When will this shit end?

[zahidf]

Just now, squirrelarmy said:

Bojo says a lot of things that turn out to be complete bollocks once it’s been analysed. 

Fair enough, but the govt focus is more on the economy going forward ( as well as the Tory party backbenchers). I dont think they'll keep social distancing just 'to be safe' once enough of the older/vulnerable population is vaccinated

[zahidf]

Just now, tigger123 said:

Very true, but then people find ways around all laws, drugs are illegal yet they’re still very easy to get hold of.

I think the government should try to do everything possible to stop people meeting after and I think stopping booze sales will definitely help. Relatively easy thing to put into place too.

Ban booze sales? in England? Yeah good luck with that. That would start riots

[Crazyfool01]

3 minutes ago, stuartbert two hats said:

People didn't go out because the virus was still around.  It wasn't some kind of irrational fear of shadows that kept people at home.  The public were ahead of the politicians on this one - staying away from people made sense even in summer, because even when case numbers are low, bringing them slightly higher takes you further along that exponential curve.

Speaking for myself, I was not comfortable  going out, because the pandemic wasn't over.  I wasn't (am not!) immune and nor are my family.  Once we're all jabbed, it changes everything.  Two weeks after my second shot, I am going to the pub. And not for a meal.

Basically, I think you're wrong, it's a totally different situation.

Likewise although I think mine might be a slower head back to normal life because I’m just not used to it ... I will start once I’ve had my jab by returning to the staff canteen and going to work without fear of my life ... that’s very significant for me .... because at the moment I’m counting down to the vaccine 💉 and nothing else 

[Copperface]

2 minutes ago, zahidf said:

Hancock and Bojo both specifically said there wouldnt be social distancing measures by the spring. 

24/11/20 - Hancock:

 Mr Hancock told MPs: "After Easter, we think we will be getting back to normal." He said there would be a shift to an emphasis on "personal responsibility" rather than social distancing restrictions once a vaccine has reached the most vulnerable.

 

Boris Johnson - 26/11/20:

We now have reason to hope that by Spring, community testing and vaccines will combine to end this era of restrictions.

 

 

Very different to what you have interpreted that as.

[squirrelarmy]

Just now, zahidf said:

Ban booze sales? in England? Yeah good luck with that. That would start riots

Also incredibly dangerous to deny alcoholics the very substance their body depends on. 

[fraybentos1]

6 minutes ago, crazyfool1 said:

 and going to work without fear of my life

If that is how you feel then is it not possible to get time off? My mum worked in a supermarket and she was getting so worked up about it back in spring that they gave her time off paid. 

[DeanoL]

 

16 minutes ago, Copperface said:

I understand all that, but my point is still, and even you have said the same above, is that Spring/Easter may be the time when we start to move back to normal. Not, as perceived by many, that we will be back to normal by Spring. By normal, I mean no restrictions whatsoever, back to pre March 2020.

I don't even think "no restrictions whatsoever" will be "normal" as we know it - there will be a good few months at least of people being cautious after it.

6 minutes ago, stuartbert two hats said:

People didn't go out because the virus was still around.  It wasn't some kind of irrational fear of shadows that kept people at home.  The public were ahead of the politicians on this one - staying away from people made sense even in summer, because even when case numbers are low, bringing them slightly higher takes you further along that exponential curve.

Speaking for myself, I was not comfortable  going out, because the pandemic wasn't over.  I wasn't (am not!) immune and nor are my family.  Once we're all jabbed, it changes everything.  Two weeks after my second shot, I am going to the pub. And not for a meal.

But you get the jab, it's 90% effective, probably, thereabouts. That means whatever you were afraid of in July is ten times less likely to happen? Is that enough for you?

Can totally believe that it is. If you were sort of on the edge back then, taking small risks, trying socially distanced gigs, going to the pub with your household and whatever, I can see if it was "now 90% less risky" would make the difference. But if you're one of the millions who didn't do any of that, who said "no chance, I'm doing more than what the restrictions insist on, as I don't want to get ill" you're likely not going to jump in feet first because it's now only 1 tenth as dangerous as before.

