When will this shit end?

[eFestivals]

1 minute ago, steviewevie said:

does that mean lockdown was a waste of time and the massive global depression we're just about to go into will be all for nothing?

I do hope not.

it depends on what the aim of the govt has been - and to give them their due, their aim was to stop the NHS being overloaded and they succeeded with that.

Imagine the outcry if most people in need of hospital treatment* were being refused it because the hospitals were full.
(* there's been some of that anyway, but at a low level)

[steviewevie]

Just now, eFestivals said:

it depends on what the aim of the govt has been - and to give them their due, their aim was to stop the NHS being overloaded and they succeeded with that.

Imagine the outcry if most people in need of hospital treatment* were being refused it because the hospitals were full.
(* there's been some of that anyway, but at a low level)

they could just have sent them back to the old peoples homes...oh, hang on.

[eFestivals]

Just now, steviewevie said:

they could just have sent them back to the old peoples homes...oh, hang on.

I didn't say they got everything right. You're mistaking me for a fan of Spaffer.  

[Chapple12345]

49 minutes ago, zahidf said:

Tbh I don't thibk there are loads of car accident victims being counted as dying of covid

Apologies, I didn’t mean car crash victims were being recorded as it, I meant hypothetically if they’d been confirmed for coronavirus and had then made a full recovery there were still reports of their death being down to coronavirus, even when this was unlikely to be the case 

[efcfanwirral]

 

27 minutes ago, BobWillis said:

That’s disgusting. People are still too scared to leave their homes because of the numbers they’re reporting every day which aren’t a true representation of the current situation. Scandalous. 

Just to add a different take here - a lot of us aren't going back to normal because of the fact that positive cases are high and we know it COULD get back to where it was. Obviously we might get lucky and hospitalisations not rise in line, but we don't know for sure and need evidence of that.

When there are 500-900 new cases every day it's a quick journey back to April numbers if people aren't careful. And some of us don't want to be part of the spread, not just for ourselves not wanting to catch it and risk long term effects, but others too. 

I'm really concerned about what this PHE counting information is doing to the general mindset of the country - people predictably going with a "ah it's not so bad then", and forgetting that excess deaths is the real number - just because a few PHE deaths may have been attributed wrong, the huge number of excess deaths vs previous years actually has me leaning towards an overall under counting throughout the worst months. 

And I know excess deaths are down now - but I'd like to see them stay low throughout winter before deciding things are ok

[steviewevie]

7 minutes ago, efcfanwirral said:

 

Just to add a different take here - a lot of us aren't going back to normal because of the fact that positive cases are high and we know it COULD get back to where it was. Obviously we might get lucky and hospitalisations not rise in line, but we don't know for sure and need evidence of that.

When there are 500-900 new cases every day it's a quick journey back to April numbers if people aren't careful. And some of us don't want to be part of the spread, not just for ourselves not wanting to catch it and risk long term effects, but others too. 

I'm really concerned about what this PHE counting information is doing to the general mindset of the country - people predictably going with a "ah it's not so bad then", and forgetting that excess deaths is the real number - just because a few PHE deaths may have been attributed wrong, the huge number of excess deaths vs previous years actually has me leaning towards an overall under counting throughout the worst months. 

And I know excess deaths are down now - but I'd like to see them stay low throughout winter before deciding things are ok

yeah, this. If people stop believing there's a problem, then I think we're going to have a problem.

To be honest I think the whole solidarity, we're all in this together thing that we saw with the first lockdown has gone now anyway...

[Havors]

Without trying to trigger some people, and don't mean to sound heartless as im not.... but people need to also remember that the death rate is very very low, in the grand scheme of things, for under the age of 65 (and almost all of them have had underlying conditions). THE most important thing to do is protect the care homes and the over 65's. 

There needs to be a way to do that without literally destroying the country and lives/livelihood of everyone for years and years to come by locking everything down again. I'm not sure what that is but it needs to be discussed. 

A vaccine helps obviously if you're not an anti vaxxer. Personal responsibility? Stay away from your old family members or do it very carefully? If you are vulnerable be extra vigilant? Support the vulnerable financially while its ongoing? etc... 

[FestivalJamie]

17 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

it depends on what the aim of the govt has been - and to give them their due, their aim was to stop the NHS being overloaded and they succeeded with that.

Imagine the outcry if most people in need of hospital treatment* were being refused it because the hospitals were full.
(* there's been some of that anyway, but at a low level)

To say the NHS wasn’t overloaded... maybe in the media and the public’s eyes but my aunt works for the NHS and it was damn overloaded. Absolutely every other treatment was cancelled, every ward was turned into coronavirus treatment, just so we wouldn’t get horrific pictures on the media of “the nhs being overloaded”.

Theres thousands of patients who are now backlogged on treatments which should have happened in March-May such as cancer patients who need chemo, radio etc. All of these people had their appointments cancelled and now have to be seen in a backlogged queue, which means some of these people will die sooner as a knock on of the virus and how it was handled by the government. 

So yes, the NHS really was overwhelmed, and there’s a massive backlog of patients who need to be seen who couldn’t be seen during the outbreak, meaning that it won’t take much for the NHS to be overwhelmed again. 

Sure, on the media we “weren’t overwhelmed” because we had plenty of beds in the nightingale hospital, but we don’t have enough nurses to facilitate that and we only had that many beds because all other treatments, procedures and operations were cancelled. Everything was turned into coronavirus, so yes the NHS really were overloaded by coronavirus, because we didn’t quarantine people or lock down soon enough.

Lets hope we don’t make similar mistakes again, as I say there’s now a backlog of patients waiting to be seen so it will take even less for the NHS to be overwhelmed this time.

