Mobile Tickets

[Matt42]

A thought this morning whether Glastonbury will eventually move to digital tickets. Or start using a virtual barcode / scanning system.

I know it has been a staple of the festival that you get a paper ticket, but with ways that businesses are looking to be more sustainable I wonder if Glastonbury will feel the urge to cut their paper usage. 

Also, the idea that someone could be denied access to an event because they left a small piece of paper at home seems a bit archaic. I doubt that it will be a priority for 2022 but I reckon in future years there may be a revamp of the ticket system.

[dentalplan]

Agree.

[Leyrulion]

I hope so. The stress of a) having moved and b) waiting for that special delivery could be removed.

Especially as royal mail is incredibly messed up in the northwest right now and there are stories of people only now getting Christmas cards.

[dotdash79]

8 minutes ago, Leyrulion said:

I hope so. The stress of a) having moved and b) waiting for that special delivery could be removed.

Especially as royal mail is incredibly messed up in the northwest right now and there are stories of people only now getting Christmas cards.

Tickets are sent via special delivery which uses a different postal network than the normal post. 
 

the environmental impact of having an electronic ticketing system is fairly high, you also force people to have a smart phone and to hold a charge for pass in and out. 

[Hugh Jass]

There’s no reason why they can’t really. Yes it’s nice to have a paper memento of the weekend but the financial and environmental benefits are obvious.

Maybe give people a choice - free e-ticket or a tenner for printing and delivery on a paper one.

[Matt42]

5 minutes ago, dotdash79 said:

Tickets are sent via special delivery which uses a different postal network than the normal post. 
 

the environmental impact of having an electronic ticketing system is fairly high, you also force people to have a smart phone and to hold a charge for pass in and out. 

This is a good point, but I would argue the pass in pass out method is even riskier. You need ANOTHER piece of fragile paper in order to get back in. I know the simple answer is to be careful but there’s a lot of factors which can mess up your weekend if you aren’t careful.

We all have mates who we reckon would be a prime candidate to face a cock up like this.

[dentalplan]

7 minutes ago, dotdash79 said:

the environmental impact of having an electronic ticketing system is fairly high, you also force people to have a smart phone and to hold a charge for pass in and out. 

Not as high as driving around the country posting out tickets.

Also people are forced to have a smart phone by paperless tickets as much as people are forced to have a postal address by paper tickets.

[Matt42]

5 minutes ago, dentalplan said:

Not as high as driving around the country posting out tickets.

Also people are forced to have a smart phone by paperless tickets as much as people are forced to have a postal address by paper tickets.

Whilst this “people forced to have a smartphone” argument holds weight, as time goes on this mentality needs to be phased out. Eventually things have to get with the times.

[Hugh Jass]

1 minute ago, Matt42 said:

Whilst this “people forced to have a smartphone” argument holds weight, as time goes on this mentality needs to be phased out. Eventually things have to get with the times.

You need an Internet connection just to buy a ticket these days. Can’t imagine there a many punters without a phone.

[Leyrulion]

22 minutes ago, dotdash79 said:

Tickets are sent via special delivery which uses a different postal network than the normal post. 
 

the environmental impact of having an electronic ticketing system is fairly high, you also force people to have a smart phone and to hold a charge for pass in and out. 

10 minutes ago, dentalplan said:

Not as high as driving around the country posting out tickets.

Also people are forced to have a smart phone by paperless tickets as much as people are forced to have a postal address by paper tickets.

As of 2021 only 12% of people didn't have a smart phone. It's a high likelihood that people paying nearly £300 for a festival are going to have a smart phone. 

In the unlikely event some attendees don't then they can print at home (or at a library!) Or have a friend scan the ticket in on their phone.

[Gnomicide]

Surely mobile tickets would be easier to pass on to someone else, mess with the photo if one is needed? Kind of buggers up the anti touting stance.

I guess they could use the NFC type that football clubs have started using but don't you need a wireless connection to endure it can update near the gate? They've caused chaos at matches around the country.

If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

[maelzoid]

E-ticket or print at home with a QR code seems the logical way forward. When the code is scanned it brings up the photo, which prevents forging / touting.

[stuartbert two hats]

How's this going to work with the photo ID? Will there need to be the facility to retrieve the photos of the ticket holder on scan? Putting the photo on the e-ticket would be much too easy to fake, so I guess you'd have to equip everyone at the gates with a bright, hi-res screen - probably something a bit more substantial than the average barcode reader terminal. And you'd need a network with much more bandwidth to deliver the images.

Now, none of these are insurmountable, especially in the long term, but it's not going to be the same setup as, say Parklife - the photo ID adds a whole layer of extra technical challenge.

Although once all this is in place, passouts should be simpler.

[dotdash79]

45 minutes ago, Matt42 said:

This is a good point, but I would argue the pass in pass out method is even riskier. You need ANOTHER piece of fragile paper in order to get back in. I know the simple answer is to be careful but there’s a lot of factors which can mess up your weekend if you aren’t careful.

We all have mates who we reckon would be a prime candidate to face a cock up like this.

I know people who lose phones for fun. 
 

maybe the approach is e-ticket scan in. RFID wristband linked to e-ticket. Pass in and out are done by scanning the wrist band which brings up the id of who it’s assigned to. 
 

still you would hope for no network issues otherwise it would be chaos. 

[Matt42]

27 minutes ago, Gnomicide said:

Surely mobile tickets would be easier to pass on to someone else, mess with the photo if one is needed? Kind of buggers up the anti touting stance.

I guess they could use the NFC type that football clubs have started using but don't you need a wireless connection to endure it can update near the gate? They've caused chaos at matches around the country.