Could the vaccine also help prevent transmission? Yes. Could it also help prevent cases of severe diseases? Yes. But we don't know that yet. Until we do it's not "a totally different situation" - it's the exact same situation except the chance of anything bad happening has reduced by a factor of 10. That's a lot but it's far from enough for a lot of people.

[Lizzim]

20 minutes ago, mcshed said:

Which is what we are doing up here in Scotland. I live on the outskirts of Edinburgh but I'm in Midlothian council so it is currently illegal for me to go into Edinburgh for non-essential reasons. My wife and I both work in Edinburgh as do most people who live in this commuter town, so we are all travelling in and out of Edinburgh 5 days a week but would be fined £60 if we did it on our days off. It is silly.

Equally i am not allowed to go to Ikea.   A colleague of mine couldnt get his haircut as it was 200 meters over the "border"

[steviewevie]

9 minutes ago, zahidf said:

Fair enough, but the govt focus is more on the economy going forward ( as well as the Tory party backbenchers). I dont think they'll keep social distancing just 'to be safe' once enough of the older/vulnerable population is vaccinated

I expect restrictions will be eased gradually from March onwards...and by early summer we will be fully back to the bad old days.

[fraybentos1]

1 minute ago, DeanoL said:

 

I don't even think "no restrictions whatsoever" will be "normal" as we know it - there will be a good few months at least of people being cautious after it.

But you get the jab, it's 90% effective, probably, thereabouts. That means whatever you were afraid of in July is ten times less likely to happen? Is that enough for you?

Can totally believe that it is. If you were sort of on the edge back then, taking small risks, trying socially distanced gigs, going to the pub with your household and whatever, I can see if it was "now 90% less risky" would make the difference. But if you're one of the millions who didn't do any of that, who said "no chance, I'm doing more than what the restrictions insist on, as I don't want to get ill" you're likely not going to jump in feet first because it's now only 1 tenth as dangerous as before.

Could the vaccine also help prevent transmission? Yes. Could it also help prevent cases of severe diseases? Yes. But we don't know that yet. Until we do it's not "a totally different situation" - it's the exact same situation except the chance of anything bad happening has reduced by a factor of 10. That's a lot but it's far from enough for a lot of people.

At the end of the day, there genuinely isn't much danger of this virus to an average Joe, so yes by reducing the risk of getting it by 90 percent plus reducing the chance of getting it badly above that , then yes that probably is enough for most people.

[zahidf]

2 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

I expect restrictions will be eased gradually from March onwards...and by early summer we will be fully back to the bad old days.

Lets see what happens with vaccine approval and roll out. If there is evdience deaths are say halved and hospitals are back to normal, id be very surprised if things will be restricted

[Crazyfool01]

6 minutes ago, fraybentos1 said:

If that is how you feel then is it not possible to get time off? My mum worked in a supermarket and she was getting so worked up about it back in spring that they gave her time off paid. 

I had time off the first time paid but because I fall in the vulnerable category and not extremely vulnerable .. it’s not happened this time ... so I just go in and get through ... nothing I can do really as I have bills to pay ... apart from use some holiday which I have ... anyway I’m high up on the list for a jab so hopefully not so long to go now ... and the bonus is that rates have dropped and we are one of the lowest rates nationally 

[zahidf]

Wonder if the UK will be sooner?

The European Medicines Agency said earlier on Tuesday it planned to decide on whether to approve the vaccine being developed by Pfizer and BioNTech by 29 December, and by 12 January on the vaccine being developed by Moderna.

“I assume that we will start being able to vaccinate in January at the latest,” German health minister Jens Spahn said.

 

[fraybentos1]

1 minute ago, zahidf said:

Wonder if the UK will be sooner?

The European Medicines Agency said earlier on Tuesday it planned to decide on whether to approve the vaccine being developed by Pfizer and BioNTech by 29 December, and by 12 January on the vaccine being developed by Moderna.

“I assume that we will start being able to vaccinate in January at the latest,” German health minister Jens Spahn said.

 

Almost certainly. A lot seems to be pointing to next week and you just know Boris etc will be keen to be first off the mark. 

[zahidf]

Amazing

 

[Ozanne]

18 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

I expect restrictions will be eased gradually from March onwards...and by early summer we will be fully back to the bad old days.

