efests Exit Poll

[stuie]

41 minutes ago, hfuhruhurr said:

I fully accept this result. But I can't accept the referendum result that was based on a lie. A less than 2% swing and we'd have had a different result. £350m on the bus along with other proven and accepted lies influenced more than 2%. Since the referendum, remain has consistently been ahead in the polls. We should have the democratic right to vote again based on better quality information - I believe that's all we "remoaners" want - we'd accept the result if Leave won.

We're not getting a second referendum now - this election was a confirmatory vote, in my opinion.   It makes me incredibly sad but the reason for this result is the 'get Brexit done' position that the Tories campaigned with.  

It spoke to leavers and also remainers who are jaded with the situation and want it to go away.

Unfortunately, for all of them, it's still not that simple and will take many more years to resolve.

[vardyvarvar]

51 minutes ago, HattersBoy said:

South West Herts, with the independent and the Tory vote the Lib Dems and Labour really struggled last night.

Yep - same here. People voted at a ratio 2:1 for the Conservative candidate when Dominic Grieve had been our MP for 22 years and was very well liked.

[philipsteak]

6 minutes ago, CaledonianGonzo said:

You cam have some from the special jar which I bought in Kerala a few weeks back. Made with an Aeropress.

Now your talking

[C14S]

Fed up with people on here attacking anyone that voted Tory. You might not agree with them, but everyone has a right to a vote, everyone votes for what they think is best. Probably 95% of Tory votes aren't voting that way out of selfishness or rich middle class-ness, it'll be because they have more faith in Boris' Tory government to help the country than Corbin's Labour one. It is as simple as that. You don't have to agree with them, but we're a democracy ffs, your opinion isn't more valid or more correct than anyone elses.

[FuzzyDunlop]

2 minutes ago, C14S said:

Fed up with people on here attacking anyone that voted Tory. You might not agree with them, but everyone has a right to a vote, everyone votes for what they think is best. Probably 95% of Tory votes aren't voting that way out of selfishness or rich middle class-ness, it'll be because they have more faith in Boris' Tory government to help the country than Corbin's Labour one. It is as simple as that. You don't have to agree with them, but we're a democracy ffs, your opinion isn't more valid or more correct than anyone elses.

We live in a democracy. The Tories should be in power.

It doesn't and shouldn't stop me thinking anyone who voted for them is a bellend though. Tories can dislike me for supporting a "terrorist sympathiser" that's the way it should work.

[SwedgeAntilles]

Scottish independence is the way forward lads. The great thing about civic nationalism is y´all can just move there tomorrow and get to vote!

[maelzoid]

56 minutes ago, hfuhruhurr said:

I fully accept this result. But I can't accept the referendum result that was based on a lie. A less than 2% swing and we'd have had a different result. £350m on the bus along with other proven and accepted lies influenced more than 2%. Since the referendum, remain has consistently been ahead in the polls. We should have the democratic right to vote again based on better quality information - I believe that's all we "remoaners" want - we'd accept the result if Leave won.

Not to mention Leave.EU broke election law, as ruled by the electoral commission and conceded when Leave.EU dropped all appeals against the ruling. To my mind, that is without question an unsafe result and grounds enough for a second referendum.

Sadly, the opposition did not make this point at all. I know that many in Labour, including their leader were leavers, but it was their responsibility to campaign against any wrongdoing by the incumbent government. They let us all down.

[Freddyflintstonree]

2 minutes ago, FuzzyDunlop said:

It doesn't and shouldn't stop me thinking anyone who voted for them is a bellend though. 

I can't help but point out just how many people you think are bellends then. If you had to say "you're a bellend" to everyone you bumped into that voted tory, I really don't think you'd have a great time of it.

[maelzoid]

12 minutes ago, stuie said:

We're not getting a second referendum now - this election was a confirmatory vote, in my opinion.   It makes me incredibly sad but the reason for this result is the 'get Brexit done' position that the Tories campaigned with.  

It spoke to leavers and also remainers who are jaded with the situation and want it to go away.

Unfortunately, for all of them, it's still not that simple and will take many more years to resolve.

