Respect the Females (and other rules)

[Blisterpack]

2 minutes ago, shuttlep said:

The problem I have personally with the whole movement that woman have me too and all that is this.

 

I am a good bloke, i treat women the same as I would treat anyone, no difference. I don;t think there is a difference they are just both people. same no difference. i don't go touching woman at gigs . I am a bit blinkered as I am not a woman and never had experience of all that goes on. Maybe this is male privileged as it is called. I never even realised there was a problem until i met me wife and she said she doesn't like going the gym as men ogle her and she doesn't like it , and I started reading about all the sexual allegations . it blows my mind that this goes on when I would never do this and my circle of friends are like I am. I am living in a man bubble thinking everything is rosy when it obviously isn't . Male privilege 

 

it's such a shame that woman need to point out that you can't touch them at clubs or take advantage of them when drunk when it's obvious some men don't think this. in my mind it's blatantly obvious. there is in difference between men and woman , trans , gay blah blah blah we are all just the same .

Men just shouldn't be dicks and woman should feel OK to go jogging and not get leered at . to go in a mosh pit and not have their breasts groped. in my mind it really is that simple. i just wish everyone else felt the same 

Good sentiments. Unfortunately the experience of women is so different from that of men. I was at  the bar at a gig last year when a woman turned round and accused a lad of touching her. He was denying it vigorously and security got involved. The girl was upset and her friend came over. They left. Within a few minutes the lad was telling his mates about it; he had ‘won’ and was buzzing on the whole thing. My stomach was turning. It totally happens. 

[Tranquility of Solitude]

4 hours ago, Blisterpack said:

go in a mosh pit and not have their breasts groped

Frank Carter had stuff to say on this subject in the John Peel tent last year. He was terrific, worth watching on You tube... The bit where he gets the females in the audience crowd surfing, and reminds the males that they could be your wives, girlfriends, Mums or daughter. Sad that he had to point it out, but a great moment.

Edited October 24, 2018 by Tranquility of Solitude

[Phoenix Girl]

Yes I was there for Frank Carter, he was brilliant in more ways than one. 

Thank you as well for all the empathy in the responses on this thread. 

[Skoo]

Frank Carter is a legend for doing that.

It's true that in the past year or so, the women's movement has gained momentum which is such a great thing for everybody.

I remember at the age of 19 being out in a pub and a much older guy with his friends telling me I looked nice. I said 'thanks" and he said "yes I'd really like to shove my c**k inside you".

That memory has stayed with me, and the frustrating thing is that there's nothing you can really do. I gave him a piece of my mind and he and his friends just stood there openly laughing at me. I told security and they just shrugged.

I like to think things would be different now if that happened today.

I really like the analogy someone here posted a few posts up - don't say anything to a woman that you wouldn't want another bloke to say to you in prison.

Never heard that one before, but think it's genius!

 

 

Edited October 24, 2018 by Skoo
censoring swear word

[Thunderstruck]

42 minutes ago, Blisterpack said:

It’s not good enough though. By any standards.

It depends what you mean by that. There's plenty of things to improve on - I'm not denying that. What I don't like is the constant crap spouted by a certain section who spread at best poorly interpreted information and at worst lies.

50 minutes ago, clarkete said:

Bless, aren't you sweet.  

It's a shame you've been given such misplaced self-confidence.

I'm not sweet I'm a horrible beast man who hates women!

1 hour ago, Keithy said:

Wow. Just...wow.

So...

You are judging feminism purely on one basis. Yes, there are feminists who are 'loud and shouty' and for bloody good reasons. You only have to look at issues girls face at gigs to realise there is flippin' miles to go yet and they have every reason to be loud and shouty. That's why campaigns like 'Girls Against...' and bands like Petrol Girls, Dream Wife and Dream Nails are so important. I recently went to the Loud Women Fest and aside from an absolute cracking day of music, the loud and shouty women were most definitely representative of the people there. Clearly being vocal is going to mean they dominate the public perception of feminism but strangely they seem to have realised being quiet and submissive isn't going to bring about any fundamental change for them? I know, crazy talk.