I don’t know if it will March but certainly Easter time we should see restrictions ease if hospitals aren’t feeling the strain. It’ll take a while for any vaccinations to filter through anyway. 

[Fuzzy Afro]

I guess the hope is that although the tier system will formally stay until Easter, the impact of vaccinations being baked through into the data should lead to more areas achieving tier 1 in February or March. Feels like the gap between tier 1 and tier 2 is far bigger than the gap between normality and tier 1. 

[stuartbert two hats]

48 minutes ago, DeanoL said:

 

I don't even think "no restrictions whatsoever" will be "normal" as we know it - there will be a good few months at least of people being cautious after it.

But you get the jab, it's 90% effective, probably, thereabouts. That means whatever you were afraid of in July is ten times less likely to happen? Is that enough for you?

Can totally believe that it is. If you were sort of on the edge back then, taking small risks, trying socially distanced gigs, going to the pub with your household and whatever, I can see if it was "now 90% less risky" would make the difference. But if you're one of the millions who didn't do any of that, who said "no chance, I'm doing more than what the restrictions insist on, as I don't want to get ill" you're likely not going to jump in feet first because it's now only 1 tenth as dangerous as before.

Could the vaccine also help prevent transmission? Yes. Could it also help prevent cases of severe diseases? Yes. But we don't know that yet. Until we do it's not "a totally different situation" - it's the exact same situation except the chance of anything bad happening has reduced by a factor of 10. That's a lot but it's far from enough for a lot of people.

We'll probably agree to disagree on this, but I do want to point out, than even the Oxford vaccine, which seems to be the least effective has reported zero cases of severe disease in the vaccinated group.  So we do know it prevents severe disease, and very effectively.

Edited December 1, 2020 by stuartbert two hats

[Leyrulion]

1 hour ago, Copperface said:

By normal, I mean no restrictions whatsoever, back to pre March 2020

If that's the threshold I don't expect that to happen until spring 2022.

There will still be additional things we'll need to do throughout 2021 like scanning QR codes, hand sanitiser in and around shops, pre departure travel history forms, arrival screenings etc etc. 

But these won't stop us doing everything we want to do from late summer at the latest. 

[Copperface]

Just now, Leyrulion said:

If that's the threshold I don't expect that to happen until spring 2022.

There will still be additional things we'll need to do throughout 2021 like scanning QR codes, hand sanitiser in and around shops, pre departure travel history forms, arrival screenings etc etc. 

But these won't stop us doing everything we want to do from late summer at the latest. 

Late summer is what I have said all along for months.

Although some appear convinced that we're back to normal and it's party time from Easter. 

[jparx]

“All we need to do now is to hold our nerve, until these vaccines are within our grasp, and indeed being injected into our arms,” he said.

This government is going to give up on restrictions as quickly as possible. They want this to be over. The expected rebellion tonight will only grow over the comings months. I’m struggling to see a scenario where we hit April and social distancing is still in place to be honest. 

[stuartbert two hats]

1 minute ago, jparx said:

“All we need to do now is to hold our nerve, until these vaccines are within our grasp, and indeed being injected into our arms,” he said.

This government is going to give up on restrictions as quickly as possible. They want this to be over. The expected rebellion tonight will only grow over the comings months. I’m struggling to see a scenario where we hit April and social distancing is still in place to be honest. 

I'd be shocked if there are many controls past Feburary.

[zahidf]

PARTY 

Includes the massively homophobic Hungarian MEP who wrote their anti gay laws

[jparx]

Just now, stuartbert two hats said:

I'd be shocked if there are many controls past Feburary.

In terms of “when will this shit end?” I feel like there won’t be a moment. I can see the govt dropping restrictions but many people (probably myself tbh) following their own personal restrictions. I think there’s going to be a really weird vibe around Easter possibly for a few months.

[zahidf]

Just now, jparx said:

In terms of “when will this shit end?” I feel like there won’t be a moment. I can see the govt dropping restrictions but many people (probably myself tbh) following their own personal restrictions. I think there’s going to be a really weird vibe around Easter possibly for a few months.

Yeah. Tbh im fine with handwashing and masks on public transport permanently