When will this shit end?

[Zoo Music Girl]

Just now, onthebeach said:

Oh I do hope so. A friend of my son & daughter in her early 20’s has leukaemia and is getting hers tomorrow to everyone’s relief. Personally I think that all the younger ones that are clinically extremely vulnerable should have been prioritised over the 80+ but at least they seem to be happening now

That's great news, does seem to be moving rapidly through the groups. 

[duke88]

11 minutes ago, st dan said:

I really feel for the young ones through all of this - particularly those aged 18 to 24. The fun and (mostly) carefree time of their lives they’ll sadly never get back. I know it’s a sacrifice for the greater good, but it’s still awful for them too. 

Yeah, I was talking to a student yesterday, felt really sorry for her. They were the most fun years of my life, and she’s back living at home, learning online and having to stay in all the time. Missing out on so much.

[faymondo]

12 minutes ago, st dan said:

I really feel for the young ones through all of this - particularly those aged 18 to 24. The fun and (mostly) carefree time of their lives they’ll sadly never get back. I know it’s a sacrifice for the greater good, but it’s still awful for them too. 

Spot on this. Not really missing too much at 47. If I was in my prime and the clubs like Cream, Garlands and 051 were shut in Liverpool that time I aint getting back and nearly 30 years later would have no memories to cherish. 

My eldest is in lower 6th. I was getting pissed up the field listening to Technotronic at her age. She's just in her room playing Roblox !!

[steviewevie]

The Race

[SamJ]

I’ve got an 8 year old and a 3 year old. Both ok on the surface at the moment, but after the last long lockdown I really worry about their mental health. At least older kids and young adults can (to an extent) socialise online.  But the little ones need to play with kids their age and neither can really manage zoom or FaceTime. Lockdown is for the greater good, and I wouldn’t want them in school / nursery if it’s not safe - but I desperately hope they are allowed to play with other kids outside before Easter.  I really worry about the long term effects of so much isolation.

[Chapple12345]

43 minutes ago, st dan said:

I really feel for the young ones through all of this - particularly those aged 18 to 24. The fun and (mostly) carefree time of their lives they’ll sadly never get back. I know it’s a sacrifice for the greater good, but it’s still awful for them too. 

As part of this age group I can confirm it's so hard, many people of my age totally understand the restrictions and the need for them but as you say I'm struggling missing seeing friends en masse, I managed a few nights out last summer/autumn but I'm missing physically seeing people rather than just through screens or 1:1 

[Steveb72]

43 minutes ago, st dan said:

I really feel for the young ones through all of this - particularly those aged 18 to 24. The fun and (mostly) carefree time of their lives they’ll sadly never get back. I know it’s a sacrifice for the greater good, but it’s still awful for them too. 

My son is 19 finished 6th form last summer and now at University should be the one of the best times of his life socialising making new friends but stuck he’s indoors with lessons online.  Really feel for him and his friends.

[efcfanwirral]

Mad that there is still opposition to this- who is flying in who we actually want here right now? Of course it should be everyone! 

 

[xxialac]

It's not quite as simple as you make out. 

What about e.g. a parent separated from their child? Someone currently abroad wishing to come back to visit a dying parent in the UK? Someone highly skilled having to perform that job in another country?

The UK of course has a dominant variant which is widespread in the population, which is why quarantine may have zero effect. We don't know whether there is a risk of importing an even more dominant variant or not even if it's too late and such a variant is already over here.

And they may end up quarantining passengers but still letting other variants in via e.g. hauliers (who they are not proposing to quarantine).

 

[aj6658]

10 minutes ago, efcfanwirral said:

Mad that there is still opposition to this- who is flying in who we actually want here right now? Of course it should be everyone! 

 

Agree, like come on lads. Stop being short sighted. I know the economy has been the main focus of this government but we will delay getting back to normal if we don't  just shut down the borders. Once it's in, its in and it will be so hard to control.

