When will this shit end?

[Ozanne]

Independent Sage have no bearing on if we go back into lockdown anyway.

[tigger123]

Just now, Ozanne said:

Independent Sage have no bearing on if we go back into lockdown anyway.

They do indirectly, their views get picked up by sensationalist click hungry media, public read said media, get scared, pressure grows in the polls to lockdown, mps listen to their constituents, lockdown happens

[Crazyfool01]

1 minute ago, JoeyT said:

There is most definitely a variant brigade. Independent sage being the circus masters of it.

I agree regarding your first point however.

I still don’t get why they would push for further lockdowns ... that helps nobody ... they are scientists that I would think develop a reputation based on accuracy ... so the more out they are the more discredited they become ... and of course they aren’t actually going to enjoy them nobody does ... despite the differences in how people cope with them ... an alternative opinion however outrageous is something to be considered and something that has been considered all the way through .. 

[Ozanne]

1 minute ago, tigger123 said:

They do indirectly, their views get picked up by sensationalist click hungry media, public read said media, get scared, pressure grows in the polls to lockdown, mps listen to their constituents, lockdown happens

The UK government took weeks to act when office Sage recommended we go into lockdown so I doubt they pay too much attention to Independent Sage. Anyway to say 'they will have us back in lockdown soon enough' is just hyperbole designed to seed anxiety.

[JoeyT]

3 minutes ago, crazyfool1 said:

I still don’t get why they would push for further lockdowns ... that helps nobody ... they are scientists that I would think develop a reputation based on accuracy ... so the more out they are the more discredited they become ... and of course they aren’t actually going to enjoy them nobody does ... despite the differences in how people cope with them ... an alternative opinion however outrageous is something to be considered and something that has been considered all the way through .. 

I don’t get it either but they have pushed for tighter measures all the way through and still are now. Even when all the data supports easing.

 

Just now, Ozanne said:

The UK government took weeks to act when office Sage recommended we go into lockdown so I doubt they pay too much attention to Independent Sage. Anyway to say 'they will have us back in lockdown soon enough' is just hyperbole designed to seed anxiety.

“Hyperbole designed to seed anxiety”

Or to everyone else, poking fun at a group of scientists who have been ridiculed throughout for their bonkers views.

[Ozanne]

5 minutes ago, JoeyT said:

I don’t get it either but they have pushed for tighter measures all the way through and still are now. Even when all the data supports easing.

 

“Hyperbole designed to seed anxiety”

Or to everyone else, poking fun at a group of scientists who have been ridiculed throughout for their bonkers views.

It just seems weird that on the day the pubs & shops reopened you've made a comment about people wanting us to go back into lockdown when the info you've shared doesn't point to that at all. 

Edited April 12, 2021 by Ozanne

[tigger123]

14 minutes ago, crazyfool1 said:

I still don’t get why they would push for further lockdowns ... that helps nobody ... they are scientists that I would think develop a reputation based on accuracy ... so the more out they are the more discredited they become ... and of course they aren’t actually going to enjoy them nobody does ... despite the differences in how people cope with them ... an alternative opinion however outrageous is something to be considered and something that has been considered all the way through .. 

covid news keeps them (independent sage) in the press and relevant. Who could name who the government chief scientific advisor was pre covid let alone any other epidemiologist. They like their time in the spotlight, probably are well off enough to have a decent house with a garden and are able to work from home so lockdown works ok for them, compared to a family cramped in a small 2 bed flat with no outdoor space and having to go into work every day. Makes a lot of sense to me

[Crazyfool01]

1 minute ago, tigger123 said:

covid news keeps them (independent sage) in the press and relevant. Who could name who the government chief scientific advisor was pre covid let alone any other epidemiologist. They like their time in the spotlight, probably are well off enough to have a decent house with a garden and are able to work from home so lockdown works ok for them, compared to a family cramped in a small 2 bed flat with no outdoor space and having to go into work every day. Makes a lot of sense to me

even those people are going to miss some elements of normal life .... holidays for example .... I really dont see anyone wanting lockdowns ... even these people .... the time in spotlight ? I can barely name a single one of them now  .... but can name the govt one .... in 6 months they wont even be mentioned 

[tigger123]

15 minutes ago, Ozanne said:

The UK government took weeks to act when office Sage recommended we go into lockdown so I doubt they pay too much attention to Independent Sage. Anyway to say 'they will have us back in lockdown soon enough' is just hyperbole designed to seed anxiety.

I don’t think mentioning it is seeding anxiety, it is independent sage who are seeding anxiety. People calling it out for the sensationalist headline grabbing rubbish that it is are those trying to cessate any anxiety independent sage’s comments may cause, at least that’s how I interpret the comments 

[tigger123]

Just now, crazyfool1 said:

even those people are going to miss some elements of normal life .... holidays for example .... I really dont see anyone wanting lockdowns ... even these people .... the time in spotlight ? I can barely name a single one of them now  .... but can name the govt one .... in 6 months they wont even be mentioned 

Of course they are going to miss it but they’ve got the rest of their lives to go on holiday, pandemics like this where a lot of people pay A LOT of attention to what they say will probably only happen once every hundred years. Whether you can quote their names off the bat or not, their comments make front page headlines in the mail, telegraph, guardian on a regular basis.  

[Ozanne]

2 minutes ago, tigger123 said:

I don’t think mentioning it is seeding anxiety, it is independent sage who are seeding anxiety. People calling it out for the sensationalist headline grabbing rubbish that it is are those trying to cessate any anxiety independent sage’s comments may cause, at least that’s how I interpret the comments 

I could see what you mean if the article was mentioning lockdown but it's not, it's just mentioning trying to keep track of a cluster of case of the SA variant which is what we need to do to keep us on the roadmap.

