FuzzyDunlop Posted December 14, 2019 Report Share Posted December 14, 2019 I have gone for a day out to Burnley vs Newcastle today. Outside Turf Moor they are doing collections for a food bank. Burnley voted tory for the first time in their lives. Disgusting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eastynh Posted December 14, 2019 Report Share Posted December 14, 2019 56 minutes ago, Matt42 said: Do you truly believe that? How many times does labour have to peddle this “oh well they didn’t want socialism this time, but they will want it next time!” narrative before you understand? The tories have you nailed. I’m telling you now. Matt look at the images below. One of these is for Bury South and the other from Middleton/Heywood. The Tories made next to no increase in vote share in Mid/Heywood, all the losses went to the Brexit Party. Now the Tories made a bit more of an impact in Bury but Labour still would have won if they had not lost votes to the Brexit party. Brexit was the main reason why Labour lost seats in the Machester satellite towns. It had absolutely nothing to do with Labour policy. In places like Langley in Middleton, people can not spell economic policy, nevermind know what it means. It is the type of place where they think inflation is something you hire for the kids birthday and they jump up and down on it, in the garden. Middleton is the type of place where the residents go mad because Roy Chubby Brown concerts fet canceled by the venue holders. Now I am not having a pop at Middleton as it is just as bad, if not worse where I live. But I promise you that Brexit is the main factor for Labour losing seats round here, not its policies. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FuzzyDunlop Posted December 14, 2019 Report Share Posted December 14, 2019 On 12/13/2019 at 2:06 PM, FuzzyDunlop said: As someone who lives in Heywood and Middleton, A traditional Labour heartland in North Manchester, 1 the Tories won - I am as well served as any on the forum to answer some of this. Reasons they won it 1. Brexit. Brexit is the number one issue. People voted to leave. Like that or not. Lied to or not - they did. People around here believe they have not been listened to. I didn't vote in the referendum as I didn't care about whether we left or not. I still don't. There is an argument for each. Before 2016 the EU wasn't discussed by people I know. Now it is. The public have been duped into believing its an overriding issue in my opinion. However, that duping has led to it being the reason so many people around here voted for the Tories. I believed that would see a surge in Brexit party votes. I thought there would be a protest vote. Just not to the Tories. 2. Overconfidence from Labour. Up until Monday I had not received a labour leaflet. I had not had anyone at my door. The Tories 3 leaflets. Brexit 1. Whilst that's only a small thing, I believe Labour never thought a 7,500 majority would be overturned. 3. Corbyn. He wasn't well liked. I heard people under the age of 40 complaining about him being an IRA sympathiser. That was an issue. My grandma is Labour through and through. She was a nurse. In 1984 my granddad died, she decided to become even more politically active. She was at orgreave helping miners who had been beaten by the cops. She was on pickets in Chesterfield. She has never voted anything but Red. She did again yesterday, but only just. When she is having 2nd thoughts - I knew there was trouble. Her issue. Corbyn was a leaver. Always was a leaver, but he flip flopped around. He can't be trusted. She voted to remain, but she felt that to not leave was an attack on democracy. 4. Diane Abbott. Like this or not. She is ridiculed. People laughed at her. Even if it was at times, downright lies and bullying. 5. People not taking labour seriously. "Free this, free that, free the other". That was how people saw the manifesto. Rather than looking at it and analysing it. It was seen as a magical mystical document. 6. People not caring. Turnout was low. A massive section of society around here didn't bother. There is large unemployment. I can imagine what the Tories will think of Langley and Darn Hill. 2 Massive council estates. 7. America. They have trump, we have Boris 8. Racism. Heywood is a racist place. I know it is. I rarely rarely see a non white face. It is the only town in the country that has a pub which hangs a pre apartheid South African flag outside of it. I know Im requoting myself, but on Heywood & Middleton, the above is how I see it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crazyfool01 Posted December 14, 2019 Report Share Posted December 14, 2019 2 hours ago, blue6field said: Read somewhere yesterday that, Google had said the most popular search they had was the cost of moving Scotland , not sure if its true or not ive been busy on google Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gizmoman Posted December 14, 2019 Report Share Posted December 14, 2019 3 hours ago, eastynh said: Matt look at the images below. One of these is for Bury South and the other from Middleton/Heywood. The Tories