Take the hit and vaccinate. We're vaccinating 3m a week. By Spring we will be looking at potentially 4m and maybe potentially 5m if we get J+J vaccine approved. The whole country will be vaccinated by summer if those numbers keep up. 

 

Surely closing the borders is the best option?!

[efcfanwirral]

8 minutes ago, xxialac said:

It's not quite as simple as you make out. 

What about e.g. a parent separated from their child? Someone currently abroad wishing to come back to visit a dying parent in the UK? Someone highly skilled having to perform that job in another country?

The UK of course has a dominant variant which is widespread in the population, which is why quarantine may have zero effect. We don't know whether there is a risk of importing an even more dominant variant or not even if it's too late and such a variant is already over here.

And they may end up quarantining passengers but still letting other variants in via e.g. hauliers (who they are not proposing to quarantine).

 

Pretty sure Australia had exceptions - just should be exceptional and fair, instead of "anyone from America can come in and be exempt" - definitely a middle ground to be had. But surely it should just start from a base of ensuring that if a new variant is found it isn't probably already here because we left the doors open? 

[xxialac]

1 minute ago, efcfanwirral said:

Pretty sure Australia had exceptions - just should be exceptional and fair, instead of "anyone from America can come in and be exempt" - definitely a middle ground to be had. But surely it should just start from a base of ensuring that if a new variant is found it isn't probably already here because we left the doors open? 

I don't really know enough about this but it is possible that the horse has already bolted. Our borders have been porous for over a year now.

Genuine question: if we close our borders completely, what's the trigger to re-opening them?

And what do we do with truckers coming in and out?

[BobWillis]

Who would accept the current restrictions being in place (or possibly harder restrictions) until June or July if it meant going for an Australian style covid zero approach? 
As close to normal life as possible with some mask wearing and common sense distancing.

I would rather another 6 months of this to have my life back rather than another 2 or 3 months and only part of my life back. 

[km9]

Not sure what you mean by part of your life back 

[steviewevie]

8 minutes ago, BobWillis said:

Who would accept the current restrictions being in place (or possibly harder restrictions) until June or July if it meant going for an Australian style covid zero approach? 
As close to normal life as possible with some mask wearing and common sense distancing.

I would rather another 6 months of this to have my life back rather than another 2 or 3 months and only part of my life back. 

Yeah, is a good question. I guess I'd go for the longer lockdown if meant getting to zero covid...but to maintain zero covid would mean strict border checks for some time, if not ever...and maybe just isn't possible?

But at same time I want my kid to go back to school asap.

[xxialac]

I suspect we will 'close our borders' (quarantine measures but even these with exemptions/half-baked) next month for a month or so and it won't have much impact.

[BobWillis]

13 minutes ago, km9 said:

Not sure what you mean by part of your life back 

As in being in tiers for the foreseeable future. So maybe allowed to meet friends and family in small groups, attend socially distanced events with hugely reduced crowds etc and in and out of tougher restrictions as the situation requires. 
More than we can do now but nothing resembling life before covid. 

[Deaf Nobby Burton]

24 minutes ago, BobWillis said:

Who would accept the current restrictions being in place (or possibly harder restrictions) until June or July if it meant going for an Australian style covid zero approach? 
As close to normal life as possible with some mask wearing and common sense distancing.

I would rather another 6 months of this to have my life back rather than another 2 or 3 months and only part of my life back. 

The problem is we might have missed the boat on that. By June we could’ve vaccinated everyone and not need such strict border checks and quarantine, whereas Oz/NZ, once they’ve vaccinated their population will likely drop the strict border controls.

I’m not saying we shouldn’t do it, but the time to do it was probably a year ago.

[xxialac]

2 minutes ago, Deaf Nobby Burton said:

The problem is we might have missed the boat on that. By June we could’ve vaccinated everyone and not need such strict border checks and quarantine, whereas Oz/NZ, once they’ve vaccinated their population will likely drop the strict border controls.