[Homer]

1 hour ago, Quark said:

I demand updates!

We couldn't get in! Got there at about 7 and it was full plus a queue of about 40.

Ended up at an Italian down the road for a pint of Peroni and a pizza (was luuuuurvely).

[tigger123]

Just now, Ozanne said:

I could see what you mean if the article was mentioning lockdown but it's not, it's just mentioning trying to keep track of a cluster of case of the SA variant which is what we need to do to keep us on the roadmap.

Fair point. Tbh I wasn’t really commenting specifically about that article, I didn’t even open the link if I’m honest. What I’m commenting on more is what I associate to come with articles from independent sage which is the requirement for several large pinches of salt! 

[Crazyfool01]

2 minutes ago, tigger123 said:

Of course they are going to miss it but they’ve got the rest of their lives to go on holiday, pandemics like this where a lot of people pay A LOT of attention to what they say will probably only happen once every hundred years. Whether you can quote their names off the bat or not, their comments make front page headlines in the mail, telegraph, guardian on a regular basis.  

can you direct me to where we have followed fake sage ? and not standard sage ? I appreciate there will be some overlaps as all of them take different approaches .... even amongst themselves .... there will be fake sage that dont appear so pro lockdown ... its just the media are less likely to pick up those comments .... I think fake sage are hyped on here ... 

[steviewevie]

Those sinister, evil scientists trying to keep us locked down.

 

[Ozanne]

5 minutes ago, tigger123 said:

Fair point. Tbh I wasn’t really commenting specifically about that article, I didn’t even open the link if I’m honest. What I’m commenting on more is what I associate to come with articles from independent sage which is the requirement for several large pinches of salt! 

To be honest I don't follow much of what Indy Sage say, apart from a few of their members. I don't agree with all of it but it's good to get a varied view on what's going on I think.

I personally don't buy into the view that they enjoy their moment in the limelight, some might but I see that majority of those people just wanting to help.

[steviewevie]

 

[tigger123]

7 minutes ago, crazyfool1 said:

can you direct me to where we have followed fake sage ? and not standard sage ? I appreciate there will be some overlaps as all of them take different approaches .... even amongst themselves .... there will be fake sage that dont appear so pro lockdown ... its just the media are less likely to pick up those comments .... I think fake sage are hyped on here ... 

As you say its difficult to pick apart when we have acted off Independent Sage given the likely overlap. What is undeniable is that their comments make front page news and that instils fear in the population. The fear around sending kids back to school on 7th March being a case in point, which was proven to be nothing short of unnecessary dangerous fear mongering, given it is children's educations and mental health involved. Despite the vast number of tests we were doing, cases have continued to fall.

My main anger at Indie Sage comes from the point around if we can't unlock safely over the next few months, then when can we? From what I've read, we're not planning to roll out booster jabs to the whole population, only the vulnerable, therefore over the next few months we are at our safest we will ever be, as the whole population will have all been recently vaccinated. Yes, in time there may be amazing treatments that cure Covid instantly, but these may be years down the line or may never happen. Yes one could argue that we need to wait for the whole world to be vaccinated given we will have international travel allowed in some capacity, but the whole world won't be vaccinated this year. It's going to take a good couple of years until we get to that stage and by then, who's to say that the UK's immunity via vaccination hasn't started to wane by then? With no fully effective treatment of Covid, over the summer we are at our safest we are going to be as a country. If we can't unlock and go back to normal then, then when can we? Some members of indie sage have said we may need to keep social distancing for a whole year from now, so if we aren't safe now (ie over next few months) then when are we? It's the same thing with vaccine passports, what is going to change in a year that says we don't require these? If anything given a waning immunity from vaccination over time, I do not see how a government could remove the requirement for vaccine passports in a year's time, as we will surely be in a worse situation immunity wise given the gap of over a year since a large portion of society received their vaccine.

[zahidf]

Happy people celebrating their freedom

 

[tigger123]

24 minutes ago, Ozanne said:

I could see what you mean if the article was mentioning lockdown but it's not, it's just mentioning trying to keep track of a cluster of case of the SA variant which is what we need to do to keep us on the roadmap.

And that maybe the case. In my opinion, and this may be incorrect, I see them as the polar opposite of the Heneghans/Sikoras of this world, both extreme in their views. Indie Sage get loads of press coverage, Sikora/Heneghan virtually none anymore. While I disagree with both sides, we shouldn't really have one without the other if we want balanced coverage. In an ideal world, we would have neither, the fact that these epidemiologists pro or anti lockdown can appear on news programmes in a 'personal capacity' shouldn't be allowed. Let real Sage do their thing, advise the government and let the government scientists answer questions at the press conferences in the most factual, insightful way possible. That is how it should go imo.

[steviewevie]

😏

[Crazyfool01]

6 minutes ago, zahidf said:

Happy people celebrating their freedom

 

just me thats nervous about scenes like this I guess .... hopefully the outside factor means its fine ...

[zahidf]

3 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

😏

Fake SAGE straight on the TV...

[tigger123]

Just now, zahidf said:

Fake SAGE straight on the TV...

Deaths in single figures but nope too early, deaths 99% of Jan peak, but nope too early. If only she owned a hospitality venue, think she'd be singing a very different tune!

[steviewevie]

2 minutes ago, zahidf said:

Fake SAGE straight on the TV...

They won't be allowed on GB News.