This is exactly right. Sadly, I think so many people think that getting Brexit done means that this will all be over by this time next year. So far, only the interim deal has been negotiated. The govt still has to negotiate a full and lasting deal which I agree will take years. In the meantime a recession is almost a certainty, the environment will continue to suffer and Scotland will probably secede from the UK.

[uscore]

Yeah there's no more referendums to be had.  The positive? spin now is that it is unarguably a Tory Brexit. They own it. They can claim credit for any unicorns it delivers, but they are responsible for any damage it causes. Hopefully a new generation of voters will judge them on its success, for many elections to come.

[C14S]

5 minutes ago, FuzzyDunlop said:

We live in a democracy. The Tories should be in power.

It doesn't and shouldn't stop me thinking anyone who voted for them is a bellend though. Tories can dislike me for supporting a "terrorist sympathiser" that's the way it should work.

Don't get me wrong I think Boris is a bellend, I wouldn't vote Tory but its unfair to label every Tory voter a bellend because they have a different view to you. Hell they could easily say the same about Labour voters if they chose to, and most of them could probably justify it as well as you can justify them being bellends. 

My point is that your political beliefs don't really mean that much about who you are as a person. I have good mates who are Tories, good mates who will always vote Labour. They don't dislike each other just because they voted differently. That's ridiculous.

[CaledonianGonzo]

12 minutes ago, SwedgeAntilles said:

Scottish independence is the way forward lads. The great thing about civic nationalism is y´all can just move there tomorrow and get to vote!

You're as bad as Hitler.

[zero000]

SNP logic:

 

Complain about being dragged out of a union of countries. 
 

Solution:

Remove themselves from another union of countries. 

[festhead]

35 minutes ago, Doug85 said:

I don't have to explain my statements, I simply don't agree with that way of thinking/voting. That is my right and it is also my right to think that it is a selfish way of voting. 

Ps I am far from a Corbynister/ta. I just voted any way I could to not let a born liar, islamophobic, homophobic, racist twat become prime minister and unfortunately he has done so anyway. 

and you do so by spreading hate (calling people c*nts & t*ats because they have a different political viewpoint to you). These kind of comments are not conducive in getting a party you support in to power. in fact in turns more people away. And this in large is why what happened yesterday happened.

there is a direct counter statement out there about the leader of the other main party too though isn't there? (anti-semite, Pro IRA etc etc). Now I am not making comments that either are or are not, but there is more than one narrative. 

Edited December 13, 2019 by festhead

[Havors]

36 minutes ago, stuie said:

We're not getting a second referendum now - this election was a confirmatory vote, in my opinion.   It makes me incredibly sad but the reason for this result is the 'get Brexit done' position that the Tories campaigned with.  

It spoke to leavers and also remainers who are jaded with the situation and want it to go away.

Unfortunately, for all of them, it's still not that simple and will take many more years to resolve.

The issue is that votes in all those little towns count more than in the bigger metropolitan areas in a general election... so yes the Leavers spoke and won but it was not indicative off the view of the  majority of the country.  

Brexit won this for the Tories. I think without Brexit involved it would have been a hung parliament or tiny tiny majority for Tories.... and that would be because a lot people hate Corbyn (rightly or wrongly). 

[Ayrshire Chris]

Some of the votes in Scotland were anti Tory rather than pro independence, voting snp was seen as a way of expressing their hatred of Boris and the whole Brexit fiasco. Votes were lent to the snp rather than given to corbyn.  Interesting that 45% voted snp, the same amount of votes the snp got in the 2014 referendum.

If the pressure builds for another referendum then that’s when the snp have to answer the serious questions on currency, how long it would take to rejoin theEU, managing the deficit, dealing with the problems of being in theEU and having a land border with TheUK outside of Europe.  Whatever happens this election has created more questions than answers. 

[CaledonianGonzo]

15 minutes ago, zero000 said:

SNP logic:

 

Complain about being dragged out of a union of countries. 
 

Solution:

Remove themselves from another union of countries. 

Seems straightforward enough to me.

 

[SwedgeAntilles]

11 minutes ago, zero000 said:

SNP logic:

 

Complain about being dragged out of a union of countries. 
 

