When will this shit end?

[Ayrshire Chris]

24 minutes ago, Zoo Music Girl said:

Not sure if mentioned already in the above but face coverings in shops now mandatory in Scotland.

Yes, been doing it for weeks now in supermarkets here.   Be prepared for folk walking into stacks of beans, displays of corn flakes etc. If you wear glasses like I do then they steam up and you can’t see a bloody thing! 

[Homer]

Breaking news that Ghislaine Maxwell has been found and nicked

[Zoo Music Girl]

2 minutes ago, Ayrshire Chris said:

Yes, been doing it for weeks now in supermarkets here.   Be prepared for folk walking into stacks of beans, displays of corn flakes etc. If you wear glasses like I do then they steam up and you can’t see a bloody thing! 

Yeah my partner has that problem! 

[Toilet Duck]

8 minutes ago, Quark said:

Talking to a Chinese friend of mine about that, and he reckons it's basically seen as a common courtesy in large parts of east Asia. Not necessarily all day every day, but certainly if you have a cold or a sneeze or something like that it just becomes standard to wear one so you don't splutter on other people. Has a lot going for it when you think about it.

Yep, this is where I'd like to see us end up here in the "west". It's such a courteous thing to do for your fellow citizens and I'd really like to see it become normal. Would help with transmission of all sorts of things (if you want to look at it in purely economic terms, which I guess is driving much of the policies at the moment, then billions are lost on sick days every year, many of which could be avoided if people were a bit more considerate...for me it's not really about the money though and entirely about thinking about other people). Like many who have posted above, I've been popping a mask on whenever I go into a shop. Find one that feels comfortable (it takes a few wears to really get used to) and then it does become second nature (I keep some disposable ones in the door of the car in case I forget to grab the reusable one on my way out, but generally remember!). It's such a simple way of getting us out the other side of this (and beyond), I'm at a loss to understand where the problem is now that PPE for frontline staff is no longer an issue. FWIW, I have asthma and hay fever (Samter's Triad!) and I don't sneeze my mask off ever! 

[Toilet Duck]

8 minutes ago, Ayrshire Chris said:

Yes, been doing it for weeks now in supermarkets here.   Be prepared for folk walking into stacks of beans, displays of corn flakes etc. If you wear glasses like I do then they steam up and you can’t see a bloody thing! 

Soapy water on the glasses didn't work then! I think the fit around the nose is the key...those vented ones help apparently (I think they have charcoal filters in the vents, so you shouldn't be breathing out streams of virus laden expirate!)

 

Edit: Actually the soapy water suggestion may have been to our twin hatted friend rather than you, I can't keep track of who I reply to in this monster thread!

Edited July 2, 2020 by Toilet Duck

[squirrelarmy]

7 minutes ago, Homer said:

Breaking news that Ghislaine Maxwell has been found and nicked

Are we blaming her for COVID-19 too?

Completely irrelevant to this thread but it’s good that she’s finally been found. The question is will she be around long enough to give people the answers needed or will she mysteriously kill herself in a prison cell like her former lover. 

[Ozanne]

8 minutes ago, Toilet Duck said:

Yep, this is where I'd like to see us end up here in the "west". It's such a courteous thing to do for your fellow citizens and I'd really like to see it become normal. Would help with transmission of all sorts of things (if you want to look at it in purely economic terms, which I guess is driving much of the policies at the moment, then billions are lost on sick days every year, many of which could be avoided if people were a bit more considerate...for me it's not really about the money though and entirely about thinking about other people). Like many who have posted above, I've been popping a mask on whenever I go into a shop. Find one that feels comfortable (it takes a few wears to really get used to) and then it does become second nature (I keep some disposable ones in the door of the car in case I forget to grab the reusable one on my way out, but generally remember!). It's such a simple way of getting us out the other side of this (and beyond), I'm at a loss to understand where the problem is now that PPE for frontline staff is no longer an issue. FWIW, I have asthma and hay fever (Samter's Triad!) and I don't sneeze my mask off ever! 

This isn’t COVID related. But isn’t it good to keep humans susceptible to illnesses such as cold, which in turn can strengthen an immune system? If the immune system never has to fight an illness then when you do get ill it will impact you that much more. 

[Crazyfool01]

15 minutes ago, Ayrshire Chris said:

Yes, been doing it for weeks now in supermarkets here.   Be prepared for folk walking into stacks of beans, displays of corn flakes etc. If you wear glasses like I do then they steam up and you can’t see a bloody thing! 

try one similar to the one I posted a few pages back ... filter on the side and no steaming issues .... 

[Toilet Duck]

9 minutes ago, Ozanne said:

This isn’t COVID related. But isn’t it good to keep humans susceptible to illnesses such as cold, which in turn can strengthen an immune system? If the immune system never has to fight an illness then when you do get ill it will impact you that much more. 

