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Very sad news about Pennard Organic Wine

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Sad to see independent places like this have to call it a day due to the price of having a pitch.

Although having never been there myself it hurts to see this happening (can imagine other stalls have been priced out as well)

It's rather odd that the festival stopped companies such as pieminister having pitches for being to corporate (supposedly) yet allow the co-op to get involved and all the while pricing out other small independent businesses.

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9 minutes ago, JoeyT said:

It's rather odd that the festival stopped companies such as pieminister having pitches for being to corporate (supposedly) yet allow the co-op to get involved and all the while pricing out other small independent businesses.

This is my take on it too. Don't know the details of course but on the face of it terribly unfair. 

Sad news and the festival losing these little gems makes Glastonbury that bit poorer year on year imo.

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2 hours ago, dccool said:

Sad news and the festival losing these little gems makes Glastonbury that bit poorer year on year imo.

yup. 

The markets used to be run with a strong eye on quality and diversity in front of milking the traders for the highest possible pitch fees. Looks like that's changed.

Over the years things will get worse and worse as entry costs for new traders become prohibitively high. :( 

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3 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

yup. 

The markets used to be run with a strong eye on quality and diversity in front of milking the traders for the highest possible pitch fees. Looks like that's changed.

Over the years things will get worse and worse as entry costs for new traders become prohibitively high. :( 

How much is the cost for a trader's pitch?

Or does it depend on who they are / what they're selling?

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1 minute ago, Woffy said:

Or does it depend on who they are / what they're selling? 

In the past, it very much depended on who they are, what they're selling, and where the pitch was - general rule of thumb food stalls got charged more than others, prime locations cost more than campsites, etc. Charities got the stall cheap or in at least some cases free, and I think businesses local to the festival got a discount as well.

Don't know to what degree any of that has changed, or have the first clue what this particular pitch would have gone for now or then.

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Just now, incident said:

In the past, it very much depended on who they are, what they're selling, and where the pitch was - general rule of thumb food stalls got charged more than others, prime locations cost more than campsites, etc. Charities got the stall cheap or in at least some cases free, and I think businesses local to the festival got a discount as well.

Don't know to what degree any of that has changed, or have the first clue what this particular pitch would have gone for now or then.

'k.

I was just remembering the tweet from the person who runs the Glasto Postcards stall saying how they'd paid an eye watering amount, because surely she (?) doesn't make anywhere near the money some of the food stalls do.

And yet the postcards have become a little festival 'institution' for some and it'd be a shame to see smaller businesses like that disappear.

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Yeah, it could well have changed a bit. The only hard information I've ever had on the subject was talking to someone from the Tiny Tea Tent during the 2007 festival - they told me that they were paying £2,000 for their pitch that year which compared to some of the rumoured prices these days sounds incredibly low. Would be interesting to get an up to date number to try and compare.

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Im off to apply for the position of Glastonbury postman ... they dont worry if the post is late these days do they ? :) free entry to the festival daily ....

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Noooooo - I am gutted but this news. A regular stop off for me for years. Not liking this at all. Couldn’t they have done a deal for a local business and long time festival supporter...?

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12 minutes ago, Woffy said:

How much is the cost for a trader's pitch?

Or does it depend on who they are / what they're selling?

it used to depend on what they sold and how much the fest reckoned that stall could sell.

About ten years ago I had a casual convo about doing a pudding stall (sponge & custard, that sort of thing) with the old markets manager and was quoted £2k, but also told the stall would be in a particular area that I felt would make it just about impossible to cover costs (I can't remember where he said now). I didn't pursue the idea, although that was as much to do with the time I had available as much as the likely cost.

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5 minutes ago, incident said:

Yeah, it could well have changed a bit. The only hard information I've ever had on the subject was talking to someone from the Tiny Tea Tent during the 2007 festival - they told me that they were paying £2,000 for their pitch that year which compared to some of the rumoured prices these days sounds incredibly low. Would be interesting to get an up to date number to try and compare.

I reckon you're about right with £2k for tiny tea tent 210-ish years ago (see my post above).

But since then the person managing the markets has changed, and it seems they have different ideas for how to do things - so there may have been some changes since then.

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26 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

yup. 

The markets used to be run with a strong eye on quality and diversity in front of milking the traders for the highest possible pitch fees. Looks like that's changed.

Over the years things will get worse and worse as entry costs for new traders become prohibitively high. :( 

The diversity is still pretty good and quality is still quite high. I think the big problem for smaller local companies has been the massive explosion in the UK street food industry. There are far more people whose entire business model is running food stands at various places across the country and they're used to paying massive fees for pitches. I don't think the quality and choice for us will actually suffer much, it's just the particular companies that will change.

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6 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

it used to depend on what they sold and how much the fest reckoned that stall could sell.

About ten years ago I had a casual convo about doing a pudding stall (sponge & custard, that sort of thing) with the old markets manager and was quoted £2k, but also told the stall would be in a particular area that I felt would make it just about impossible to cover costs (I can't remember where he said now). I didn't pursue the idea, although that was as much to do with the time I had available as much as the likely cost.

£2k ten years ago! Jesus.

Baffles me how some of the clothes stalls get anywhere near breaking even.

