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When will this shit end?


Chrisp1986

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Just now, fraybentos1 said:

I mean you just gave anecdotal evidence about how restrictions atm aren't that bad cause you can do most of things you want to do.

Also, I wasn't talking about me I am talking about the numerous people I know around my age. It makes no sense really that young people would be worried about covid especially now their granny is double vacccined

My point is more around the fact that the real test for interest in festivals will be clear in about 2 years time. You do realise many of them were on a knife edge pre covid? 

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Sigh, and it was going so well.  In my opinion shows the right decision was made to wait two weeks to see whether this impacts on serious cases in hospitals.  Whatever your comfort level is, I feel this is the end game with the Delta variant being some end of game boss.

On the plus side another 0 death day.

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5 minutes ago, crazyfool1 said:

It’s not clearly still there … there is demand for the remaining small number of tickets … we only see if it’s still there when we normalise the number of festivals without tickets rolling over 

There isn't that much less supply. Despite stuff not happening yet, lots is still being put on sale and selling well. Primavera the other day first weekend sold no problem. All Points East usually struggles but the Jamie XX day sold out rapid when I seriously doubt it normally would have. Read and Leeds. The list goes on...

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1 minute ago, aj6658 said:

I mean I literally say im not expecting it to go back to normal straight on the 21st but good attempt reading 

 

Its data not dates and delaying 21st - the 4 criteria are 

 

  1. The vaccine deployment programme continues successfully. - Has been met 

  2. Evidence shows vaccines are sufficiently effective in reducing hospitalisations and deaths in those vaccinated. - less than 1000 people in hospital, those who are being hospitalised are seeing not as severely ill. Cases are rising but we're not seeing a huge increase in hospitalisations. in fact the 7 days average is falling 

  3. Infection rates do not risk a surge in hospitalisations which would put unsustainable pressure on the NHS. - see above

  4. Our assessment of the risks is not fundamentally changed by new Variants of Concern. - where's the evidence that VOC have been more dangerous ? Vaccines still working. Multiple times been told its broken the link

 

Why does waiting one for everyone to be invited be the criteria ? They could literally open it up to everyone tomorrow and they would of met your criteria even it it meant they would get it in August 

Because they were foolish enough to expect people to understand that if variants unknown at that time cause differing statistics, that will change the equation.

They underestimated the number of people who’d say “bUT YoU sAiD jUnE 21sT!!1”

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1 minute ago, kalifire said:

They underestimated the number of people who’d say “bUT YoU sAiD jUnE 21sT!!1”

There is definetly a group of people who fall into the 'BUT YOU SAID' category, that are becoming quite irritating. 

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2 minutes ago, MrBarry465 said:

My point is more around the fact that the real test for interest in festivals will be clear in about 2 years time. You do realise many of them were on a knife edge pre covid? 

I think it bodes well if people are booking them when it isn't even 100% they will happen. Look, I'm not saying I can speak for everyone under 30, but it seems clear to me that a lot of us feel cooped up and a bit bored of all this and absolutely cannot wait to get back to normal gigs.

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1 minute ago, fraybentos1 said:

There isn't that much less supply. Despite stuff not happening yet, lots is still being put on sale and selling well. Primavera the other day first weekend sold no problem. All Points East usually struggles but the Jamie XX day sold out rapid when I seriously doubt it normally would have. Read and Leeds. The list goes on...

Ok so the people not attending Glastonbury this year or any of the other U.K. festivals that have gone … those people will be wanting the remaining tickets from a smaller festival pot … so demand isn’t accurate untill we get a full year … some people will be booking banker festivals too … 

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11 minutes ago, MrBarry465 said:

Your correct it is anecdotal. It's got nothiunbg to do with COVID, it's more about how young peoples interests at large are changing. Something like 30% of young people in England do not drink.

You literally post on a festival forum, your anecdotal evidence is likely skewed.....

 

A - Do you have a source for this?

 

B - Do you have any reason to believe this will affect festival demand? Plenty people drink Fanta and sprite at festivals. 

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4 minutes ago, MrBarry465 said:

There is definetly a group of people who fall into the 'BUT YOU SAID' category, that are becoming quite irritating. 

It's nothing to do with "You said June 21st".

However it is and should be everything to do with "You said X criteria" - which as pointed out above has been met.

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2 minutes ago, Fuzzy Afro said:

A - Do you have a source for this?

 

B - Do you have any reason to believe this will affect festival demand? Plenty people drink Fanta and sprite at festivals. 

