When will this shit end?

[RobertProsineckisLighter]

3 minutes ago, Fuzzy Afro said:

Deal done to move South Yorkshire into Tier 3. 

Wonder what Dan Jarvis and the leaders have accepted. Couple of million and a repaint of the Dickie Bird statue?

[Zoo Music Girl]

1 hour ago, Gregfc15 said:

People keep saying this, but never seem to have any more detail in how it would work other than the phrase?

Who looks after the vulnerable? Do Doctors and Nurses need to isolate as well to protect them? Does anyone who lives with a doctor or nurse need to isolate? Does anyone who may be a contact or have a vulnerable family member need to isolate? What even is vulnerable? Just old people? Is it everyone with High blood pressure? Everyone obese? People with diabetes? People with MS or other auto-immune disease? People with cancer or kidney disease? What is the effect on the death rate if this cohort can’t get treatment because the hospitals are full of covid patients? 

If it’s not just locking old people up, but anyone vulnerable to COVID through an pre-existing comorbidity then what is the effect of that on an economy? Who is driving the buses or freight trucks or working in factories or logistics centres? Who is still shuffling paper across their desk in an office? Who is performing all the roles that help an economy keep ticking if all these people are shielding? What is the effect of an unchecked pandemic running amok on economy? Are the people working from home still being active in the economy and eating out, buying coffee, spending money? Sweden still had an 8% GDP drop. , US 10%, Brazil 9.7% Peru 30%, all places that let it rip through. They may bounce back but let’s see. I’d bet that the places that have supressed the virus and are able to kick start their internal economies with confidence in the population that you won’t catch something by stepping out of your door will have the best Q.3’s

It’s an absolute nonsense phrase that means absolutely nothing.  There is no ability to just carry on. It’s a highly contagious virus that grows exponentially and through people who don’t even know they are sick. You can either lockdown, let it rip or find a middle way that allows the economy to function while minimising risk. You can only achieve this middle way by keeping cases as low as possible with a good testing and competent contact tracing system that can stomp out any clusters. Lockdowns are not a punishment or a tactic to fight the virus, they are an acknowldgement that you have lost control.

Eight f’n months and somehow this is still a debate.

 

(also i don't mean this as an attack, i just really really really hate that phrase...)

Amen to that. Don't know why this point needs to keep being made over and over for some, but you make it very well.

[Andre91]

Looks like we are heading for Tier 3 in Doncaster then. To be fair, cases have exploded here over the last couple of weeks, with just under 1000 new cases in the last week. I hope that the financial package they’ve secured is suitable. 

[steviewevie]

 

[Fuzzy Afro]

1 minute ago, steviewevie said:

 

That’s not a bad shout to let them keep the regional approach while getting cases down in the areas that need attention. So no national lockdown, but areas in the highest tiers get a full stay at home order for 3 weeks. 

[Zoo Music Girl]

1 minute ago, steviewevie said:

 

Can't say I'm surprised to read this. It does seem like we are all gradually heading for a circuit breaker of some kind, bit by bit. Whether that can work on a regional rather than national basis I'm not sure. I guess we have a direct comparison we can make to Ireland, Northern Ireland and to a lesser extent Wales (though hard to see what two weeks will do really). This does seem a pretty messy and complicated way of doing things to me.

[Ozanne]

Just now, Zoo Music Girl said:

Can't say I'm surprised to read this. It does seem like we are all gradually heading for a circuit breaker of some kind, bit by bit. Whether that can work on a regional rather than national basis I'm not sure. I guess we have a direct comparison we can make to Ireland, Northern Ireland and to a lesser extent Wales (though hard to see what two weeks will do really). This does seem a pretty messy and complicated way of doing things to me.

I think it should be on a national basis, whilst the cases aren’t high in my area they are rising. So why not be proactive and get ahead of it now for 2/3 weeks? With full furlough of course. 

[Crazyfool01]

Just now, Fuzzy Afro said:

That’s not a bad shout to let them keep the regional approach while getting cases down in the areas that need attention. So no national lockdown, but areas in the highest tiers get a full stay at home order for 3 weeks. 

So ignore the areas just short then because a few cases per 100,000 makes all the difference ... when nearly all those areas will be rising and above previous thresholds for measures .... a unified national approach is needed 

[Zoo Music Girl]

1 minute ago, Ozanne said:

I think it should be on a national basis, whilst the cases aren’t high in my area they are rising. So why not be proactive and get ahead of it now for 2/3 weeks? With full furlough of course. 