As for 'Women have never had it so good' ... I'll be generous to you and assume you mean that over the last 100 years, women now have more rights, freedoms and equality than even before, ergo 'never had it so good'. But, but, there's still a long way to go and telling women 'they've never had it so good' is astonishingly patronising for starters. 

I'd love you to stick your head around the door of the Sisterhood stage next year and tell them they've never had it so good. I suspect they will be delighted to have the opportunity to discuss that train of thought with you.

Yes it was a patronising phrase to use, I suppose I was fishing a little bit. The statement is true, but I understand how it comes across. I'm actually not sure there is such a long way to go at the moment in terms of equality of opportunity. Clearly there's a cultural problem with a very small number of men thinking it is ok to sexually assault girls, which is disgusting. The issue I would have with some feminists (not all) is that in my opinion they take it too far. If they had their way guys would be locked up for looking at girls the wrong way.

39 minutes ago, shuttlep said:

The problem I have personally with the whole movement that woman have me too and all that is this.

 

I am a good bloke, i treat women the same as I would treat anyone, no difference. I don;t think there is a difference they are just both people. same no difference. i don't go touching woman at gigs . I am a bit blinkered as I am not a woman and never had experience of all that goes on. Maybe this is male privileged as it is called. I never even realised there was a problem until i met me wife and she said she doesn't like going the gym as men ogle her and she doesn't like it , and I started reading about all the sexual allegations . it blows my mind that this goes on when I would never do this and my circle of friends are like I am. I am living in a man bubble thinking everything is rosy when it obviously isn't . Male privilege 

 

it's such a shame that woman need to point out that you can't touch them at clubs or take advantage of them when drunk when it's obvious some men don't think this. in my mind it's blatantly obvious. there is in difference between men and woman , trans , gay blah blah blah we are all just the same .

Men just shouldn't be dicks and woman should feel OK to go jogging and not get leered at . to go in a mosh pit and not have their breasts groped. in my mind it really is that simple. i just wish everyone else felt the same 

There is definitely an element of the male bubble I'm sure. The rules everyone should stick to is don't be a fucking dick.

[Thunderstruck]

25 minutes ago, Phoenix Girl said:

Yes I was there for Frank Carter, he was brilliant in more ways than one. 

Thank you as well for all the empathy in the responses on this thread. 

Was there for this, it was indeed brilliant. Not that you'll believe I believe that I'm sure ?

[jyoung]

@Thunderstruck, i'm interested. Is there a genuine fear you have or do you just not understand what's going on? Either way you're gonna end up on the wrong side of history.

"The current state of feminism is loud, shouty and unrepresentative of women in general"... What kind of horse shit is this? You don't get to decide what represents women, my man. Trust me, they're in a better position to do so themselves.

Sometimes, in society, there are people that have got to be loud, that have got to shout, to even get anywhere close to getting their voices heard. What you're spouting is the exact ignorance that drives this. You know if people like you opened your mind and shut your mouth for five seconds you might start to hear less 'loud and shouty identity politics'. 

Those loud and shouty feminists. Their words make tiny ripples in the world. They fight against the stream of dirt that you swim in. This is just the beginning. So strap yourself in because those tiny little ripples are going to turn into big fat fucking waves. Whether you like it or not.

That victimhood mentality you talk about. The mentality doesn't exist. But I'll tell you what does exist... Victim blaming.

A few other things exist as well. Rape culture, gender pay gap, patriarchal societies, girls being forbidden an education, workplace sexism. The list goes on... I haven't experienced any of the above but there are people who have and do. Every. Single. Day.

It's called empathy and it's in your interests as well. Get some.

