Billie Eilish

[FloorFiller]

4 minutes ago, Chawk said:

It's probably on a spam blacklist, you see a lot of spam posts selling meds

Ah that’s a good point and you’re probably spot on. Thought that was a weirdly specific drug to censor considering drugs are talked about on here every so often without a hitch. 

[danmarks]

1 hour ago, Matt42 said:

Yeah but Jonathan Wilson is a little bit different to Billie Eilish isn’t he? I’m not saying it’s critical acclaim and critical acclaim only. She was a headliner before she released this album and this album has just made her even more of a headliner than she was before.

And before you say it - an artist who plays headline slots at virtually any festival she’s booked for + selling out 5 nights at the O2 amongst a string of UK dates is a headliner. I bet you she’s near the top of the eavis fridge list.

Ahh im sure you're right . Its just im old and have seen this hype machine bubble and burst many times over and i am just not aware of how big she really is. I know her face is everywhere at the moment but that doesn't necessarily mean much.

On the plus side x factor is no more.

[incident]

1 hour ago, danmarks said:

Ahh im sure you're right . Its just im old and have seen this hype machine bubble and burst many times over and i am just not aware of how big she really is. I know her face is everywhere at the moment but that doesn't necessarily mean much.

Indeed.

I don't think she's any bigger now than say Avril Lavigne was ~20 years ago - except with worse songs. Or Justin Bieber ~10 years ago with better songs.

[FloorFiller]

26 minutes ago, incident said:

Indeed.

I don't think she's any bigger now than say Avril Lavigne was ~20 years ago - except with worse songs. Or Justin Bieber ~10 years ago with better songs.

Your point is kind of null and void here with Bieber as he’s still an absolute megastar.

And Billie is already much bigger than Avril ever was.

[Matt42]

37 minutes ago, incident said:

Indeed.

I don't think she's any bigger now than say Avril Lavigne was ~20 years ago - except with worse songs. Or Justin Bieber ~10 years ago with better songs.

I don’t really understand your point. This is like me comparing Coldplay at their peak to the Rolling Stones at their peak and saying this is why Coldplay can’t headline.

What matters is what Billie is doing right now and what her market cap is. It’s pretty large.

Edited July 30, 2021 by Matt42

[incident]

2 minutes ago, FloorFiller said:

Your point is kind of null and void here with Bieber as he’s still an absolute megastar.

And Billie is already much bigger than Avril ever was.

We'll have to agree to disagree about Avril. She was absolutely everywhere in the early 00s for about 3-5 years, and that she's faded from view (while retaining a substantial fanbase) is pretty much the entire point.

Fair enough about Bieber - I was more thinking of the aspect that he's not getting the same level of mainstream press as he was a few years ago but either way he's clearly not going to headline Glastonbury, ever, regardless of how big he is or was.

[Matt42]

5 minutes ago, incident said:

We'll have to agree to disagree about Avril. She was absolutely everywhere in the early 00s for about 3-5 years, and that she's faded from view (while retaining a substantial fanbase) is pretty much the entire point.

Fair enough about Bieber - I was more thinking of the aspect that he's not getting the same level of mainstream press as he was a few years ago but either way he's clearly not going to headline Glastonbury, ever, regardless of how big he is or was.

She might have been everywhere but in terms of record sales, Tour dates, and global reach I’d say Billie has surpassed her. I don’t think Avril ever sold out 5 nights at the O2 amongst a string of other venues, and was also booked to headline festivals all over the globe.

Its easy to just compare Billie to another female singer but you need to check whether they’ve got the same credentials. Billie at the moment is only falling short of people like Taylor or Adele in terms of reach… and that’s based on Adele’s touring record from 5 years ago. I even think Beyoncé would struggle to sell out the dates that Billie is doing right now.

Billie could easily do Wembley / stadiums right now. I reckon if the pandemic hadn’t made touring such a free for all to secure venues she probably would be.

