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When will this shit end?


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34 minutes ago, JoeyT said:

I don't see how wearing a mask will encourage customers visiting the store to wear one? If someone goes in to a shop not wearing a mask they already see a visual reminder of 99% of other customers wearing a mask so not sure how staff wearing masks changes this behaviour.

I think just an element of herd behaviour on that tbh, especially as people by nature look to bend or stretch rules to the point where they can get away with something.

If you're asked / told to wear a mask in a shop and see a customer not wearing one, you think "well that person's not obeying the rules", but if most people are wearing them then you see that person as an outlier and it has less impact on your behaviour.  You might think that the shop can't enforce it on everyone, or recognise they're in a difficult position to try and do so.

But if the shop's own employees aren't wearing them, I would say people are more likely to question the validity of doing it at all.  An employer has a much greater degree of control over their staff's behaviour than they do their customers'.  If it was actually that important to wear a mask, surely the shop would make their staff do it?  Or you'd think that "you're telling me to do it but you're not doing it yourself, so why should I?".

I think it takes away some of the shop's credibility or leverage by not doing what they tell their customers to do.

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I think on a music festival message board it’s a legitimate question to ask. It doesn’t suggest the OP doesn’t give a shit about anything else. Of course there are much bigger things to be worrie

Prince Charles is isolating at Balmoral with COVID-19. Prince Andrew is isolating at Windsor with Jenny, 14.

Like I said I found the comments unfair on our great prime minister anyway downvote removed! Given the circumstances he is doing a brilliant job 

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12 minutes ago, Mr.Tease said:

People aren't robots though - vulnerable people want to see their kids or grand kids (and vice versa) , it's torture for them not to be able to. It's like me saying to you, why don't you just not go to the pub? 

and  some of these people have jobs and have no choice in what they do .... my work is the most risky thing I do 

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1 minute ago, zahidf said:

Not really if you gave it to them when you went on a pub crawl, and they are just working in a shop being careful

Okay I take your point that the guy on the checkouts in Aldi might be vulnerable. I'd argue transmission is highly unlikely in this scenario because:

 

- I would be wearing a face covering

- They would be behind a screen

- We'd be 1m apart physically

- We'd only be in contact for 2-3 minutes, not 15.

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4 minutes ago, Quark said:

I think just an element of herd behaviour on that tbh, especially as people by nature look to bend or stretch rules to the point where they can get away with something.

If you're asked / told to wear a mask in a shop and see a customer not wearing one, you think "well that person's not obeying the rules", but if most people are wearing them then you see that person as an outlier and it has less impact on your behaviour.  You might think that the shop can't enforce it on everyone, or recognise they're in a difficult position to try and do so.

But if the shop's own employees aren't wearing them, I would say people are more likely to question the validity of doing it at all.  An employer has a much greater degree of control over their staff's behaviour than they do their customers'.  If it was actually that important to wear a mask, surely the shop would make their staff do it?  Or you'd think that "you're telling me to do it but you're not doing it yourself, so why should I?".

I think it takes away some of the shop's credibility or leverage by not doing what they tell their customers to do.

Absolutely and far better put than I have been able to convey .... shops with the same government guidelines have very different uptake levels ... thats one of my major gripes with them not being mandated across the board .... why should one retail worker have more protection than another working for the same company depending on how seriously the message is taken and delivered 

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16 minutes ago, Mr.Tease said:

People aren't robots though - vulnerable people want to see their kids or grand kids (and vice versa) , it's torture for them not to be able to. It's like me saying to you, why don't you just not go to the pub? 

I'm not doing any of the stuff I really want to at the moment.  I'm going to rugby but I'm training away from everyone else because at the moment I think it's moving too quickly.  I saw my brother the other week and he forgot himself a bit so I had to physically push him away from giving me a hug.  I saw my parents at the weekend but have to keep my distance from them.  My father in law's really poorly but I can't spend time with him or give my mother in law a hug.

You're right, we're not robots. So it hurts. A lot. but at the moment that's just the way it is. Sorry.

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1 minute ago, steviewevie said:

err...well, yeah...I guess...not sure what we're talking about here...aren't we saying that young people should be more careful to stop the spread and save granny?

