When will this shit end?

[SamJ]

21 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

 

What I am hearing from local health providers is that BAME take up rate is extremely low.  The numbers I heard are 80-90% of some groups are refusing offered vaccinations.  Really need to understand why and how to counter.

[Ozanne]

19 minutes ago, zahidf said:

And you saying we havent been? Weve invested heavily in COVAX

 

Oh yeah we’ve heavily invested which is great but we could be doing much more. Sharing experiences and expertise. Helping setup infrastructure in other countries, to name a few. I think we could do I don’t think it should just be about money. 

[st dan]

Just now, Ozanne said:

Oh yeah we’ve heavily invested which is great but we could be doing much more. Sharing experiences and expertise. Helping setup infrastructure in other countries, to name a few. I think we could do I don’t think it should just be about money. 

I get the sentiment, but are we really in a position to start helping others at the moment in time, when we have one of the highest death rates in the world, with 1500+ dying per day on these shores. All resources are being used to put out the fire here first, and then I’m sure we will be in a better position in a few months time to start helping out other nations in ways you have mentioned above. 

[Ozanne]

22 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

 

A 6 point swing is pretty considerable, I wonder what’s caused that? Late polling effects from the governments pandemic response in early Jan maybe. 

[steviewevie]

1 minute ago, Ozanne said:

A 6 point swing is pretty considerable, I wonder what’s caused that? Late polling effects from the governments pandemic response in early Jan maybe. 

polls jump around, probably just noise.

[Ozanne]

Just now, st dan said:

I get the sentiment, but are we really in a position to start helping others at the moment in time, when we have one of the highest death rates in the world, with 1500+ dying per day on these shores. All resources are being used to put out the fire here first, and then I’m sure we will be in a better position in a few months time to start helping out other nations in ways you have mentioned above. 

I believe we at least should be in that position as the 5th or 6th richest country in the world, one of the most technologically advanced and with one of the strongest vaccination programs in the world. As strong a nation as we should be in a position to help if not then we really need to look into why we aren’t. 

[Toilet Duck]

Just now, st dan said:

Totally agree with this stance.

It’s like being in the queue for Glastonbury tickets, getting through to the ordering page and then ringing yours friends to check if they definitely still want to go. By the time you’ve all finally decided yes, the booking page has refreshed and the ‘All Sold Out’ message now appears. You ring Seetickets and tell them what’s happened and they say ‘sorry about that, but others got in there and ordered  all the tickets’. Try again in the resale in a few months’. You can’t demand a ticket because you had the chance and didn’t take it. 

Not exactly...it's like See tickets saying when you ring, yeah sure, we can print more tickets, when do you want them by and how many do yo want...only for you to turn up at the gate with your mates to be told, oh, we don't have yours, we know we said we did and we do indeed have tickets but we're giving them to someone else.

To be honest, this whole vaccine speculation thing is getting a bit mental (nobody knows, even the contracts are probably open to interpretation since they were signed before the vaccine was even shown to work). The EC will sort something out with AZ and secure better supply. AZ aren't going to go to war with one of their biggest markets over a product they don't even make a profit from. 

[Fuzzy Afro]

Only took about 8 months but Test & Trace seems to finally be improving 

[st dan]

Just now, Ozanne said:

I believe we at least should be in that position as the 5th or 6th richest country in the world, one of the most technologically advanced and with one of the strongest vaccination programs in the world. As strong a nation as we should be in a position to help if not then we really need to look into why we aren’t. 

But we can’t even look after our own population at the moment (although signs we’re beginning to pull that back). That’s evident in the number of cases and deaths. I fully expect us to help nations in need when we are in a more stable position to do so. 

[Ozanne]

Just now, steviewevie said:

polls jump around, probably just noise.

I don’t necessarily think a 6 point swing is just noise. Potentially could be some of the Northern Labour voters that went Tory in 2019 starting to swing back as the recent MRP showed. 

[DeanoL]

9 minutes ago, st dan said:

Totally agree with this stance.

It’s like being in the queue for Glastonbury tickets, getting through to the ordering page and then ringing your friends to check if they definitely still want to go. By the time you’ve all finally decided yes, the booking page has refreshed and the ‘All Sold Out’ message now appears. You ring Seetickets and tell them what’s happened and they say ‘sorry about that, but others got in there and ordered  all the tickets’. Try again in the resale in a few months’. You can’t demand a ticket because you had the chance and didn’t take it. 

And while you're making the call the headliners are announced as The Beatles, Bowie and Elvis. It wasn't just a matter of the EU signing up later - they had more data to go on, so the risk was much smaller.

6 minutes ago, Ozanne said:

Oh yeah we’ve heavily invested which is great but we could be doing much more. Sharing experiences and expertise. Helping setup infrastructure in other countries, to name a few. I think we could do I don’t think it should just be about money. 

That's not compatible with closing the borders though. It needs people over there, setting up infrastructure.

[jannybruck]

7 minutes ago, SamJ said:

What I am hearing from local health providers is that BAME take up rate is extremely low.  The numbers I heard are 80-90% of some groups are refusing offered vaccinations.  Really need to understand why and how to counter.

