McShit festivals

[eFestivals]

5 minutes ago, matichin said:

However will be very interested to see how well they perform

that's the really dreadful thing. I'm thinking they'll do very well.  

[jfaragher]

10 minutes ago, Jah_Roots said:

the death knell rang on festivals the moment Glastonbury let Channel 4 through the gate - so i guess even though there's no McShit at Glastonbury in a round-a-bout way its kind of their fault really...

Or was it

...when they let NME sponsor the second stage

...when they banned the sound systems

...when they told the travellers to piss off

...when they allowed police on site

...when they needed to get a licence and had to stop the music at midnight

...when they started charging more than £5

There's a reason that Glastonbury has thrived and remains one of the most significant cultural events in the world - they've changed with the times - if it was exactly like it was in [~whatever year you happened to go for the first time] today, it wouldn't exist.  Kids today want to get fucked up, listen to the music *they* love,  grab a McD and post it all on Instagram.  Festivals that want to attract younger crowds will try to meet that need.   It means they might not be the event for you any more, but there will still be ones that cater for your (my?) need for an 'authentic old fashioned festival experience'.  Market segmentation innit.

[eFestivals]

7 minutes ago, maelzoid said:

Just got back from Download. Two of the meals I had were overpriced but adequate at best. On Sunday I had a Wow Burger - one of the worst burgers I've ever had and it cost £7. I don't want festivals overrun with chain outlets, but if the independents churn out what I had a at Download, people will flock to the chains because of their reliability. I think it's quite straightforward to make a burger far better than any at McDonalds and still turn a handsome profit if you're charging £7, rather than the dreadful corner-cutting and cheapskatery I experienced this weekend.

Independents, it's up to you!

The quality of food at festivals is's not only up to the independents - it's up to the market managers of those festivals to get the good independents.

Some festivals manage to do it extremely well.

[eFestivals]

1 minute ago, jfaragher said:

There's a reason that Glastonbury has thrived and remains one of the most significant cultural events in the world - they've changed with the times

but they also haven't changed too. They don't (as standard*) let in the corporates.

(* yes, I'm aware there have been and still are one or two exceptions. BTW, it's worth noting that EE's presence is largely due to licencing conditions).

[SouthbanKen]

10 minutes ago, clarkete said:

"Ball-less, soul-less, spiritless corporate little bitches! Suckers of Satan's cock, each and every one of them"

Is it a two way street in some way?  Do they need to use better packaging to get into these places or the same wasteful shite?
 

I would put some significant money of McDonald's UK being a whole lot less wasteful in terms of packaging than a large chunk of the "independent" traders at festivals. I'm not an advocate of McDonald's and the US parent company in particular, but McDonald's UK have been working towards improving their overall sustainability and ethical approach for a long time now, don't get me wrong they only do this to appease the slacktivist UK consumer rather than any actual sense of overall good, but as an example they only use organic milk in their tea and coffee, their delivery vehicles are all bio diesel, most of which comes from their own used cooking oil, they will achieve zero waste to landfill by next year. 

You also have to remember that a lot of the "independent" traders at festivals, i'm not so sure at Glasto as i have not been for years, are not really independent. At other large festivals, a large chunk of the more standard Burger, Noodle bar offerings will be operated by one of a few larger specialist companies, same as the bars. Not all by any stretch and i know that Glasto and may of the boutique festivals are strong supporters of the true independents. 

Rather than the death of festivals, i think you can see this is a shift towards greater differentiation in festivals, and the fact that food is a key driver and decision influencer as well as "theme" maker. We all go to festivals for the music, but how many people on here say that the food is also a big part of the draw as well. The likes of Wilderness and Standon Calling already list chefs, restaurants and key street food traders on their line up bill - i remember going to Standon a couple of years ago and one of the main higlights on the bill was a brownie stall - (they were so f------g good).  If a festival is going more mainstream with their music line up then it will follow that their food line up will follow suit as this is what their customers want. 