Edited October 24, 2018 by jyoung

[Blisterpack]

20 minutes ago, Thunderstruck said:

1 hour ago, Blisterpack said:

 

It depends what you mean by that. There's plenty of things to improve on - I'm not denying that. What I don't like is the constant crap spouted by a certain section who spread at best poorly interpreted information and at worst lies.

When I witnessed what I did at that bar I mentioned it to my 25yr old daughter in law. She told me she gets some sort of verbal abuse about once a month and has had some unwanted physical abuse about three or four times in the past year. She consciously takes decisions to minimise risks. I knew absolutely nothing about this. 

Is this the ‘constant crap’ or ‘poorly interpreted information’ you are talking about?

Edited October 24, 2018 by Blisterpack

[Thunderstruck]

7 minutes ago, jyoung said:

@Thunderstruck, i'm interested. Is there a genuine fear you have or do you just not understand what's going on? Either way you're gonna end up on the wrong side of history.

"The current state of feminism is loud, shouty and unrepresentative of women in general"... What kind of horse shit is this? You don't get to decide what represents women, my man. Trust me, they're in a better position to do so themselves.

Sometimes, in society, there are people that have got to be loud, that have got to shout, to even get anywhere close to getting their voices heard. What you're spouting is the exact ignorance that drives this. You know if people like you opened your mind and shut your mouth for five seconds you might start to hear less 'loud and shouty identity politics'. 

That victimhood mentality you talk about. The mentality doesn't exist. But I'll tell you what does exist... Victim blaming.

A few other things exist as well. Rape culture, gender pay gap, patriarchal societies, girls being forbidden an education, workplace sexism. The list goes on... I haven't experienced any of the above but there are people who have and do. Every. Single. Day.

It's called empathy and it's in your interests as well. Get some.

No, no fear, just a difference in conclusions. The horse shit you speak of is the radical feminists of today, if you don't see this then you're walking around with your eyes closed. 

Women can judge for themselves, this is absolutely true, and when you say women you refer to the 90+ % who do not identify as feminists and in my experience actively distance themselves from it. Women aren't victims, they're people who can look after themselves. 

My mind is open, probably a lot more than yours is and you have got all angry about someone with a difference in conclusions. Ugh victim blame. This is a bullshit agenda that I absolutely detest. The outrage from feminists when police advise girls not to engage in risky behaviours because it can lead to sexual assault. In ideal world there would be no sexual assault and girls could walk around naked without risk if they so wished. But this is not the real fucking world, it isn't victim blaming, it is trying to protect people! 

forgot to add here is a video on the gender pay gap. Maybe humour will help you see the facts. 

 

Edited October 24, 2018 by Thunderstruck

[eFestivals]

1 minute ago, Thunderstruck said:

the 90+ % who do not identify as feminists

that's from a telegraph story 2 years old.

From a year earlier there's this, where 31% consider themselves feminist.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/nearly-1-in-5-people-in-the-uk-think-being-called-a-feminist-is-an-insult-a6728446.html

And from a year later, this where over 2/3rds of young women consider themselves feminists.
https://www.elle.com/uk/life-and-culture/culture/news/a37534/rejoice-over-two-thirds-of-young-british-women-identify-as-feminists-but-theres-still-work-to-do/

(Me, i'd love to know how many have read 'The Female Eunuch' and agree with it  )

[stuartbert two hats]

6 minutes ago, Thunderstruck said:

No, no fear, just a difference in conclusions. The horse shit you speak of is the radical feminists of today, if you don't see this then you're walking around with your eyes closed. 

Women can judge for themselves, this is absolutely true, and when you say women you refer to the 90+ % who do not identify as feminists and in my experience actively distance themselves from it. Women aren't victims, they're people who can look after themselves. 