Yeah I agree. Would just be too sensible though. They seem determined to continue making a total fuck up of everything.

[mcshed]

20 minutes ago, Fuzzy Afro said:

There were 2.2m people in the UK classed as extremely vulnerable, so this is around 3%-4% of the population I believe. These are the people who would be shielded under the plan. 

Under shielding the last time round not only where those shielding taking extra precautions, the whole country was under lockdown so those people that shielders have to interact were also taking precautions. So in your protect the vulnerable strategy do those support staff, carers, doctors, nurses, etc, have to protect in any way or are they fully part of the let it rip strategy?

[steviewevie]

5 minutes ago, Fuzzy Afro said:

That’s not a bad shout to let them keep the regional approach while getting cases down in the areas that need attention. So no national lockdown, but areas in the highest tiers get a full stay at home order for 3 weeks. 

I guess means govt wouldn't have to provide funding to areas not in the lockdown, even though their economies would be affected indirectly.

[Ozanne]

1 minute ago, Zoo Music Girl said:

Yeah I agree. Would just be too sensible though. They seem determined to continue making a total fuck up of everything.

What a country we live in when we scoff at idea that’s deemed too sensible hey 😆 Proactivity is never this governments strong suit.

3 minutes ago, crazyfool1 said:

So ignore the areas just short then because a few cases per 100,000 makes all the difference ... when nearly all those areas will be rising and above previous thresholds for measures .... a unified national approach is needed 

He’s just trying to get a response mate. 

[Reckoner]

22 minutes ago, Fuzzy Afro said:

Country with the world’s longest and strictest life lockdown also has the most deaths per million. 

World's strickest lockdown, but they don't have the required testing capacity, an overwhelmed health service that ran out of oxygen at one point and a lack of support for poor people meaning that they couldn't isolate. 

[Ozanne]

Isn’t it funny that Theresa May found £1 billion for the DUP to keep her in power. Boris’s government also found £6 billion of taxpayer money for a track and trace that doesn’t work
 
BUT 

They can’t find £5 million more for the north to stop them plunging into poverty? A figure that’s been costed by leaders from the north. 

[Crazyfool01]

Just now, Ozanne said:

Isn’t it funny that Theresa May found £1 billion for the DUP to keep her in power. Boris’s government also found £6 billion of taxpayer money for a track and trace that doesn’t work
 
BUT 

They can’t find £5 million more for the north to stop them plunging into poverty? A figure that’s been costed by leaders from the north. 

Wasn’t it 12 billion ? For track and trace .... 

[Zoo Music Girl]

I think the whole Manchester debacle was supposed to act as a bit of a warning too. Basically trying to deter any other local leaders from arguing with them. 

[eFestivals]

15 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

 

who knew that Spaffer and co would do things late at the start, and would keep on doing things late.  

 

[steviewevie]

2 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

who knew that Spaffer and co would do things late at the start, and would keep on doing things late.  

 

Scientists pushing it, but doesn't mean will happen.

[Ozanne]

2 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

Scientists pushing it, but doesn't mean will happen.

Any form of full lockdown will be seen as a failure by the government which is why they want to try to avoid it, even though it’s probably the best course of action now. 

[Crazyfool01]

4 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

Scientists pushing it, but doesn't mean will happen.

Although JVT  seems to have changed course slightly ... 

[JoeyT]

Does anyone know what the cases per 100,000 have to be for entry into tiers 2 & 3?

[dotdash79]

2 minutes ago, JoeyT said:

Does anyone know what the cases per 100,000 have to be for entry into tiers 2 & 3?

Or to get out of them

[stuartbert two hats]

8 hours ago, DeanoL said:

You say left and right there, but it’s the government (right) pushing to shut down Manchester to save lives and incur economic damage, versus a Labour mayor (left) who prefers to protect the cities economy and doesn’t want a lock down. 

I'm not aware of Burnham saying he didn't want a lockdown, just that there needed to be enough support.

[RobertProsineckisLighter]

8 minutes ago, JoeyT said:

Does anyone know what the cases per 100,000 have to be for entry into tiers 2 & 3?

It's not just based on numbers alone there isn't just a series of thresholds. 

[Zoo Music Girl]

Hancock saying the 60m is still available if Manchester want it now. I know they wanted 65m. Didn't the government take it away entirely yesterday? Is this them trying to row back a bit after seeing the negative reactions?