Solution:

Remove themselves from another union of countries. 

That´s a false equivalence though innit? We, who support Scottish independence, feel that our level of control over our own matters within the UK - given we are meant to be an equal partner rather than a region (such as Wales for example) - is disproportionate.

We completely understand and accept the level of influence we have/will have within the EU . We would still have a much greater control over some key matters, such as Trident.

[SwedgeAntilles]

1 minute ago, Ayrshire Chris said:

Some of the votes in Scotland were anti Tory rather than pro independence, voting snp was seen as a way of expressing their hatred of Boris and the whole Brexit fiasco. Votes were lent to the snp rather than given to corbyn.  Interesting that 45% voted snp, the same amount of votes the snp got in the 2014 referendum.

If the pressure builds for another referendum then that’s when the snp have to answer the serious questions on currency, how long it would take to rejoin theEU, managing the deficit, dealing with the problems of being in theEU and having a land border with TheUK outside of Europe.  Whatever happens this election has created more questions than answers. 

Have they not done this tho after the last conference? Whether it´s a good idea or not is to be debated but they´re in a much better place than they were on currency during indy ref 1

[stuie]

7 minutes ago, Havors said:

The issue is that votes in all those little towns count more than in the bigger metropolitan areas in a general election... so yes the Leavers spoke and won but it was not indicative off the view of the  majority of the country.  

Brexit won this for the Tories. I think without Brexit involved it would have been a hung parliament or tiny tiny majority for Tories.... and that would be because a lot people hate Corbyn (rightly or wrongly). 

It sure did.  And it's over to them now.

When it turns out to be an even more monumental fuckstorm than we already think it is, they won't be able to blame anyone else.

Conservative referendum, a Conservative deal, voted through by a Conservative majority.

 

[Doug85]

12 minutes ago, festhead said:

and you do so by spreading hate (calling people c*nts & t*ats because they have a different political viewpoint to you). These kind of comments are not conducive in getting a party you support in to power. in fact in turns more people away. And this in large is why what happened yesterday happened.

there is a direct counter statement out there about the leader of the other main party too though isn't there? (anti-semite, Pro IRA etc etc). Now I am not making comments that either are or are not, but there is more than one narrative. 

I've seen enough hate, prejudice, racism from tory voters over the years to have my opinion on people who vote that way. That doesn't mean I hate them all, I have friends who have voted that way, I disagree with them and they disagree with me. They full accept that their reasons for voting that way can be seen as selfish though. 

[Alex DeLarge]

I don't automatically hate people who vote Tory or whatever, it's just funny how silent they go from literally any pushback on their views or ideaology.

[Ayrshire Chris]

1 minute ago, SwedgeAntilles said:

Have they not done this tho after the last conference? Whether it´s a good idea or not is to be debated but they´re in a much better place than they were on currency during indy ref 1

It’s their plan, not been ratified by the EU who would prefer new countries to join the euro. The idea to keep the pound would mean fiscal policy, interest rates etc would be controlled by the Bank of England, basically a foreign country controlling your interest rates and economy. Also the Bank of England would have to be the bank of last resort, protecting savings etc in a financial crisis or failure of the banking system,  and we’ve had one of them already! 

 I am not debunking the idea, just pointing out that the snp need to answer serious questions now rather than just use soundbites and rhetoric. If they can come up with concrete proposals that are credible then that will really strengthen their case . 

[Havors]

3 minutes ago, stuie said:

It sure did.  And it's over to them now.

When it turns out to be an even more monumental fuckstorm than we already think it is, they won't be able to blame anyone else.

Conservative referendum, a Conservative deal, voted through by a Conservative majority.

 

Yep I agree. It seems a lot of people in this country are like alcoholics or drug addicts.... they need to really hit rock bottom before they help themselves and let themselves be helped. 

5 More years of cuts incoming.... plus whatever mess Brexit will actually cause.  If it is as bad some envisage then the next election could see the complete opposite result. 

[Alex DeLarge]

1 hour ago, Barry Trotter said:

 

You post shite like this then complain about people being nasty. Get a grip.