 

I'm making the point that when Matt Cockblock says all these people are going to kill their granny, some of us are deliberately avoiding vulnerable people like our granny (I'm seeing mine, but mine is not vulnerable and is seeing plenty of people herself)

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1 minute ago, Fuzzy Afro said:

 

I'm making the point that when Matt Cockblock says all these people are going to kill their granny, some of us are deliberately avoiding vulnerable people like our granny (I'm seeing mine, but mine is not vulnerable and is seeing plenty of people herself)

yes, but I think Handjob is saying that more it spreads, then more likely will spread to older people who are more vulnerable.

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1 minute ago, Fuzzy Afro said:

 

I'm making the point that when Matt Cockblock says all these people are going to kill their granny, some of us are deliberately avoiding vulnerable people like our granny (I'm seeing mine, but mine is not vulnerable and is seeing plenty of people herself)

It's just putting it in a simplistic, relatable term that 95% of the population can relate to.  It takes Covid away from being this vague concept that you know is a problem but isn't affecting you directly apart from stopping you going to the pub, and puts it into the context of killing someone close to you.  By putting it onto someone or something a person can visualise and comprehend, it makes it more real.

(That's the general "you" btw, not you specifically).

I hate this government's habit of reducing things to simplistic three word shitty slogans, but this is one of the rare cases where that simplistic message is (I think) the right thing to do.

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59 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

Next big u-turn could be the ending of the furlough scheme...

On one hand, that would make sense as it would continue to protect jobs in places with restrictions on operating e.g. I know of people who work in shops with limited floor space where some are furloughed some aren't. 

On the other hand, this government is a fucking shitshow and will plunge us over the cliff in the name of ideological purity in the name of Brexit no matter the cost. Not to mention, they are loathe to give any money to us proles. 

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2 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

yes, but I think Handjob is saying that more it spreads, then more likely will spread to older people who are more vulnerable.

he  might have forgotten that the vulnerable are out and about now ..... Shielding has ended .... and thats definitely not the decision of youngsters ..... the balls are in the court of that cock 

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Scotland update. If they take action this week it’s quite possible england will follow too.

“During her daily briefing, she announced a further 146 new positive cases. That's down from the 208 reported on Sunday, which was the highest daily increase in positive tests since May.

There have been no new deaths in Scotland in the past 24 hours, but Ms Sturgeon said hospital admissions were now rising. 

More than half of the new cases (78) were in the Greater Glasgow area, where renewed restrictions on family visiting in three local authority areas were put in place last week. 

The first minister said those restrictions were being reviewed today - along with the possibility of extending them to other council areas within the Greater Glasgow and Clyde health board area. 

The review of national Scottish restrictions takes place later this week, and Ms Sturgeon said in the light of the new figures the government may have to "put the brakes on" easing them further”.

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1 minute ago, crazyfool1 said:

he  might have forgotten that the vulnerable are out and about now ..... Shielding has ended .... and thats definitely not the decision of youngsters ..... the balls are in the court of that cock 

yeah, so need to stop the spread by youngsters sticking to the rules.

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As I’ve been saying for ages now masks need to be compulsory for shop workers to protect the staff from further outbreaks and further improve customer compliance.

I also believe masks should be mandatory for pub and restaurant staff and should be mandatory for customers when in those indoor spaces but not sat at your table, this will have a massive effect on reducing transmission in outbreaks in pubs and restaurants and bars.

Contact tracing needs to be mandatory from now on, if you don’t provide details, name, phone and address, you can’t eat there.

Get rapid testing going and all airport arrivals get a free rapid test.

Face coverings mandatory in all secondary schools apart from when sat at desks in lessons.

All of these things can stop a second wave being as bad as we are forecasting right now. Right now we are witnessing number of cases going up, hospital admissions starting to slowly increase BUT public compliance of social distancing and mask wearing is going down. This needs to be turned around, and fast.

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3 minutes ago, FestivalJamie said:

Scotland update. If they take action this week it’s quite possible england will follow too.

“During her daily briefing, she announced a further 146 new positive cases. That's down from the 208 reported on Sunday, which was the highest daily increase in positive tests since May.

There have been no new deaths in Scotland in the past 24 hours, but Ms Sturgeon said hospital admissions were now rising. 

More than half of the new cases (78) were in the Greater Glasgow area, where renewed restrictions on family visiting in three local authority areas were put in place last week. 