My mind is open, probably a lot more than yours is and you have got all angry about someone with a difference in conclusions. Ugh victim blame. This is a bullshit agenda that I absolutely detest. The outrage from feminists when police advise girls not to engage in risky behaviours because it can lead to sexual assault. In ideal world there would be no sexual assault and girls could walk around naked without risk if they so wished. But this is not the real fucking world, it isn't victim blaming, it is trying to protect people! 

forgot to add here is a video on the gender pay gap. Maybe humour will help you see the facts. 

 

A video where the woman's script was written by a man.

[Thunderstruck]

Just now, eFestivals said:

that's from a telegraph story 2 years old.

From a year earlier there's this, where 31% consider themselves feminist.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/nearly-1-in-5-people-in-the-uk-think-being-called-a-feminist-is-an-insult-a6728446.html

And from a year later, this where over 2/3rds of young women consider themselves feminists.
https://www.elle.com/uk/life-and-culture/culture/news/a37534/rejoice-over-two-thirds-of-young-british-women-identify-as-feminists-but-theres-still-work-to-do/

(Me, i'd love to know how many have read 'The Female Eunuch' and agree with it  )

Well those are my old stats shot down! Not even sure where I got the original figure from!

[jyoung]

7 minutes ago, Thunderstruck said:

My mind is open, probably a lot more than yours is and you have got all angry about someone with a difference in conclusions. Ugh victim blame. This is a bullshit agenda that I absolutely detest. The outrage from feminists when police advise girls not to engage in risky behaviours because it can lead to sexual assault. In ideal world there would be no sexual assault and girls could walk around naked without risk if they so wished. But this is not the real fucking world, it isn't victim blaming, it is trying to protect people! 

Most girls don't wanna walk around naked, they just wanna choose what they like to wear and feel comfortable in without having the fear, or worse, the eventuality of being assaulted. Ever thought we could protect them and cut down on the number of incidents by teaching people not to assault other people? Just an idea and it might be a good place to start. 

[Thunderstruck]

Just now, stuartbert two hats said:

A video where the woman's script was written by a man.

More evidence of oppression by white males. ?

[Blisterpack]

5 minutes ago, Thunderstruck said:

No, no fear, just a difference in conclusions. The horse shit you speak of is the radical feminists of today, if you don't see this then you're walking around with your eyes closed. 

Women can judge for themselves, this is absolutely true, and when you say women you refer to the 90+ % who do not identify as feminists and in my experience actively distance themselves from it. Women aren't victims, they're people who can look after themselves. 

My mind is open, probably a lot more than yours is and you have got all angry about someone with a difference in conclusions. Ugh victim blame. This is a bullshit agenda that I absolutely detest. The outrage from feminists when police advise girls not to engage in risky behaviours because it can lead to sexual assault. In ideal world there would be no sexual assault and girls could walk around naked without risk if they so wished. But this is not the real fucking world, it isn't victim blaming, it is trying to protect people! 

forgot to add here is a video on the gender pay gap. Maybe humour will help you see the facts. 

 

It’s actually text book victim blaming. Have a look at what I said about my daughter in law; as I said I knew nothing of this ‘world’ or her experience of a social life until she told me.  As I said, she is no fool and seeks to minimise her risks. And, irrelevant as it is, she is probably what most people would categorise as ‘very attractive’. 

What would you advise her in terms of trying to experience life as you and I presumably do?

[Thunderstruck]

Just now, jyoung said:

Most girls don't wanna walk around naked, they just wanna choose what they like to wear and feel comfortable in without having the fear, or worse, the eventuality of being assaulted. Ever thought we could protect them and cut down on the number of incidents by teaching people not to assault other people? Just an idea and it might be a good place to start. 

I agree completely. It is disgusting when anybody is physically assaulted. Of course we all want to feel comfortable and do whatever we want to do safely but this is not the real world and it isn't victim blaming. Maybe one day we'll get there but I suspect we will always have knobs heads.