made next to no increase in vote share in Mid/Heywood, all the losses went to the Brexit Party. Now the Tories made a bit more of an impact in Bury but Labour still would have won if they had not lost votes to the Brexit party. Brexit was the main reason why Labour lost seats in the Machester satellite towns. It had absolutely nothing to do with Labour policy. In places like Langley in Middleton, people can not spell economic policy, nevermind know what it means. It is the type of place where they think inflation is something you hire for the kids birthday and they jump up and down on it, in the garden. Middleton is the type of place where the residents go mad because Roy Chubby Brown concerts fet canceled by the venue holders. Now I am not having a pop at Middleton as it is just as bad, if not worse where I live. But I promise you that Brexit is the main factor for Labour losing seats round here, not its policies. Yes those working class lowlifes are so stupid aren't they? They looked at the tory and thought they were voting for Morrissey. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FuzzyDunlop Posted December 14, 2019 Report Share Posted December 14, 2019 (edited) I have fished out the leaflet from the outside bin & read his plan... 20,000 more police officers for Heywood & Middleton! We will be safe as fuck. Back page = all Brexit Edited December 14, 2019 by FuzzyDunlop Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt42 Posted December 14, 2019 Report Share Posted December 14, 2019 why are labour supporters still trying to prove to people that their policies are popular? I think if labour is to progress the socialist goggles need to come off. Don’t give me a “well if brexit wasn’t a thing we would have a socialist country” argument. It’s not true and further fetched than anything I’ve ever said. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gizmoman Posted December 14, 2019 Report Share Posted December 14, 2019 7 minutes ago, FuzzyDunlop said: I have fished out the leaflet from the outside bin & read his plan... 20,000 more police officers for Heywood & Middleton! We will be safe as fuck. Back page = all Brexit "CLARKSON" in super size font too! He couldn't lose! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gizmoman Posted December 14, 2019 Report Share Posted December 14, 2019 You don't happen to have the Labour leaflet too do you? I could do with a laugh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ayrshire Chris Posted December 14, 2019 Report Share Posted December 14, 2019 So now the world has Trump. Putin. Kim Jong Un and Boris all in charge of the nuclear buttons. and I live about twenty five miles away from the Trident Nuclear Submarine base and the convoys of missiles go up the road usually during the night and the subs sail past my town regularly. So there’s no need for us to ask for independence, we will be blown to bits. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crazyfool01 Posted December 14, 2019 Report Share Posted December 14, 2019 7 minutes ago, Ayrshire Chris said: So now the world has Trump. Putin. Kim Jong Un and Boris all in charge of the nuclear buttons. and I live about twenty five miles away from the Trident Nuclear Submarine base and the convoys of missiles go up the road usually during the night and the subs sail past my town regularly. So there’s no need for us to ask for independence, we will be blown to bits. Is anyone any safer ? wherever you live ? .... Anyway AC away from issues of this hows your weekend ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Superscally Posted December 14, 2019 Report Share Posted December 14, 2019 1 hour ago, Matt42 said: why are labour supporters still trying to prove to people that their policies are popular? I think if labour is to progress the socialist goggles need to come off. Don’t give me a “well if brexit wasn’t a thing we would have a socialist country” argument. It’s not true and further fetched than anything I’ve ever said. We would if there wasn't an overriding trend of "sod you Jack, I'm alright." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H.M.V Posted December 14, 2019 Report Share Posted December 14, 2019 Been thinking about this a lot and reading stuff on the socials. Seems to me that better decisions need to be made in Labour HQ and one of the ways is to join and have a vote in the leadership and hopefully direction of the party if they are to have any kind of chance next time. Otherwise we'll get more of the same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ayrshire Chris Posted December 14, 2019 Report Share Posted December 14, 2019 20 minutes ago, crazyfool1 said: Is anyone any safer ? wherever you live ? .... Anyway AC away from issues of this hows your weekend ? actually we’ve a secret bunker up in the hills, took a walk up to it last week! . Sssshh don’t tell the Russians! Only in the UK would a secret installation have a neighbourhood watch sign on it. quiet weekend, babysitting, it’s pissing down outside! Watching a programme about extreme weather this year hoping to see glasto festival on it ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crazyfool01 Posted December 14, 2019 Report Share Posted December 14, 2019 1 minute ago, Ayrshire Chris said: actually we’ve a secret bunker up in the hills, took a walk up to it last week! . Sssshh don’t tell the Russians! Only in the UK would a secret installation have a neighbourhood watch sign on it. quiet weekend, babysitting, it’s pissing down outside! Watching a programme about extreme weather this year hoping to see glasto festival on it ! looks like its 5g ready too ... get those tin hats ready ... pissing down here too ... which as its dark you won't be able to see much on your webcams .... did you arrange any trips to the farm in the end ? , was looking at my walk thread yesterday and reminiscing 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ayrshire Chris Posted December 14, 2019 Report Share Posted December 14, 2019 1 minute ago, crazyfool1 said: looks like its 5g ready too ... get those tin hats ready ... pissing down here too ... which as its dark you won't be able to see much on your webcams .... did you arrange any trips to the farm in the end ? , was looking at my walk thread yesterday and reminiscing Nothing arranged yet, maybe in the new year Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crazyfool01 Posted December 14, 2019 Report Share Posted December 14, 2019 1 minute ago, Ayrshire Chris said: Nothing arranged yet, maybe in the new year might swing over to the farm and say hello .... will need to test out the backpack if its arrived by then .... and we have survived nuclear attack Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghostdancer1 Posted December 15, 2019 Report Share Posted December 15, 2019 the Corbynistas STILL pushing the theory that they lost because of Labour's position on Brexit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt42 Posted December 15, 2019 Report Share Posted December 15, 2019 Party members turning on their activists. Labour is truly dead. It’s never coming back. I’d put my fortune on it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FuzzyDunlop Posted December 15, 2019 Report Share Posted December 15, 2019 (edited) 19 minutes ago, Matt42 said: Party members turning on their activists. Labour is truly dead. It’s never coming back. I’d put my fortune on it. Apparently this happened in '82 ( before I was born). It took 15 years to win another election. Its very easy to say "never coming back". Things must change. Thats a fact. Never is impossible to predict. Video is a few years old, but you get the idea Edited December 15, 2019 by FuzzyDunlop Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eFestivals Posted December 15, 2019 Report Share Posted December 15, 2019 21 hours ago, CaledonianGonzo said: That's my point. It was a centre left manifesto. appropriation of private property isn't 'centre left'. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homer Posted December 15, 2019 Report Share Posted December 15, 2019 21 hours ago, fatyeti24 said: Just as an aside, one thing I've detested in this campaign is the prefix 'northern'. Do you ever hear 'southern' used? This focus on what bit of land you were born on, and how that makes you different (from London) is really frustrating. (Said as a tactical lib dem remainer not a million miles from Workington) Apologies, I just wasn’t really listening to the tv as I was typing on here ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madyaker Posted December 15, 2019 Report Share Posted December 15, 2019 In my opinion there needs to be some sort of grassroots movement to abolish the first past the post system and it isn't going to come from either of the main parties. Anything else is just painting a house thats about to collapse. If you read the UK media people are freaking out about losing the NHS, whats Brexit going to look like etc but all that stuff is just symptoms caused by a deeper malaise that is the FPTP system. Cameron would never have called the referendum if he wasn't worried about the brexit party nicking seats from the tories when they had their initial upsurge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fatyeti24 Posted December 15, 2019 Report Share Posted December 15, 2019 48 minutes ago, Homer said: Apologies, I just wasn’t really listening to the tv as I was typing on here ? Oh it wasn't directed at you, Homes, it was just something that's increasingly got on my tits over the last few weeks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FuzzyDunlop Posted December 15, 2019 Report Share Posted December 15, 2019 29 minutes ago, fatyeti24 said: Oh it wasn't directed at you, Homes, it was just something that's increasingly got on my tits over the last few weeks! The thing is though, the north voting for The Tories is a big deal. If a seat hasnt had a tory mp for 100 years & now it has - that's newsworthy. Those seats all happen to be up north. I appreciate it seems like division, but its a fact. The Tories won by getting seats up here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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