I’m not saying we shouldn’t do it, but the time to do it was probably a year ago.

Absolutely, 100%. It's a great idea but woefully late now, like putting a small plaster on a gaping wound. 

[Leyrulion]

15 minutes ago, BobWillis said:

Who would accept the current restrictions being in place (or possibly harder restrictions) until June or July if it meant going for an Australian style covid zero approach? 
As close to normal life as possible with some mask wearing and common sense distancing.

I would rather another 6 months of this to have my life back rather than another 2 or 3 months and only part of my life back. 

Not me because I think eliminating this is going to be almost impossible now it's here. 

I know people in the channel Islands, Jersey. They closed the borders, only 1-2 flights a day in, you effectively needed a visa issued by the jersey government to travel to what is basically the u.k. Managed to virtually eliminate it.Then opened up to tourists with testing everyone on arrival and enforced quarantine (actually enforced although not hotel quarantine) in the summer. At one point they had no cases.

They've never been able to stamp it out entirely from their Island and it resurged again in winter and they had to close again.

 

Even if we locked down HARD, if R was 0.8 it would take 47 cycles of the virus to get to 0 new cases per day from levels now (estimate), that's 235 days or 8 months.

So I wouldn't want a 6 month lockdown because I don't think it would eliminate it and I think we will still see a winter resurgence, which although no where near as bad as now might still require further restrictions. So there's no point having harsh restrictions with very low numbers in June, July attempting a zero covid strategy when you're going to just have to reintroduce restrictions 4-5 months later.

[BobWillis]

10 minutes ago, Deaf Nobby Burton said:

The problem is we might have missed the boat on that. By June we could’ve vaccinated everyone and not need such strict border checks and quarantine, whereas Oz/NZ, once they’ve vaccinated their population will likely drop the strict border controls.

I’m not saying we shouldn’t do it, but the time to do it was probably a year ago.

I don’t disagree with you. 
 

It was a hypothetical question mixed with a bit of wishful thinking. 

[BobWillis]

1 minute ago, Leyrulion said:

Even if we locked down HARD, if R was 0.8 it would take 47 cycles of the virus to get to 0 new cases per day from levels now (estimate), that's 235 days or 8 months.

So I wouldn't want a 6 month lockdown because I don't think it would eliminate it and I think we will still see a winter resurgence, which although no where near as bad as now might still require further restrictions. So there's no point having harsh restrictions with very low numbers in June, July attempting a zero covid strategy when you're going to just have to reintroduce restrictions 4-5 months later.

All of this is ignoring the effectiveness of the vaccines though. 
The R rate and number of infections become largely irrelevant if you’ve successful managed to prevent serious disease and death in as much of the population as possible.
Strict border controls would be in place purely to prevent any vaccine resistant strains or variants finding their way into the community. 

[Smeble]

On 1/23/2021 at 11:37 AM, eFestivals said:

same as robbie williams, macca and others, carrying on their privileged life as they always do, at the expense of others...?

🙄🙄🙄🙄🙄🙄🙄

[Smeble]

4 hours ago, st dan said:

I really feel for the young ones through all of this - particularly those aged 18 to 24. The fun and (mostly) carefree time of their lives they’ll sadly never get back. I know it’s a sacrifice for the greater good, but it’s still awful for them too. 

Much worse for the over 80s and ill who are actually dying🙄🙄🙄🙄🙄

 

[Leyrulion]

16 minutes ago, BobWillis said:

All of this is ignoring the effectiveness of the vaccines though. 
The R rate and number of infections become largely irrelevant if you’ve successful managed to prevent serious disease and death in as much of the population as possible.
Strict border controls would be in place purely to prevent any vaccine resistant strains or variants finding their way into the community. 

Oh absolutely, but vaccines coming in stream is why I don't think a 6 month lockdown will be needed. 

I'm still worried that new strains will result in a winter uptick as we learn to adapt vaccines and distribute vaccines to combat them.