If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

It’s not that it’s broke, it’s that Glasto will be pretty much the only festival with paper tickets soon. It’s more of a get with the times thing than anything else.

[Matt42]

3 minutes ago, dotdash79 said:

I know people who lose phones for fun. . 

One of my friends basically has a track record for any time they go out they lose something.

They would sit down to have a cig. Put their phone on the ground next to them. And after the cig was done just get up and walk away leaving their phone there.

Some people are very bad at not losing things.

[Leyrulion]

36 minutes ago, stuartbert two hats said:

How's this going to work with the photo ID? Will there need to be the facility to retrieve the photos of the ticket holder on scan? Putting the photo on the e-ticket would be much too easy to fake, so I guess you'd have to equip everyone at the gates with a bright, hi-res screen - probably something a bit more substantial than the average barcode reader terminal. And you'd need a network with much more bandwidth to deliver the images.

Now, none of these are insurmountable, especially in the long term, but it's not going to be the same setup as, say Parklife - the photo ID adds a whole layer of extra technical challenge.

Although once all this is in place, passouts should be simpler.

That's an interesting point about bandwidth. EE are touting their ad about landing a plane from someone's living room so maybe they'd be up for it if it was asked for.

I know people who sell on their paper tickets so it's still an issue regardless but maybe not one that they need to change. It just would be a nicer guest experience if there wasn't the hassle of paper tickets. 

[Deaf Nobby Burton]

I’m sure the system would work fine, however if it was based on say, a QR code it would inevitably lead to tons of people turning up with pictures of peoples e-tickets they had been sold, a lot like what happened at the Euro final in the summer. Someone unscrupulous who got access to an e-ticket could easily sell it on to gullible people 1000+ times. Obviously they wouldn’t get in but it could lead to more people being defrauded.

[stuie]

59 minutes ago, Leyrulion said:

As of 2021 only 12% of people didn't have a smart phone. It's a high likelihood that people paying nearly £300 for a festival are going to have a smart phone. 

Whilst I don't know anyone without a smart phone these days, I know several who leave them at home/in their car and switch to using a Nokia for some reason or another! 

[Matt42]

22 minutes ago, Deaf Nobby Burton said:

I’m sure the system would work fine, however if it was based on say, a QR code it would inevitably lead to tons of people turning up with pictures of peoples e-tickets they had been sold, a lot like what happened at the Euro final in the summer. Someone unscrupulous who got access to an e-ticket could easily sell it on to gullible people 1000+ times. Obviously they wouldn’t get in but it could lead to more people being defrauded.

The issue is that there is very little Glasto can do to stop all defrauding. The current paper ticket system was a good alternative but it only runs for as long as paper is the best option. 

The thing that I can’t get over is how it’s still the case that someone could lose a small bit of paper in the run up to the festival and not be able to enter. Whether or not there is a possible risk of defrauding involved with fixing that is beyond the issue tbh. People would now expect technology which is years ahead of that and more with the times. They will have been used to this being the case at various other events they go to.

Edited January 29, 2022 by Matt42

[Leyrulion]

4 minutes ago, Matt42 said:

The issue is that there is very little Glasto can do to stop all defrauding. The current paper ticket system was a good alternative but it only runs for as long as paper is the best option. 

The thing that I can’t get over is how it’s still the case that someone could lose a small bit of paper in the run up to the festival and not be able to enter. Whether or not there is a possible risk of defrauding involved with fixing that is beyond the issue tbh. People would now expect technology which is years ahead of that and more with the times. They will have been used to this being the case at various other events they go to.

Tbh you can still defraud with the paper ticket. You see quite a few posts around festival time that are like "mid length brown haired, brown eyes white male" ticket for sale. 

People chance their luck with the stewards at the gate not asking too many questions.

[incident]

1 hour ago, stuartbert two hats said:

How's this going to work with the photo ID? Will there need to be the facility to retrieve the photos of the ticket holder on scan? Putting the photo on the e-ticket would be much too easy to fake, so I guess you'd have to equip everyone at the gates with a bright, hi-res screen - probably something a bit more substantial than the average barcode reader terminal. And you'd need a network with much more bandwidth to deliver the images.

Agree with all of that, and just to add when you say "gates", it doesn't just mean the 6 main public gates. Depends on exactly how you define a gate but there'd need to be at least 19 separate sites.

[maelzoid]

This is all easily solved.

The e-ticket is essentially a QR code which the holder can print at home or keep on an app.

At the gate, the staff scans the QR code with a smart phone (a similar setup as used by ticket inspectors on trains) which links it to a database and brings up the photo, in better definition than would be printed on the ticket. This database can be pre-loaded into the phones so that does not require them having perfect connectivity. They would have the photos for months, so this can all be done way in advance.

If they can ensure good connectivity then they can also tick off who has already entered and essentially bar that ticket from entering again, unless that person passes back out with another scan.

[Matt42]

2 minutes ago, maelzoid said:

This is all easily solved.

The e-ticket is essentially a QR code which the holder can print at home or keep on an app.

At the gate, the staff scans the QR code with a smart phone (a similar setup as used by ticket inspectors on trains) which links it to a database and brings up the photo, in better definition than would be printed on the ticket. This database can be pre-loaded into the phones so that does not require them having perfect connectivity. They would have the photos for months, so this can all be done way in advance.

If they can ensure good connectivity then they can also tick off who has already entered and essentially bar that ticket from entering again, unless that person passes back out with another scan.

Dude you’re not supposed to give ideas like this away for free!

[Tuna]

^ Literally the exact same system used for the Radiohead tour in 2012. It's not exactly novel!