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"Posted June 30, 2016

I spoke to a guy on the Wednesday night who had a hot food stall to the right of the pyramid as you looked at it. He said he paid approx 10k for the pitch. But if your food is good and you are selling trays of food at £8 a go. I guess over the 5 days it must be worth while. "

This was posted on a thread that has been archived - assuming 2016.

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Great pity to see you go- I didn't use your stall much myself but my wife and pals certainly did. I feel bad now for thinking the wine was expensive! I hope you guys might return... 

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15 minutes ago, Woffy said:

£2k ten years ago! Jesus.

Baffles me how some of the clothes stalls get anywhere near breaking even.

the pitch fee is related to what the fest think the stall will turn over - so clothes stalls etc can be a lot cheaper.

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15 minutes ago, chuckles07 said:

"Posted June 30, 2016

I spoke to a guy on the Wednesday night who had a hot food stall to the right of the pyramid as you looked at it. He said he paid approx 10k for the pitch. But if your food is good and you are selling trays of food at £8 a go. I guess over the 5 days it must be worth while. "

This was posted on a thread that has been archived - assuming 2016.

based on that thats 250 meals per day .... without the costs of ingredients factored in 

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15 minutes ago, chuckles07 said:

"Posted June 30, 2016

I spoke to a guy on the Wednesday night who had a hot food stall to the right of the pyramid as you looked at it. He said he paid approx 10k for the pitch. But if your food is good and you are selling trays of food at £8 a go. I guess over the 5 days it must be worth while. "

This was posted on a thread that has been archived - assuming 2016.

£10k for a prime position like that won't be too bad. A decent amount of spend at the stall is just about guaranteed.

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11 minutes ago, crazyfool1 said:

based on that thats 250 meals per day .... without the costs of ingredients factored in 

If you assume each meal makes 100% i.e. cost £4 for ingredients, packaging, labour, then to make £5k for the 5 days then need to sell c2.4k meals @£8, thats 480 a day. I dunno is that reasonable?

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2 minutes ago, chuckles07 said:

If you assume each meal makes 100% i.e. cost £4 for ingredients, packaging, labour, then to make £5k for the 5 days then need to sell c2.4k meals @£8, thats 480 a day. I dunno is that reasonable?

I was thinking the labour cost would be factored in with the pitch price as people work for tickets and the pitches will come with a certain number of tickets I believe ... just a bit of a risk on the weather factor if nobody can access the stall ...  im sure its profitable else people wouldn't do it ...  but its a risk 

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4 minutes ago, chuckles07 said:

need to sell c2.4k meals @£8, thats 480 a day. I dunno is that reasonable?

for a prime spot, probably.

There's around 500 traders I think (tho not all of those are food and not all of the food are 'meals').

200,000 peeps divided by 500 traders = 400 people (tho they're eating more than once a day).

A prime spot should pick up much more than the average.

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4 minutes ago, chuckles07 said:

If you assume each meal makes 100% i.e. cost £4 for ingredients, packaging, labour, then to make £5k for the 5 days then need to sell c2.4k meals @£8, thats 480 a day. I dunno is that reasonable?

For the places near the Pyramid? Should be very reasonable.

Even if they're only busy for say an 8 hour period when the stage is up, and dead the rest of the time, then they just need to average 1 per minute during those 8 hours and as long as they've got their processes down then I reckon most food stalls in that area will do significantly more than that.

That's without factoring in that while their main meal item might cost 8 quid, the average transaction is probably a bit more - if someone buys a burger for 8 quid, they may also buy some chips for 4 quid and/or a can of coke for 2.50 - and those extras probably have a higher profit margin than the headline items.

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4 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

for a prime spot, probably.

There's around 500 traders I think (tho not all of those are food and not all of the food are 'meals').

200,000 peeps divided by 500 traders = 400 people (tho they're eating more than once a day).

A prime spot should pick up much more than the average.

Yeah using those assumptions it probably stacks up. I can imagine though that there is a huge variance of takings by stall due to vagaries of footfall, weather, 'local' competition. Some traders will make loads and some will lose out, big time. As @crazyfool1 says - its arisk.

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7 minutes ago, chuckles07 said:

If you assume each meal makes 100% i.e. cost £4 for ingredients, packaging, labour, then to make £5k for the 5 days then need to sell c2.4k meals @£8, thats 480 a day. I dunno is that reasonable?

The reality is the margin should be higher than 50% on food, it should be 65% plus (depending on food type)  also don't forget some of the traders will be there more than the 5 days. 

They can also be open 24 hours (or at least 18) so the number of £8 meals increases dramatically,  They will also sell a number of higher margin options (closer to 75%) finally with 250,000 potential customers (depending on location and offerings) they can be very profitable across the festival.

It still must be daunting if you are weather dependent, in or out of vogue on choices and everything else!

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13 hours ago, OG said:

Top Tip... stay away from the wine until the Sunday. Cider & Spirits the first 4 days but when the Sunday comes and it's a struggle to get as "refreshed" then add a few large wines into the mix and hey presto!

What madness is this? Wine from the off is the way to go.

 

17 minutes ago, chuckles07 said:

If you assume each meal makes 100% i.e. cost £4 for ingredients, packaging, labour, then to make £5k for the 5 days then need to sell c2.4k meals @£8, thats 480 a day. I dunno is that reasonable?

20 meals per hour based on 24 hrs trading. Pretty do-able for a spot near the Pyramid I'd say.

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