Edited July 30, 2021 by Matt42

[priest17]

43 minutes ago, incident said:

Indeed.

I don't think she's any bigger now than say Avril Lavigne was ~20 years ago - except with worse songs. Or Justin Bieber ~10 years ago with better songs.

Incident is right, get Avril Lavigne headlining.

[incident]

8 minutes ago, Matt42 said:

I don’t really understand your point. This is like me comparing Coldplay at their peak to the Rolling Stones at their peak and saying this is why Coldplay can’t headline.

What matters is what Billie is doing right now and what her market cap is. It’s pretty large.

To put it slightly differently - If she plays in the next 3ish years, then yes - she's a definite headliner.

I just have doubts that she'll be able to maintain that status, and be a viable an option in 10 years time.

[incident]

3 minutes ago, Matt42 said:

She might have been everywhere but in terms of record sales, Tour dates, and global reach I’d say Billie has surpassed her. I don’t think Avril ever sold out 5 nights at the O2 amongst a string of other venues, and was also booked to headline festivals all over the globe.

Its easy to just compare Billie to another female singer but you need to check whether they’ve got the same credentials. Billie at the moment is only falling short of people like Taylor or Adele in terms of reach… and that’s based on Adele’s touring record from 5 years ago. I even think Beyoncé would struggle to sell out the dates that Billie is doing right now.

Billie could easily do Wembley / stadiums right now. I reckon if the pandemic hadn’t made touring such a free for all to secure venues she probably would be.

Well no, the O2 didn't exist at the time. But she did instantly sell out decent sized tours of large Arenas with mass scrambles for tickets. I realise you're too young to have been aware of her at the time, but genuinely she was everywhere to an irritating degree.

[Matt42]

3 minutes ago, incident said:

To put it slightly differently - If she plays in the next 3ish years, then yes - she's a definite headliner.

I just have doubts that she'll be able to maintain that status, and be a viable an option in 10 years time.

Well it’s a weird point to make as you can make that argument about anyone. Coldplay could completely fizzle out in that time too. Also, I doubt the festival is going to wait that long either. Next time she’s available I reckon. It will be sooner rather than later.

 

Just now, incident said:

Well no, the O2 didn't exist at the time. But she did instantly sell out decent sized tours of large Arenas with mass scrambles for tickets. I realise you're too young to have been aware of her at the time, but genuinely she was everywhere to an irritating degree.

I don’t know how young you think I am but I was around for Avril too. Completely different type of artist with completely different shticks. Avril was not a critical darling like Billie is. Also the quality of Avril’s music very quickly took a sharp decline. It doesn’t look like that’s happening to Billie anytime soon, seems more like her and finneas are just getting warmed up. 

[incident]

2 minutes ago, Matt42 said:

Well it’s a weird point to make as you can make that argument about anyone. Coldplay could completely fizzle out in that time too. Also, I doubt the festival is going to wait that long either. Next time she’s available I reckon. It will be sooner rather than later.

 

I don’t know how young you think I am but I was around for Avril too. Completely different type of artist with completely different shticks. Avril was not a critical darling like Billie is. Also the quality of Avril’s music very quickly took a sharp decline. It doesn’t look like that’s happening to Billie anytime soon, seems more like her and finneas are just getting warmed up. 

No, you couldn't make that argument for Coldplay - they're one of an admittedly small number of acts where their legacy definitely overrides their current output. I think you're mid 20s, though I don't know where I got that from.

[SwedgeAntilles]

Billie wishes she could write a tune as good as "I'm With You" 

[dentalplan]

12 hours ago, FloorFiller said:

Ah that’s a good point and you’re probably spot on. Thought that was a weirdly specific drug to censor considering drugs are talked about on here every so often without a hitch. 

Stop pushing drugs online mate.

[dentalplan]

9 hours ago, Matt42 said:

Avril was not a critical darling like Billie is.

