When will this shit end?

[Toilet Duck]

42 minutes ago, gizmoman said:

Thanks for that, but some of the comments suggest it could be a longer term issue that could be a factor if the virus mutates enough, the short-term trial data wouldn't be any use in checking for that would it? There is some suggestion the non-mRNA "traditional" vaccines would be less of a risk in this regard, any thoughts on that?  Sorry to put you on the spot with technical questions but trying to make sense of these scientific discussions is so difficult for the layman.

I haven’t read the piece or the comments, but there really isn’t a strong signal for ADE playing a role in CoV infections, some observations in animal studies on SARS is where most of this has come from, but as far as I know it was never observed in patients (lots of things can be seen in the lab, but don’t happen in a more complex clinical setting). The circulating CoVs mutate all the time, we get reinfected with them, but genetic drift and prior infection don’t lead to ADE or any greater susceptibility to reinfection (in fact, our prior exposure is mostly what makes the infection result in mild disease). Unlike dengue fever where it is a known disease mechanism. There are different immune cells involved to those that target CoVs and all the evidence we have is that it is unlikely and yet to be observed. There are many theoretical risks for loads of things, but all we can do is look at the evidence we have, decide on how strong it is and go with that until stronger evidence suggests something else. At the moment, I don’t think it’s a major risk (certainly a lot smaller than the risk associated with getting infected). How the immune response is elicited shouldn’t impact this (the same immunogen is used in the different vaccines, just different method of delivery), so why the mRNA vaccines would be more risky in this regard doesn’t make a lot of sense biologically (my guess is they are newer, so easier to claim hypothetical AEs we have no evidence for). The vaccines are new, we absolutely need to be vigilant in their use and be diligent in reporting anything we see as they are rolled out, but that’s no different to the introduction or continued use of any medicinal product.

[Crazyfool01]

1 minute ago, MEGABOWL said:

Every time I see someone complain about how lenient our Lockdown is I roll my eyes. We’ve callously hit people right where it really hurts.

It’s lenient in terms of the number of workplaces open that are now deemed essential ... in other ways it’s not .... 

[kalifire]

1 minute ago, steviewevie said:

so god knows how many variants there actually are...

The UK may be the first to know, and potentially the first to respond, though. Good news.

[squirrelarmy]

6 minutes ago, crazyfool1 said:

It’s lenient in terms of the number of workplaces open that are now deemed essential ... in other ways it’s not .... 

My work isn’t essential but we’re open. I’m not complaining though as it gives me a reason to get out of the house. 

[Toilet Duck]

8 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

so god knows how many variants there actually are...

4000+ and counting!

[MEGABOWL]

19 minutes ago, crazyfool1 said:

It’s lenient in terms of the number of workplaces open that are now deemed essential ... in other ways it’s not .... 

That’s kind of my point. A lockdown where you have to go to work but can’t see your family and friends, even in very small numbers, is not lenient.

[tigger123]

Just now, MEGABOWL said:

That’s kind of my point. A lockdown where you have to go to work but can’t see your family and friends, even in very small numbers, is not lenient.

Agreed

[Ozanne]

18 minutes ago, crazyfool1 said:

It’s lenient in terms of the number of workplaces open that are now deemed essential ... in other ways it’s not .... 

Exactly. This is a pretty lenient lockdown, as you say workplaces open, non-essential places like cafes doing takeaway and walks with other people from different households.

 

There was a conversation 2 hours ago about how deaths are still over 1k and now some are complaining about lack of household mixing. Household mixing over 1 day played a big part of these numbers. 

[PM87]

6 minutes ago, Ozanne said:

Exactly. This is a pretty lenient lockdown, as you say workplaces open, non-essential places like cafes doing takeaway and walks with other people from different households.

 

There was a conversation 2 hours ago about how deaths are still over 1k and now some are complaining about lack of household mixing. Household mixing over 1 day played a big part of these numbers. 

Yep. But what I don't understand is why some countries that haven't had restrictions on household mixing are not currently experiencing the same high numbers, at least not to the extent we are? I'm longing for low numbers again here soon and for the day to come when my brain isn't consumed by stuff like this all the time. I'm like a hamster in a wheel with thoughts of Covid lol

[xxialac]

They've got the quarantine hotel figures wrong and the cost is not £1,750 after all. Should find out tomorrow...

Oh and this made me laugh.

Paul Gibbons

@PaulGibbons7

Matt Hancock denies his new hotel chain Cocklodge will benefit from this announcement. #Covid19UK #Quarantine

Edited February 9, 2021 by xxialac

[Ozanne]

2 minutes ago, PM87 said:

Yep. But what I don't understand is why some countries that haven't had restrictions on household mixing are not currently experiencing the same high numbers, at least not to the extent we are? I'm longing for low numbers again here soon and for the day to come when my brain isn't consumed by stuff like this all the time. I'm like a hamster in a wheel with thoughts of Covid lol

Some of those other countries have had it pretty badly just at different times. So in November it looked bad for Spain and France then we took over. However the issue we had was that the government relaxed lockdown 2 too early then allowed Christmas relaxation to go ahead and sent kids back to school for a day. Those events combined with general winter conditions lead to a perfect storm that we still aren’t fully over. 