 

 

 

[Fork_UK]

I maybe going against the grain here, but I fucking love a Big Mac.

[jfaragher]

2 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

but they also haven't changed too. They don't (as standard*) let in the corporates.

(* yes, I'm aware there have been and still are one or two exceptions. BTW, it's worth noting that EE's presence is largely due to licencing conditions).

True, it's just my standard rant about people saying 'it's not as good as it used to be'!  

The mistake some people make is thinking that every aspect of the festival should be explicitly designed around what *they* want, because their version of Glastonbury is the authenticist of all versions. 

I think Glastonbury has done a great job of keeping up with the times without abandoning its core principles - I also think that there's room in the festival market for people who are explicitly and openly commercial.  I'll never go to them (I went to Reading once in 2000 and decided then and there that I'd never go back because it was too commercial), but they fill a requirement.

[Hugh Jass]

To me this just looks like a bit of a marketing stunt anyway rather than a scurrilous attempt to muscle into the festival scene.

[maelzoid]

8 minutes ago, Fork_UK said:

I maybe going against the grain here, but I fucking love a Big Mac.

 

 

Edited June 18, 2019 by maelzoid

[incident]

11 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

so you think McD's haven't seen festivals as an opportunity until now? Cos that would have to be the case, that this is the first time they've wanted to be involved.

I can't see that being true myself.

Genuinely, I have no idea, but my suspicion would be that if they have investigated it before now the reason it didn't happen would be that they didn't think it was worth the cost of entry rather a moral brick wall in the way.

I do actually agree with you that there's been a culture shift and that at one point this wouldn't have been acceptable.. I'd just put it at ~25 years ago with the televising of Glastonbury and the start of V, TITP, type events rather than in the last 10 years.

[dingbat2]

Hopefully they'll be gone in a flurry

Edited June 18, 2019 by dingbat2

[faymondo]

Awaiting the full line up release but fully expecting a McShit, Burger King and KFC clash !!

[eFestivals]

1 minute ago, incident said:

I do actually agree with you that there's been a culture shift and that at one point this wouldn't have been acceptable.. I'd just put it at ~25 years ago with the televising of Glastonbury and the start of V, TITP, type events rather than in the last 10 years.

but the 'mainstream festivals' such as V still didn't go down the McD's route. They very much took their cue from how existing festivals did things.

This is a shift, and a big one. In the public's eyes it doesn't get more corporate than McD's.

[SouthbanKen]

18 minutes ago, maelzoid said:

Just got back from Download. Two of the meals I had were overpriced but adequate at best. On Sunday I had a Wow Burger - one of the worst burgers I've ever had and it cost £7. I don't want festivals overrun with chain outlets, but if the independents churn out what I had a at Download, people will flock to the chains because of their reliability. I think it's quite straightforward to make a burger far better than any at McDonalds and still turn a handsome profit if you're charging £7, rather than the dreadful corner-cutting and cheapskatery I experienced this weekend.

 Independents, it's up to you!

And if they are paying VAT (20%) and a commission to the festival (25%), that gives them £4.20 to make you your burger, pay off their van, pay staff to be at the festival, buy the ingredients, pay the cost of fuel to cook it, fuel to get to the event, storage for their van, cover the massive losses they will make when one or more of their big UK summer festivals is inevitably goes to s--- because of rain, plus maybe make a bit of a profit on the whole venture. 

It's so easy to go, i could make a great burger for £7, of course you could but in reality, they are actually trying to make a great burger for about £1.20 and still turn a profit. Not as easy as all that. 

[SouthbanKen]

21 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

so you think McD's haven't seen festivals as an opportunity until now? Cos that would have to be the case, that this is the first time they've wanted to be involved.

I can't see that being true myself.

I think they are too protective of their brand to risk bad customer experience in a field and the value of that risk in terms of revenues was too small to take the risk. Even now they are only doing chicken nuggets, which is basically just a fryer so easy to do in a field compared to assembling a burger.