Is she though? Is Billie Eilish a critical darling? I see she got some 4 star scores with this new album but that's merely a 'better than expected' rather than universal acclaim.

[eFestivals]

13 hours ago, Chawk said:

It's probably on a spam blacklist, you see a lot of spam posts selling meds

Yeah, you're probably right, there's so many words in the spam trap I don't know from memory what they all are. 

[Matt42]

46 minutes ago, dentalplan said:

Is she though? Is Billie Eilish a critical darling? I see she got some 4 star scores with this new album but that's merely a 'better than expected' rather than universal acclaim.

I’d say for major pop girls she definitely is. Either way I think the Avril comparison isn’t great as they had very different directions as artists. 

[Mattymooz]

12 hours ago, Matt42 said:

Also the quality of Avril’s music very quickly took a sharp decline. It doesn’t look like that’s happening to Billie anytime soon, seems more like her and finneas are just getting warmed up. 

I'd disagree completely with this one. This album is selling well purely based on the hype she has set up from the previous album. Other than Therefore I Am, all the singles debuted high and then fell off the charts very quickly... Guess she could transition to being more of an albums artist but I'd easily say the highs of this album are lower than those of the first.

[Mattymooz]

As I said above, there are some great songs on here (GOLDWING, Happier Than Ever, Oxytocin), but Lost Cause - Your Power is a pretty big snoozefest unfortunately. Could have done with trimming and rearranging the tracklist (my future into Oxytocin is such a weird transition and how the fuck is Happier Than Ever not the closer...)

[danmarks]

If we are going for female artists who were hugecthwn not so huge i guess Katy Perry and Britney Spears fall in thst category.

Names still known but woildnt headline now.

Dont really know where im going with this to be honesr. As always different people are going to have different opinions on headline worthiness and if stuff is the goat until the next thing.

 Reminds me of the 1000 years of the best musoc thing st the millennium. Robbie willians angels was in the ttop 10. Out of a thousand years it was all from last 40 years-half of it from last 10 years.

Ir would be massively different top 40 now if people were voting.  People are fixkle.

Shout out for a proper concersation brrween everyone without resulting to cockwomble insults.  Its refreshing

[FloorFiller]

After one listen the album’s alright. There aren’t any bad songs, but there are also very few truly memorable songs and a lot of them just kind of blend in to the next due to it mostly being this low-key, ‘I’ve just smoked a bunch of weed and then sang a song’ vibe throughout. And obviously it’s just too long but in these days of wanting those huge streaming numbers that’s just a trap that a lot of these megastars fall in to. 

Gonna give it a few more listens but it’s hard to see it lighting up these festival sets she’s playing, so I’m gonna guess she goes a bit harder with the next one and inevitably does Coachella and probably Glastonbury etc off the back of it. 

[Matt42]

1 hour ago, danmarks said:

If we are going for female artists who were hugecthwn not so huge i guess Katy Perry and Britney Spears fall in thst category.

Names still known but woildnt headline now.

Dont really know where im going with this to be honesr. As always different people are going to have different opinions on headline worthiness and if stuff is the goat until the next thing.

 Reminds me of the 1000 years of the best musoc thing st the millennium. Robbie willians angels was in the ttop 10. Out of a thousand years it was all from last 40 years-half of it from last 10 years.

Ir would be massively different top 40 now if people were voting.  People are fixkle.

Shout out for a proper concersation brrween everyone without resulting to cockwomble insults.  Its refreshing

I’m going to get very academic here but you’re comparing artists to Billie Eilish just because they are female and not because they are similar.

Katy Perry from the start of her career to where she is now was a singles artist completely reliant on hits. She was never seen as an album artist. The second she tried to experiment with her music she fell off. She was an artist who made pop hits for the radio, and as radio declined, she declined too. She’s not the same. Because her relationship with the public was purely transactional it has been difficult for her to regain trust and it’s just a downward slope from here.