The first minister said those restrictions were being reviewed today - along with the possibility of extending them to other council areas within the Greater Glasgow and Clyde health board area. 

The review of national Scottish restrictions takes place later this week, and Ms Sturgeon said in the light of the new figures the government may have to "put the brakes on" easing them further”.

 

Almost certain Lanarkshire is going to be added to the "no household visitation" in the next 24 hours and unfortunately there's a small but non-zero chance the whole of Scotland will follow by Thursday. I am also hearing that some senior voices in the Scottish government are lobbying to extend Glasgow's restrictions to a full blown local lockdown with pubs and restaurants closing and residents advised to stay at home apart from shopping and exercise.

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3 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

yeah, so need to stop the spread by youngsters sticking to the rules.

I’m a “youngster” and I haven’t broken a single guideline all of this time.

The issue is, most other young people don’t give a damn. Unless you put laws and fines in to physically stop people doing something, and enforce it, then they aren’t going to stop.

This is evidenced in Manchester where it’s against the guidelines to go round to each other’s houses but people are doing it anyway.

We can blame people all we want but unless the government take concrete action to stop the spread it will just keep getting worse.

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1 minute ago, FestivalJamie said:

As I’ve been saying for ages now masks need to be compulsory for shop workers to protect the staff from further outbreaks and further improve customer compliance.

I also believe masks should be mandatory for pub and restaurant stuff and should be mandatory for customers when in those indoor spaces but not sat at your table, this will have a massive effect on reducing transmission in outbreaks in pubs and restaurants and bars.

Contact tracing needs to be mandatory from now on, if you don’t provide details, name, phone and address, you can’t eat there.

Get rapid testing going and all airport arrivals get a free rapid test.

Face coverings mandatory in all secondary schools apart from when sat at desks in lessons.

All of these things can stop a second wave being as bad as we are forecasting right now. Right now we are witnessing number of cases going up, hospital admissions starting to slowly increase BUT public compliance of social distancing and mask wearing is going down. This needs to be turned around, and fast.

My friend went to a spoons on sat evening and I choose to stay in ... I asked what their contact tracing was .... small bars often have apps ... a multinational like spoons had a few scraps of paper on a table by the entrance but nobody enforcing the sign in ... no hope if that place gets an outbreak :( 

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2 minutes ago, FestivalJamie said:

I’m a “youngster” and I haven’t broken a single guideline all of this time.

The issue is, most other young people don’t give a damn. Unless you put laws and fines in to physically stop people doing something, and enforce it, then they aren’t going to stop.

This is evidenced in Manchester where it’s against the guidelines to go round to each other’s houses but people are doing it anyway.

We can blame people all we want but unless the government take concrete action to stop the spread it will just keep getting worse.

 

I think it's actually illegal, not just against the guidelines

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4 minutes ago, Fuzzy Afro said:

 

Almost certain Lanarkshire is going to be added to the "no household visitation" in the next 24 hours and unfortunately there's a small but non-zero chance the whole of Scotland will follow by Thursday. I am also hearing that some senior voices in the Scottish government are lobbying to extend Glasgow's restrictions to a full blown local lockdown with pubs and restaurants closing and residents advised to stay at home apart from shopping and exercise.

I was just reading on the news sturgeon is under pressure to close pubs down.

 

Just now, Fuzzy Afro said:

 

I think it's actually illegal, not just against the guidelines

Oh right, that wasn’t even clear to me at all and I’ve been keeping on top of it pretty well! I imagine no one is enforcing it though!

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Im off to Uni Saturday and living in halls of residence... Ive had no guidance on COVID precautions. So, Im living with 8 people. Do I wear a mask in communal areas? What happens when socialising in common room and things.. I will likely come back home most weekends so what happens if my local area goes into local lockdown am i then classed as a visitor to my own home or can I stay without worrying.., Im confused.

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1 minute ago, SDSM said:

Im off to Uni Saturday and living in halls of residence... Ive had no guidance on COVID precautions. So, Im living with 8 people. Do I wear a mask in communal areas? What happens when socialising in common room and things.. I will likely come back home most weekends so what happens if my local area goes into local lockdown am i then classed as a visitor to my own home or can I stay without worrying.., Im confused.

 

Your 7 flatmates count as your household members so no need to wear a mask or distance from them

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