Or water and a disco biscuit. 😄 

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2 minutes ago, Fuzzy Afro said:

A - Do you have a source for this?

 

B - Do you have any reason to believe this will affect festival demand? Plenty people drink Fanta and sprite at festivals. 

A. Yes https://www.theguardian.com/society/2018/oct/10/young-people-drinking-alcohol-study-england

B. I don't think it's unreasonable to assume that festivals will change. I mean people rarely club these days, pre covid I am saying. It's not unreasonable to assume that Music Festivals might scale down.

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Just realised a work colleage in my office is a bit of an anti-vaxxers...well, more a vaccine hesitancyer. Was asking her why she won't take it, and she was saying that for her risks outweigh the benefits, that they probably aren't as good as gov making out etc. I just left it, didn't know what to say.

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6 minutes ago, incident said:

It's nothing to do with "You said June 21st".

However it is and should be everything to do with "You said X criteria" - which as pointed out above has been met.

In a sense, it doesn’t matter who’s to blame (the government for not pointing out what should be an obvious caveat, or the people who didn’t grasp that). The wider issue is that if a short lockdown extension can prevent unnecessary harm, people should stop being so entitled and suck it up for a few more weeks. They’ll still get the majority of summer, ffs. 

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Just now, kalifire said:

In a sense, it doesn’t matter who’s to blame (the government for not pointing out what should be an obvious caveat, or the people who didn’t grasp that). The wider - and only - issue is that if a lockdown prevents unnecessary harm, people should stop being so entitled and suck it up for a few more weeks. They’ll still get the majority of summer, ffs. 

Well for a bunch of us its easy to suck it up. But for others it will literally put them out of business and people will lose their livelihoods etc... so im sure they would tell you to suck it up and open up? 

It makes little difference to me other than going to a festival. But for a lot of people it makes a massive difference. 

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2 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

I think there will be a massive demand for festivals, gigs, nightclubs etc etc when all this is over.

I think the demand is already there... we just cant go to them haha 

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4 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

Just realised a work colleage in my office is a bit of an anti-vaxxers...well, more a vaccine hesitancyer. Was asking her why she won't take it, and she was saying that for her risks outweigh the benefits, that they probably aren't as good as gov making out etc. I just left it, didn't know what to say.

Dangerous ground potentially - assume she is old and wise enough to make her own decisions without needing to justify it to anybody else. If anything, that approach could lead to a greater division between those who want the vaccine and those that don’t. 

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Go on, I’ll bite..
 

  1. The vaccine deployment programme continues successfully. - Has been met. I mean it’s wobbled a bit the last few months, and if the rest of the country followed Wales’ lead we probably wouldn’t be having this conversation as we’d probably be at h*** i*********. But it is fundamentally there.

  2. Evidence shows vaccines are sufficiently effective in reducing hospitalisations and deaths in those vaccinated. - less than 1000 people in hospital, those who are being hospitalised are seeing not as severely ill. Cases are rising but we're not seeing a huge increase in hospitalisations. in fact the 7 days average is falling. Purely on the point vaccines are reducing the numbers in the fully vaccinated I’d also agree this has been met. Annoying AF when someone treats any story of them working as 100% effective and not doing everything as 0%. They’re neither. But a hell of a lot closer to 100%.

  3. Infection rates do not risk a surge in hospitalisations which would put unsustainable pressure on the NHS. - see above. Got to disagree here. 20 positive tests is still pretty consistently tracking to 1 hospital admission. Fully appreciate they’re at a low baseline, but cases are going up exponentially. What I haven't seen is a plan how that’s going to stop, or won’t be aggravated by going to zero restrictions. I’m hoping that another month of jabbing will reduce its critical mass. But I haven’t seen the evidence of that yet.

  4. Our assessment of the risks is not fundamentally changed by new Variants of Concern. - where's the evidence that VOC have been more dangerous ? Vaccines still working. Multiple times been told its broken the link. If it spreads to more people (which there is a consensus that it does even if there isn’t on the number) even if it’s not as dangerous for each person, the cumulative effect does change the risk profile.

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2 minutes ago, st dan said:

Dangerous ground potentially - assume she is old and wise enough to make her own decisions without needing to justify it to anybody else. If anything, that approach could lead to a greater division between those who want the vaccine and those that don’t. 

yeah, exactly. She's mid 30s, asian, new mother...who knows what's going on...not my business etc....but we were talking in group meeting about a new starter not being seated near her as she hasn't been vaccinated...