Generally, you build the foundations of your immune system when you are young (some of it comes from your mother, the rest you accumulate when you pick up everything under the sun as a kid!). I wouldn't expect preventing minor respiratory ailments would have a massive impact on how our immune systems function to be honest. People will still pick up colds anyway (they do in countries where mask wearing is the norm), it just reduces how many other people you pass it on to when you have one. 

 

Edit: I should add that there's still considerable debate about the hygiene hypothesis and how much impact it has on things like autoimmune diseases. Much greater correlations between breast-feeding, cesarian sections etc and ongoing issues...but it's something that people have been looking at for a long while. Most important as a kid though. 

Edited July 2, 2020 by Toilet Duck

[Cream Soda]

I think this is one for @Toilet Duck

On the CDC website it says the following about antibody tests:

"A positive test result shows you may have antibodies from an infection with the virus that causes COVID-19. However, there is a chance a positive result means that you have antibodies from an infection with a virus from the same family of viruses (called coronaviruses), such as the one that causes the common cold." https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/testing/serology-overview.html

Do we know how high this chance is?  If it's quite high, doesn't that make the antibody test pretty much useless as millions will have had colds etc?

[Ozanne]

1 minute ago, Toilet Duck said:

Generally, you build the foundations of your immune system when you are young (some of it comes from your mother, the rest you accumulate when you pick up everything under the sun as a kid!). I wouldn't expect preventing minor respiratory ailments would have a massive impact on how our immune systems function to be honest. People will still pick up colds anyway (they do in countries where mask wearing is the norm), it just reduces how many other people you pass it on to when you have one. 

That’s really interesting, it’s funny how I’ve thought for ages your immune system can strengthen like that. 

[Barney McGrew]

We had to wear masks in work for a couple of weeks, 'twas awful!

If social distancing is not possible such as on public transport then fair enough but otherwise it's a no from me unless I have to.

[Ayrshire Chris]

9 minutes ago, crazyfool1 said:

try one similar to the one I posted a few pages back ... filter on the side and no steaming issues .... 

👍 cheers for that. Will do.  Are those the pointy ones that look like a plague doctors mask?

 

[Toilet Duck]

3 minutes ago, Cream Soda said:

I think this is one for @Toilet Duck

On the CDC website it says the following about antibody tests:

"A positive test result shows you may have antibodies from an infection with the virus that causes COVID-19. However, there is a chance a positive result means that you have antibodies from an infection with a virus from the same family of viruses (called coronaviruses), such as the one that causes the common cold." https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/testing/serology-overview.html

Do we know how high this chance is?  If it's quite high, doesn't that make the antibody test pretty much useless as millions will have had colds etc?

It's been an issue since the serology tests were being developed to be honest. Cross-reactivity with antibodies to other coronaviruses was identified pretty early on. They usually don't last long though, so you may only have them if you had a coronavirus-related cold in the last 6-12 months. In general, CoV causes about 10-15% of common colds, most are caused by Rhinoviruses...so, if everyone in the world caught a cold in the last year, then about 15% of them would have antibodies that recognise coronaviruses. Given that everyone in the world didn't catch a cold in the last year, then you would expect the prevalence of CoV directed antibodies to be substantially lower than 15%. That's not the same as having CoV-targeted T-Cells, which tend to hang around for years. 

[Cream Soda]

2 minutes ago, Toilet Duck said:

It's been an issue since the serology tests were being developed to be honest. Cross-reactivity with antibodies to other coronaviruses was identified pretty early on. They usually don't last long though, so you may only have them if you had a coronavirus-related cold in the last 6-12 months. In general, CoV causes about 10-15% of common colds, most are caused by Rhinoviruses...so, if everyone in the world caught a cold in the last year, then about 15% of them would have antibodies that recognise coronaviruses. Given that everyone in the world didn't catch a cold in the last year, then you would expect the prevalence of CoV directed antibodies to be substantially lower than 15%. That's not the same as having CoV-targeted T-Cells, which tend to hang around for years. 

Thankyou.  I guess there could be a few issues in the winter when more viruses are going around but I suppose it can't be helped without a test that's 100%.

[FestivalJamie]

Just on the subject of masks, if this virus doesn’t go away or the top scientists don’t find a successful vaccine... we are stuck with it for the foreseeable future.

If gigs want to go ahead within the next year, and I know a lot plan to start October/November time, and the virus hasn’t run its course or we haven’t got a vaccine or a treatment, then if they get the green light they are going to be very different.

I imagine there would be a temperature check at the entrance to the gig, mandatory face masks the whole time and perhaps you will have to have a certificate with a negative covid test from the last 48 hours.