This is a complex issue: many BAME communities are distrustful of the government (understandable), first & second gen immigrants often don't consume English media at all or don't speak the language, communities are often tight-knit and so rumours fly around re: what's in it, and general conspiracy stuff, combined with religious beliefs which make it even more complex. So it requires people 'on the ground', possibly already part of these communities, to help uptake. It's going to be an uphill struggle.

[Ozanne]

1 minute ago, st dan said:

But we can’t even look after our own population at the moment (although signs we’re beginning to pull that back). That’s evident in the number of cases and deaths. I fully expect us to help nations in need when we are in a more stable position to do so. 

I guess that’s my point, I think we should be in a position to help. We have the resources to look after our population plus offer help to others. 

[HalfAnIdiot]

5 minutes ago, st dan said:

But we can’t even look after our own population at the moment (although signs we’re beginning to pull that back). That’s evident in the number of cases and deaths. I fully expect us to help nations in need when we are in a more stable position to do so. 

It a false choice really. If we don't suppress the virus globally soonest there is an increased risk of a new variant arrising that the vaccines can't touch. We don't live in a bubble, a 'me first' policy creates a false sense of protection unfortunately. 

[steviewevie]

10 minutes ago, Fuzzy Afro said:

Only took about 8 months but Test & Trace seems to finally be improving 

they just need to get (or allow) people to actually self isolate now.

[fraybentos1]

13 minutes ago, Ozanne said:

A 6 point swing is pretty considerable, I wonder what’s caused that? Late polling effects from the governments pandemic response in early Jan maybe. 

Margin of error is a thing. There have been about 4 other polls in the last week showing a Tory lead. It isn't a '6 point swing' at all. You really need to read up on polling or something cause it is getting tiresome to keep explaining (gonna keep doing it tho).

[fraybentos1]

10 minutes ago, Ozanne said:

I don’t necessarily think a 6 point swing is just noise. Potentially could be some of the Northern Labour voters that went Tory in 2019 starting to swing back as the recent MRP showed. 

The last 4 polls on Britain Elects before the one you have chosen to focus on... Coincidence? I think not. Show the full story or none at all.

[SheffJeff]

Is it generally accepted now that the Handelsblatt story stating an 8% efficacy in the over 65s was bullshit?  Can't see them kicking off over such an apparently piss poor vaccine if this was the case. 

[eFestivals]

As the plane flies at full speed towards the ground, Boris insists there's no need to think again as the black box will explain everything.

[steviewevie]

7 minutes ago, SheffJeff said:

Is it generally accepted now that the Handelsblatt story stating an 8% efficacy in the over 65s was bullshit?  Can't see them kicking off over such an apparently piss poor vaccine if this was the case. 

Have to see what EMA says tomorrow when (if ) appove the vaccine....and then what Germany does.

[steviewevie]

thread...

 

[Toilet Duck]

1 hour ago, onthebeach said:

As it’s looking like the J&J Janssen is due to report imminently and we have 30m doses on order (one dose only needed), does anyone know whether this is ‘stockpiled’ already? If so upon authorisation from MHRA (3 weeks?) won’t this help with the current ‘spat’ over supplies - I’m so hoping they have stockpiled like it was reported they were doing so last year on all pre-orders

Not sure where I saw it, but I think J&J said April for ramping up delivery. 

[st dan]

Have any countries around the world refused to approve a vaccine that has already been approved by other countries? 

[MEGABOWL]

27 minutes ago, st dan said:

But we can’t even look after our own population at the moment (although signs we’re beginning to pull that back). That’s evident in the number of cases and deaths. I fully expect us to help nations in need when we are in a more stable position to do so. 

Agreed. If you’re on a Plane and the Oxygen masks come down, you’re told to affix your own first before helping others.

[Breeze]

45 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

lol - it's a bullshit justification at least until everyone who is happy to have the vaccine has had it.

Offering vaccines to people who refuse it due to fear is a huge waste of resources. In the UK we're sending out letters to a lot of people. Many of whom will have to be sent new letters later if they dick around. 

In the US they have a huge and largely demented Anti-vax movement, based largely on horseshit. Anything that can combat that increases efficiency of getting vaccines out there is a good thing. A few politicians getting it earlier might have a positive impact rather than negative on the overall health of the population? I'm sure most pols like AOC don't really personally give a toss when they get it. It's more about how fast it gets out generally and how effective the overall programme is.

Meanwhile there are people flying to Dubai with their families to get the vaccine for about £40k including business flights, quarantine hotel, vaccines for all etc. Crazy times. 

The vaccine calculator on another thread suggests I may get the first one in June then my second one in September. This is way outside the bounds of the trails and there is no real data on what the impact of that sort of second dose delay might be. Seems nuts. But then much of what this govt. have done around this is. This 'shit will end' when we have effective solutions - why we'd risk effectiveness of the only solution we have to hand is anyone's guess. But politics and positioning and spin are probably at the root of it.