[steviewevie]

9 minutes ago, FestivalJamie said:

To say the NHS wasn’t overloaded... maybe in the media and the public’s eyes but my aunt works for the NHS and it was damn overloaded. Absolutely every other treatment was cancelled, every ward was turned into coronavirus treatment, just so we wouldn’t get horrific pictures on the media of “the nhs being overloaded”.

Theres thousands of patients who are now backlogged on treatments which should have happened in March-May such as cancer patients who need chemo, radio etc. All of these people had their appointments cancelled and now have to be seen in a backlogged queue, which means some of these people will die sooner as a knock on of the virus and how it was handled by the government. 

So yes, the NHS really was overwhelmed, and there’s a massive backlog of patients who need to be seen who couldn’t be seen during the outbreak, meaning that it won’t take much for the NHS to be overwhelmed again. 

Sure, on the media we “weren’t overwhelmed” because we had plenty of beds in the nightingale hospital, but we don’t have enough nurses to facilitate that and we only had that many beds because all other treatments, procedures and operations were cancelled. Everything was turned into coronavirus, so yes the NHS really were overloaded by coronavirus, because we didn’t quarantine people or lock down soon enough.

Lets hope we don’t make similar mistakes again, as I say there’s now a backlog of patients waiting to be seen so it will take even less for the NHS to be overwhelmed this time.

the worry is in the winter get a large number of covid19 as well as flu patients.

[FestivalJamie]

1 minute ago, steviewevie said:

the worry is in the winter get a large number of covid19 as well as flu patients.

Exactly. But what is interesting is that I think in Australia the flu has been really mild this season, so hopefully that’s some positive news for us that this year’s flu is a weak strain or perhaps it’s less easily transmitted due to all of the measures we have in place.

[balthazarstarbuck]

1 minute ago, FestivalJamie said:

Exactly. But what is interesting is that I think in Australia the flu has been really mild this season, so hopefully that’s some positive news for us that this year’s flu is a weak strain or perhaps it’s less easily transmitted due to all of the measures we have in place.

I think it’s that really. Masks, distancing etc all help prevent the spread of flu too.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/covid-19-measures-have-all-but-wiped-out-the-flu-in-the-southern-hemisphere-11595440682

Hopefully one fewer front to fight on..

 

[steviewevie]

14 minutes ago, Havors said:

Without trying to trigger some people, and don't mean to sound heartless as im not.... but people need to also remember that the death rate is very very low, in the grand scheme of things, for under the age of 65 (and almost all of them have had underlying conditions). THE most important thing to do is protect the care homes and the over 65's. 

There needs to be a way to do that without literally destroying the country and lives/livelihood of everyone for years and years to come by locking everything down again. I'm not sure what that is but it needs to be discussed. 

A vaccine helps obviously if you're not an anti vaxxer. Personal responsibility? Stay away from your old family members or do it very carefully? If you are vulnerable be extra vigilant? Support the vulnerable financially while its ongoing? etc... 

I think they modelled this sort of intervention back in March and it just didn't work...NHS overwhelmed, 100s of thousands dead...which is why we ended up doing the full lockdown thing.
Maybe they will try something similar for next time though..but problem is that a lot of what govt does at moment is based on polling and focus groups and I think would be very unpopular...

[steviewevie]

4 minutes ago, FestivalJamie said:

Exactly. But what is interesting is that I think in Australia the flu has been really mild this season, so hopefully that’s some positive news for us that this year’s flu is a weak strain or perhaps it’s less easily transmitted due to all of the measures we have in place.

probably all the distancing and masks and stuff will help too.

[steviewevie]

Just now, steviewevie said:

probably all the distancing and masks and stuff will help too.

sorry @balthazarstarbuck - repeated what you said.

[Havors]

15 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

I think they modelled this sort of intervention back in March and it just didn't work...NHS overwhelmed, 100s of thousands dead...which is why we ended up doing the full lockdown thing.
Maybe they will try something similar for next time though..but problem is that a lot of what govt does at moment is based on polling and focus groups and I think would be very unpopular...

 

I think they ended up in full lockdown because all the countries did it... we literally just waited and copied other european countries... hence it being too late by all accounts. 

[zahidf]

[JoeyT]

Saw this and it made me chuckle 

[Crazyfool01]

1 minute ago, JoeyT said:

Saw this and it made me chuckle 

5 out of 6 .... they might as well chip me  

[zeppelin]

5 minutes ago, crazyfool1 said:

5 out of 6 .... they might as well chip me  

Maybe they already have... 

[Crazyfool01]

2 minutes ago, zeppelin said:

Maybe they already have... 

Close ... just waiting for the implant to be invented /work 

[SwedgeAntilles]

Aberdeen going back into lockdown again effectively. Pubs restaurants etc to close at 5pm

 

Edit- photo from the weekend of one of the city centre bars the cluster is supposedly located around 🤦‍♂️ 

Edited August 5, 2020 by SwedgeAntilles

[shoptildrop]

16 hours ago, squirrelarmy said:

That was uploaded before the big explosion. Sadly it doesn’t look good for them. There are some horrific videos of the aftermath. I won’t post them in here. 

Back to this the video was being live streamed and that was the 2nd explosion so unfortunately this guy is dead

no one will have lived in the immediate blast zone

[Ryan1984]

1 hour ago, Havors said:

 

I think they ended up in full lockdown because all the countries did it... we literally just waited and copied other european countries... hence it being too late by all accounts. 

By all accounts, except the government’s...

[squirrelarmy]

23 minutes ago, shoptildrop said:

Back to this the video was being live streamed and that was the 2nd explosion so unfortunately this guy is dead

no one will have lived in the immediate blast zone

You just have to hope it was quick and they never knew what hit them. 

[steviewevie]