This is all speculation of course, but if the virus doesn’t go away in one form or another, we are stuck with it, and then masks will become part of day to day life. If you want to go on public transport, you need a mask, if you want to go to a theme park or a gig, you need a mask and probably if you want to go shopping you will need to take a mask.

Keeping 1-2m apart from other people can’t stick around forever, but masks can. If we don’t have a vaccine, treatment or if the virus doesn’t run out, we are stuck with it and masks will just become a natural part of day to day life. Governments from all around the world have already gotten people used to wearing them in day to day life so I think it’s time the British public start getting used to them, we don’t know how long this virus is going to stick with us or how long masks will be needed for, so I personally think it’s best Britain starts to get used to wearing them in public. 

Edited July 2, 2020 by FestivalJamie

[sisco]

I find these things interesting.  Other countries really gearing up to allowing big crowds of people already. 

[steviewevie]

I think everyone should have to wear masks except me.

[Chef]

 

 

[gmb1992]

I have a dinner booking next weekend and the restaurant has said that when diners are not at the table they should wear masks (when going to the toilet etc)

It will be weird, but personally masks don't bother me, I ended up in hospital with appendicitis last month so got used to having to wear one then. I also feel sorry for all the hospital staff who have to wear them the whole time they are in work. I'll wear a mask wherever if it means a bit more normality. 

Edited July 2, 2020 by gmb1992

[Ozanne]

24 minutes ago, FestivalJamie said:

Just on the subject of masks, if this virus doesn’t go away or the top scientists don’t find a successful vaccine... we are stuck with it for the foreseeable future.

If gigs want to go ahead within the next year, and I know a lot plan to start October/November time, and the virus hasn’t run its course or we haven’t got a vaccine or a treatment, then if they get the green light they are going to be very different.

I imagine there would be a temperature check at the entrance to the gig, mandatory face masks the whole time and perhaps you will have to have a certificate with a negative covid test from the last 48 hours.

This is all speculation of course, but if the virus doesn’t go away in one form or another, we are stuck with it, and then masks will become part of day to day life. If you want to go on public transport, you need a mask, if you want to go to a theme park or a gig, you need a mask and probably if you want to go shopping you will need to take a mask.

Keeping 1-2m apart from other people can’t stick around forever, but masks can. If we don’t have a vaccine, treatment or if the virus doesn’t run out, we are stuck with it and masks will just become a natural part of day to day life. Governments from all around the world have already gotten people used to wearing them in day to day life so I think it’s time the British public start getting used to them, we don’t know how long this virus is going to stick with us or how long masks will be needed for, so I personally think it’s best Britain starts to get used to wearing them in public. 

Do you own shares in a mask company? 😉

[thrillhouse188]

Apologies if this sounds insensitive, but at which point in advancement of treatment etc does covid just became something we have to live with (as far as gatherings etc go, of course masks could become more commonplace generally, maybe even enforce higher hygiene standards in pubs/restaurants)? From the government perspective I get this impression that's the plan anyway, get to a point where we can reduce fatality rates enough that it's just consider equivalent to a (albeit more severe) flu, a risk of catching anytime but treatable for most not-at-risk people

[FestivalJamie]

7 minutes ago, gmb1992 said:

I have a dinner booking next weekend and the restaurant has said that when diners are not at the table they should wear masks (when going to the toilet etc)

It will be weird, but personally masks don't bother me, I ended up in hospital with appendicitis last month so got used to having to wear one then. I also feel sorry for all the hospital staff who have to wear them the whole time they are in work. I'll wear a mask wherever if it means a bit more normality. 

This is the policy in germany, and from what I’ve seen it seems to work there, as places the toilets can cause bottlenecks where is particularly hard to social distance. (On that front, I think masks should be mandatory in toilets as it’s impossible to social distance in toilets! When I was at longleat safari park it was so crowded in the toilets and only a couple of people had masks on!)

Id imagine more restaurants, pubs and cinemas might start to move into this type of policy.

[onthebeach]

17 minutes ago, Chef said:

 

 

Oh b**llcks - it’s gone up but only but only by 0.8% - at least we’re not looking at an exponential rise

[Cream Soda]

1 minute ago, FestivalJamie said:

This is the policy in germany, and from what I’ve seen it seems to work there, as places the toilets can cause bottlenecks where is particularly hard to social distance. (On that front, I think masks should be mandatory in toilets as it’s impossible to social distance in toilets! When I was at longleat safari park it was so crowded in the toilets and only a couple of people had masks on!)

Id imagine more restaurants, pubs and cinemas might start to move into this type of policy.

One of the places I'm going to at the weekend has put a lock on the main toilet door so only one person can go in at a time.  Guess there could be a wait, especially for the ladies