Let’s not forget Britney Spears was absolutely massive for about 10 years before she started to decline in chart popularity. From about 1998 - 2008 she absolutely was one of the biggest female artists on the planet. She’s still massive now but in a different medium and probably more for nostalgia reasons than anything else. Also Britney has been visibly done with being a pop star for almost 20 years now. She’s not trying to be the biggest artist in the world, in fact I’d probably argue she’s at a stage where she wishes she wasn’t famous at all.

Billie right now is in her peak and if she’s being booked it will be in her peak. I don’t understand why we are even talking about where she’s going to be in 10 years. No one discussed where Stormzy was going to be in 10 years when he was a headliner.

Edited July 31, 2021 by Matt42

[danmarks]

My opening line is - if we are comparing female artists who were huge then not so huge. That's why i compared. No other reason.

Yeah definitely going off on a tangent aboutc10 years time but that kind of is what im saying. At mo  she is huge. (More than i  realised) That may not last forever. 

[mcshed]

22 minutes ago, Matt42 said:

I’m going to get very academic here but you’re comparing artists to Billie Eilish just because they are female and not because they are similar.

Katy Perry from the start of her career to where she is now was a singles artist completely reliant on hits. She was never seen as an album artist. The second she tried to experiment with her music she fell off. She was an artist who made pop hits for the radio, and as radio declined, she declined too. She’s not the same. Because her relationship with the public was purely transactional it has been difficult for her to regain trust and it’s just a downward slope from here.

Let’s not forget Britney Spears was absolutely massive for about 10 years before she started to decline in chart popularity. From about 1998 - 2008 she absolutely was one of the biggest female artists on the planet. She’s still massive now but in a different medium and probably more for nostalgia reasons than anything else. Also Britney has been visibly done with being a pop star for almost 20 years now. She’s not trying to be the biggest artist in the world, in fact I’d probably argue she’s at a stage where she wishes she wasn’t famous at all.

Billie right now is in her peak and if she’s being booked it will be in her peak. I don’t understand why we are even talking about where she’s going to be in 10 years. No one discussed where Stormzy was going to be in 10 years when he was a headliner.

The thing is there is a limited window when a hot new act look like a headliner, if you are booking Billie for 2022 or 2023 she probably headlines, but if you or she has other plans then things might change. Stormzy and Mumford where booked in that window but not everyone is.

If you want a not just because she's female comparison take The Strokes, their first album changed the music scene but they never quite reached those heights again have been a headline or nothing band in their prime but didn't headline Glastonbury. They are now still a big act and they still headline festivals but they aren't what they were, they have played lower slots and smaller festivals and Glastonbury just isn't that fussed by them.

[Matt42]

1 hour ago, mcshed said:

The thing is there is a limited window when a hot new act look like a headliner, if you are booking Billie for 2022 or 2023 she probably headlines, but if you or she has other plans then things might change. Stormzy and Mumford where booked in that window but not everyone is.

If you want a not just because she's female comparison take The Strokes, their first album changed the music scene but they never quite reached those heights again have been a headline or nothing band in their prime but didn't headline Glastonbury. They are now still a big act and they still headline festivals but they aren't what they were, they have played lower slots and smaller festivals and Glastonbury just isn't that fussed by them.

Considering she won’t even hit the road for this until 2022, a new album by 2024 doesn’t sound that far off. I can’t see her falling from where she is in two years time. Even if she gets slightly smaller than she is now she’s still glasto headline worthy.

Plus - with this release I think some naysayers have been doubted that her and finneas are one trick ponies. They’ve developed a fair bit since album 1 and Billie has been able to diversify her sound a bit.

I’d say she’s very much on track to stay, as I’ve listened to happier than ever and I’m left excited with what they are going to do next.

Shes not going to go from her touring record to no-one overnight. Especially when this record is being received well.

Also - not sure about the strokes comparison as rock bands are a bit different. For bands it’s easier to milk your early albums to death…. Like the Killers.

Edited July 31, 2021 by Matt42