[maelzoid]

Just now, SouthbanKen said:

And if they are paying VAT (20%) and a commission to the festival (25%), that gives them £4.20 to make you your burger, pay off their van, pay staff to be at the festival, buy the ingredients, pay the cost of fuel to cook it, fuel to get to the event, storage for their van, cover the massive losses they will make when one or more of their big UK summer festivals is inevitably goes to s--- because of rain, plus maybe make a bit of a profit on the whole venture. 

It's so easy to go, i could make a great burger for £7, of course you could but in reality, they are actually trying to make a great burger for about £1.20 and still turn a profit. Not as easy as all that. 

Thanks for the lesson in retail economics.

Of course it begs the question, how the hell have I bought great burgers at other festivals from other retailers for similar money?

 

[SouthbanKen]

19 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

but they also haven't changed too. They don't (as standard*) let in the corporates.

(* yes, I'm aware there have been and still are one or two exceptions. BTW, it's worth noting that EE's presence is largely due to licencing conditions).

Genuine question, what has EE got to do with licensing?

[EasyUserName]

1 hour ago, sadimmock said:

The Co-Op is, as the name suggests, a cooperative movement owned by its members as opposed to shareholders. It subscribed to ethical principles from its birth....

Didn't this ethos fail to carry through when they ran a bank?

[Woffy]

1 hour ago, sadimmock said:

The Co-Op is, as the name suggests, a cooperative movement owned by its members as opposed to shareholders. It subscribed to ethical principles from its birth....

Exactly this.

If you've got a members card and spend over £250 a year in Co-op you also get to vote at the AGM, even if you can't attend.

All the major issues discussed / voted upon at the AGM - including board members / changes - are sent to you by email with voting buttons and are submitted the chair on your behalf.

I can't see fucking McDonald's doing that.

[timbrass]

2 hours ago, sadimmock said:

 

 Anyway I’m pleasantly surprised that there hasn’t been a change.org petition to set up a Nando’s in Silver Hayes yet! 

Am I alone in thinking that a Nandos might actually improve the Silver Hayes experience?

[eFestivals]

4 minutes ago, SouthbanKen said:

Genuine question, what has EE got to do with licensing?

the council believe that the punters should have access to their phones and a working phone service.

I'm not 100% sure how much pressure is put on the festival about that, but I do know for certain there's something in the licence (or there was, anyway) about having a decent and working phone service.

[Chinaski_]

That's a shame, but let's be honest, they will draw the biggest queues and make a fuckton of money. "Festival season" is nothing more than a commercial brand these days, sucks, but what can you do? 

[maelzoid]

3 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

the council believe that the punters should have access to their phones and a working phone service.

I'm not 100% sure how much pressure is put on the festival about that, but I do know for certain there's something in the licence (or there was, anyway) about having a decent and working phone service.

Getting a little off-track here, but the cel coverage at Download was quite unreliable, to the point where many retailers had to go 'cash only' which of course caused various delays and frustrations. Good coverage is important!

[Chinaski_]

11 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

the council believe that the punters should have access to their phones and a working phone service.

I'm not 100% sure how much pressure is put on the festival about that, but I do know for certain there's something in the licence (or there was, anyway) about having a decent and working phone service.

Call me old fashioned, but why do you need a phone at a festival? The whole point is you're lost in an oasis of the festival for a few days. I remember when you just used to say to your mate "I'll meet you at x". It's like they're inviting the idea of instagramming everything. 

[SouthbanKen]

11 minutes ago, maelzoid said:

Thanks for the lesson in retail economics.

Of course it begs the question, how the hell have I bought great burgers at other festivals from other retailers for similar money?

 

Literally anyone of a hundred reasons, and i am not defending this particular burger, if it was rubbish it was rubbish, i just think people are too quick to put down independent operators, who are often trying to do the right thing, buy local, better quality, pay a living wage ect, versus chains who are just as likely to cut corners and often just as likely to serve up rubbish.