minutes ago) about this thread and the 'faggots' element of the 'altered' Pogues song. She, quite fantastically, blew up in a rage. Then she educated me. She said something along the lines of 'So, why hasn't , or isn't, anybody saying that it's wrong for him to come out with the words ' You're an old slut on junk'? She then went on to mention that there were fucking shed loads of songs out there that were staggeringly discriminatory towards women. She gave an example - this one;

 

And then she said that that was nothing, and that another and better example would be this one:

 

 

Then she returned to the Pogues song and said that there was no way that the BBC, or anybody else, should alter the lyrics. That the lyrics had been used to express a very heated argument between a couple, and that those are exactly the words that should be heard to express the intensity that Jem Finer and Shane MacGowan evidently meant to express.

Food for thought.

I absolutely lost it at the christmas dinner invite

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How we all missed this famous 'classic', I'll never know;

 

In my last job I only ever took corporate hospitality once (in 28 years). I probably could have taken it weekly, I suspect, but didn't. And then there was one occasion when a contractor asked me and a work colleague to go to his works Xmas bash. I was reluctant at first but then was persuaded. Well, it was a free slap up meal, free drink all night, and then free cocaine and a hotel room to stay the night in too. So, I did doo dat.

Anyway, when I got up for breakfast the next morning, the place was absolutely teeming with OAP's. It was like there was an OAP convention going on in the hotel, or something. And then I found out what it was. They were all Cliff Richard fans who were staying at the hotel having see Cliff perform at the NEC in Birmingham the night before. 

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