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7 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

Just realised a work colleage in my office is a bit of an anti-vaxxers...well, more a vaccine hesitancyer. Was asking her why she won't take it, and she was saying that for her risks outweigh the benefits, that they probably aren't as good as gov making out etc. I just left it, didn't know what to say.

Mrs Starbuck has a couple of friends like this, and it’s very frustrating. No real reasons, just more of a “I’ll do it when I get round to it after everyone else” kind of attitude.

Neither are getting an invite to our flat until they’re at least booked in. 

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5 minutes ago, kalifire said:

In a sense, it doesn’t matter who’s to blame (the government for not pointing out what should be an obvious caveat, or the people who didn’t grasp that). The wider issue is that if a short lockdown extension can prevent unnecessary harm, people should stop being so entitled and suck it up for a few more weeks. They’ll still get the majority of summer, ffs. 

Agreed, but an issue that some will have is that after a month delay, what is stopping something happening again leading to another couple of weeks delay for example. And before you know it another summer is gone. People do kind of need some date to work towards.
That’s why they need to say that a four week delay will lead to ‘x’ more people have their second vaccine, plus ‘y’ more younger people having their first dose, which means that we predict ‘xyz’ will happen to hospitalisations and deaths. 

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58 minutes ago, fraybentos1 said:

Nah it is not outrageous, it just seems like a position that could keep pushing things back and back. Too far back and the wave comes over winter and then it'll be like right let's just wait till spring then.

Also, where I am I've only been able to go into a pub for the first time since Saturday just gone. I'd say that is pretty shite and restrictive to me and that has been over 6 months of that. You can go to pubs for like 2 hour slots at allocated times and barely move about. It's shite, restrictive and needs gone asap. I don't think people are exaggerating when they say that even tho it is better that February that this isn't shite and nowhere near normal. The bar was very very low.

I'll be really interested to see what happens to pubs when we open up fully. My prediction is that around half will go back to full capacity and half will stick to table service and booking, maybe with tables a bit closer together. And I think that after the initial rush, the second half will get more business - because why go to the "dangerous" pub when you can go to the "safe" one as long as you book in advance. 

45 minutes ago, st dan said:

What if you owned a small local bar or restaurant - would your views change then? I’m sure they would. 

The thing is, they've been unable to operate properly for 15 months now. Will more go out of business if we delay another month? Yes, definitely. But no more than have gone out of business and wouldn't have if we opened up on 21 May, a month earlier instead. It's not like every pub has this line in the sand of 21 June and they'll start dropping like flies if we don't hit it.

(And what will properly fuck up pubs is if we get this wrong and re-open, then have to shut down again, and all that stock spoils again.)

44 minutes ago, fraybentos1 said:

Also tonnes of weddings and funerals ruined. Big family events, holidays. The list goes on and on. I don't get how people can be so blase about it and accept the bare minimum

It was always "no earlier" than 21 June. If people have been booking weddings, funerals and holidays they were aware of the risks. I actually have a friend's wedding at the end of July - they're not concerned because they knew they were getting married in the middle of a pandemic. They knew when they booked it they might end up having to move it, have fewer people, or do distancing or other measures. They made the choice to go ahead anyway. They won't be happy if restrictions get in the way of the wedding but they knew that was the chance they were taking and won't be mad about it. 

That, to me, is the only sensible attitude. 

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Just now, st dan said:

Agreed, but an issue that some will have is that after a month delay, what is stopping something happening again leading to another couple of weeks delay for example. And before you know it another summer is gone. People do kind of need some date to work towards.
That’s why they need to say that a four week delay will lead to ‘x’ more people have their second vaccine, plus ‘y’ more younger people having their first dose, which means that we predict ‘xyz’ will happen to hospitalisations and deaths. 

i could just about agree to another 2 week extension if it meant the last extension just to get more jabs in

 

Absolutely not another 'not before' date. Weve got 80% antibody prevalence and the NHS guys are saying the link is broken between cases and hospitalisations. Enough is enough. 

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4 minutes ago, st dan said:

Agreed, but an issue that some will have is that after a month delay, what is stopping something happening again leading to another couple of weeks delay for example. And before you know it another summer is gone. People do kind of need some date to work towards.
That’s why they need to say that a four week delay will lead to ‘x’ more people have their second vaccine, plus ‘y’ more younger people having their first dose, which means that we predict ‘xyz’ will happen to hospitalisations and deaths. 

With the way the climate is going, you will be glad to know summer is likely extended into September/October. So not all doom and gloom 🙂

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