[PM87]

Just now, Ozanne said:

Some of those other countries have had it pretty badly just at different times. So in November it looked bad for Spain and France then we took over. However the issue we had was that the government relaxed lockdown 2 too early then allowed Christmas relaxation to go ahead and sent kids back to school for a day. Those events combined with general winter conditions lead to a perfect storm that we still aren’t fully over. 

Let's hope we're nearing the end of this shit show soon and brighter days are ahead as we move into spring. 

[Ozanne]

5 minutes ago, PM87 said:

Let's hope we're nearing the end of this shit show soon and brighter days are ahead as we move into spring. 

Oh yeah we most definitely are nearing the end or at the very least brighter days!

[Fuzzy Afro]

49 minutes ago, MEGABOWL said:

Every time I see someone complain about how lenient our Lockdown is I roll my eyes. We’ve callously hit people right where it really hurts.

It genuinely makes me really upset when people say this. By all accounts we have one of the strictest lockdowns in the world atm. 

[Chapple12345]

51 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

so god knows how many variants there actually are...

Some experts estimate there are over 4000 worldwide so it's not anything out of the ordinary 

Edited February 9, 2021 by Chapple12345

[Paul ™]

Just now, xxialac said:

They've got the quarantine hotel figures wrong and the cost is not £1,750 after all. Should find out tomorrow...

Where you seeing that? Total shambles aint it, apparently that figure was per person too, so for a couple it would be £3500 lol

[Crazyfool01]

2 minutes ago, Fuzzy Afro said:

It genuinely makes me really upset when people say this. By all accounts we have one of the strictest lockdowns in the world atm. 

I guess it depends if you are following the rules too ... Its not strict for those that completely ignore them ... and its not enforced ....

[xxialac]

4 minutes ago, Paul ™ said:

Where you seeing that? Total shambles aint it, apparently that figure was per person too, so for a couple it would be £3500 lol

Left hand...right hand...arse...elbow...etc

Simon Calder
Hotel quarantine: update on cost. The health secretary, Matt Hancock, said the price for 10 days quarantine will be £1,750. The Department of Health now says the price will definitely be lower.

 

[Fuzzy Afro]

7 minutes ago, crazyfool1 said:

I guess it depends if you are following the rules too ... Its not strict for those that completely ignore them ... and its not enforced ....

That’s true. Its de jure strict. 

[hodgey123]

Agreed on the comments regarding whether the current version of the lockdown is strict. And of course, you only hear about the parts of the economy/people that are NOT complying with it (e.g. workplaces open that shouldn't be), rather than the vast, vast majority of things that have been affected by it (e.g. all massively affected sectors). 

[Fuzzy Afro]

Ultimately we’ve been banned from seeing our loved ones in indoor environment for 8 months out of the last 11 (even longer for those of you who were impacted by the summer local lockdowns)

 

Zoom calls and park walks are never gonna be a substitute for hugs.

 

You can debate the necessity and proportionality of lockdown, but anyone who claims it’s not strict or damaging is being totally unfair given the pain so many of us are going through. 

Edited February 9, 2021 by Fuzzy Afro

[whitehorses]

I’m in Cornwall. My next door neighbour is a 2nd home. Its owners have just turned up from E Sussex. They’re 70+ so imagine they’ve had the jab and thought fuck it. 
 

Who would grass them up? 
 

(I wouldn’t and wont, but wonder what others feel about this) 
 

[JoeyT]

Also one thing I will say about lockdown is we won’t see what affect it’s had on the countries children until years down the line.

Perhaps it might change a few minds of those who are of a pro lockdown / zero COVID mentality.

Time will tell.

[efcfanwirral]

23 minutes ago, Fuzzy Afro said:

Ultimately we’ve been banned from seeing our loved ones in indoor environment for 8 months out of the last 11 (even longer for those of you who were impacted by the summer local lockdowns)

 

Zoom calls and park walks are never gonna be a substitute for hugs.

 

You can debate the necessity and proportionality of lockdown, but anyone who claims it’s not strict or damaging is being totally unfair given the pain so many of us are going through. 

Yeah I'm guilty of that- I do forget how it affects most people! 

[Ozanne]

3 minutes ago, efcfanwirral said:

Yeah I'm guilty of that- I do forget how it affects most people! 

Compared with the first lockdown this one is more lenient. Apart from the other things I listed this time round you have support/childcare bubbles too. It’s why it took a bit longer to start showing significant differences in the figures every day. Fortunately now we are seeing the numbers fall.