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When will this shit end?

Chrisp1986

By Chrisp1986,
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jparx
jparx

I think on a music festival message board it’s a legitimate question to ask. It doesn’t suggest the OP doesn’t give a shit about anything else. Of course there are much bigger things to be worrie

Toilet Duck
Toilet Duck

So...OX/AZ, blood clots, suspension of vaccinations, politics, vaccine hesitancy, convoluted data, PR problems, Brexit, EU procurement naivety, poor logistics, national identity...there’s an awful lot

Lycra
Lycra

A while since I/we posted because just like everyone else we get fed up of this shit. So just like to say..... For the first time since last March we are free of covid patients 😊

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Zoo Music Girl Grand Master

Zoo Music Girl

Posted
Posted (edited)
10 hours ago, Toilet Duck said:

None of the early ones are live vaccines! (J&J, Novavax, Merck, GSK/Sanofi and most of the others coming down the line aren't either, so your friend should be fine with any of them! (including Pfizer and Moderna)). 

Ah excellent! This is great news, thank you :) Not sure where I got the idea some of them were live.

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DeanoL Mentor

DeanoL

Posted
Posted
17 hours ago, Homer said:

There's quite an easy way to settle this - just check how people are behaving in countries that have all but eliminated the virus. I've not accessed any stats, etc, but from what I generally understand about NZ (where my wife's family and a lot of friends are), everyone is behaving as they were pre-virus (and have been for a while). I could be wrong though.

NZ took a zero-COVID approach. I'm the most cautious one here (it seems) and I'd go out in New Zealand tomorrow.

That's very different to to the UK in March. The huge unanswered question is if the vaccine actually prevents transmission. It looks like it might, but we're not sure yet. If it doesn't, the R rate will not go down. It will in fact go through the roof if we just open everything back up. Which I why I don't think we will until we have more evidence. Because if the plan was to let that happen then we wouldn't need all the doses of the vaccine we're ordering. We'd just need enough for the vulnerable then let COVID rip through everywhere else giving immunity along the way.

17 hours ago, Ozanne said:

Take a look at London, you hear stories all over the place of pubs getting round the meal thing by giving a slice of pizza or some small bit of food. I would also think that they don’t care about the household rule too. However cases in London are rising, it obviously isn’t just down to pubs doing this but it’s going to play a part. So when London goes into tier 3 no pubs will be able to open and if they’d kept to the rules then things might not have been as bad and they could’ve stayed open. 

But if I'm a pub in London that doesn't normally serve food or have live music, I can't open anyway. And I'd probably rather my competitors couldn't either (and perhaps have access to extra financial support in tier 3).

What I'm not sure on is why the rule exists to start with. Is it to reduce the number of pubs open? That doesn't make sense in isolation, as logic says people would be more spread out if more pubs are open? Or is there an expectation that if only a few pubs are open, most people won't bother and demand will fall? Or is it easier to police fewer pubs? Or is like the 10pm rule, an attempt to stop people drinking as much?

Only two of those reasons would mean things got worse if more pubs were allowed to open.

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Ozanne Grand Master

Ozanne

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Posted
13 minutes ago, DeanoL said:

NZ took a zero-COVID approach. I'm the most cautious one here (it seems) and I'd go out in New Zealand tomorrow.

That's very different to to the UK in March. The huge unanswered question is if the vaccine actually prevents transmission. It looks like it might, but we're not sure yet. If it doesn't, the R rate will not go down. It will in fact go through the roof if we just open everything back up. Which I why I don't think we will until we have more evidence. Because if the plan was to let that happen then we wouldn't need all the doses of the vaccine we're ordering. We'd just need enough for the vulnerable then let COVID rip through everywhere else giving immunity along the way.

But if I'm a pub in London that doesn't normally serve food or have live music, I can't open anyway. And I'd probably rather my competitors couldn't either (and perhaps have access to extra financial support in tier 3).

What I'm not sure on is why the rule exists to start with. Is it to reduce the number of pubs open? That doesn't make sense in isolation, as logic says people would be more spread out if more pubs are open? Or is there an expectation that if only a few pubs are open, most people won't bother and demand will fall? Or is it easier to police fewer pubs? Or is like the 10pm rule, an attempt to stop people drinking as much?

Only two of those reasons would mean things got worse if more pubs were allowed to open.

Regardless whether I think makes sense the rules should be followed to at least try to keep infection rates down this winter. 
 

I think the rule is in play to stop people getting so drunk or binge drinking? As it’s pretty clear that when people get drunker social distancing gets more lax. 

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DeanoL Mentor

DeanoL

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, Ozanne said:

Regardless whether I think makes sense the rules should be followed to at least try to keep infection rates down this winter. 
 

I think the rule is in play to stop people getting so drunk or binge drinking? As it’s pretty clear that when people get drunker social distancing gets more lax. 

Right - and I agree that pubs which are giving out free cheese toasties or slices of pizza are taking the mick.

But I feel like a pub partnering with a local street food place to do meals, or a pub putting on ticketed live music events to be able to sell booze that way is following the rules. Certainly to the letter. These aren't loopholes these are changing their business in order to meet the new rules and be able to open.

We could argue whether it's in the spirit of the rules, but that's sort of what I was asking - we need to understand what that spirit is? If it's to have fewer pubs open, then it obviously breaks the spirit. But that doesn't seem to be the driver.

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squirrelarmy Veteran

squirrelarmy

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, Ozanne said:

From The Guardian live news page:

481D0858-8C44-469B-83ED-DA1AEA3B6574.jpeg

I would take anything coming from that media source with a huge pinch of salt. 
 

“PA Media is a multimedia news agency operating in the United Kingdom and Ireland. PA Media is part of PA Media Group Limited, a private company with 26 shareholders, most of whom are national and regional newspaper publishers. The biggest shareholders include the Daily Mail”

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