[Keithy]

18 minutes ago, Thunderstruck said:

The outrage from feminists when police advise girls not to engage in risky behaviours because it can lead to sexual assault. In ideal world there would be no sexual assault and girls could walk around naked without risk if they so wished. But this is not the real fucking world, it isn't victim blaming, it is trying to protect people! 

The 'outrage' is that the advice is putting the onus on the women to regulate their behaviour which is absurd. Rather than effectively telling women "dress more conservatively, don't wear headphones, moderate your drinking", they should be telling men "Do not f*cking sexually assault women" because clearly the message is not getting through to certain men. And then the police themselves should be taking sexual assaults more seriously. It's clear from the gap between women who have experienced sexual assault compared to the actual number of reported assaults that women have very little faith in the police and even less faith that there will ever be a conviction. So they don't both reporting it. 

The real fucking world is that men are sexually assaulting women and women are being told to look at their behaviour rather than the blokes being told to look at their own. That is, perhaps, why some feminists are loud and shouty because they quite like shouting out that it's not their fucking fault. Women don't want 'protecting', they want men to stop sexually assaulting them.

Edited October 24, 2018 by Keithy

[Thunderstruck]

anyway! This topic is too vast and I’ve probably pissed off enough people for today! Back to work lol.

 

Edited October 24, 2018 by Thunderstruck

[H.M.V]

4 minutes ago, Keithy said:

The 'outrage' is that the advice is putting the onus on the women to regulate their behaviour which is absurd. Rather than effectively telling women "dress more conservatively, don't wear headphones, moderate your drinking", they should be telling men "Do not f*cking sexually assault women" because clearly the message is not getting through to certain men. And then the police themselves should be taking sexual assaults more seriously. It's clear from the gap between women who have experienced sexual assault compared to the actual number of reported assaults that women have very little faith in the police and even less faith that there will ever be a conviction. So they don't both reporting it. 

The real fucking world is that men are sexually assaulting women and women are being told to look at their behaviour rather than the blokes being told to look at their own. That is, perhaps, why some feminists are loud and shouty because they quite like shouting out that it's not their fucking fault. Women don't want 'protecting', they want men to stop sexually assaulting them.

Out of upvotes but a lot more of this please. Attitude not assaults.

[Blisterpack]

4 minutes ago, Thunderstruck said:

anyway! This topic is too vast and I’ve probably pissed off enough people for today! Back to work lol.

 

It’s not that vast. And fortunately there is an increasing consensus about it. That’s the best thing to have come from the #metoo movement in my opinion. 

[Phoenix Girl]

8 minutes ago, Keithy said:

The 'outrage' is that the advice is putting the onus on the women to regulate their behaviour which is absurd. Rather than effectively telling women "dress more conservatively, don't wear headphones, moderate your drinking", they should be telling men "Do not f*cking sexually assault women" because clearly the message is not getting through to certain men. And then the police themselves should be taking sexual assaults more seriously. It's clear from the gap between women who have experienced sexual assault compared to the actual number of reported assaults that women have very little faith in the police and even less faith that there will ever be a conviction. So they don't both reporting it. 

The real fucking world is that men are sexually assaulting women and women are being told to look at their behaviour rather than the blokes being told to look at their own. That is, perhaps, why some feminists are loud and shouty because they quite like shouting out that it's not their fucking fault. Women don't want 'protecting', they want men to stop sexually assaulting them.

Yes I also tried to upvote but none left, soz. Will try and remember to come back later

[Pear_Cider]

14 hours ago, H.M.V said:

Isn't that how everyone finds me? Although @Pear_Cider spotted me from my old avatar the first time I went and was an absolute petal. Always make a point to have a yay we're on the farm hug. We missed 2016, stupid mud. 

I remember your first time...great meet up that was. First time I met @bennyhana22 as well  I remember introducing you to @Wooderson and @The Nal among others!  x

You carried a bag so people knew who you were!!  

Edited October 24, 2018 by Pear_Cider

[clarkete]

6 minutes ago, Blisterpack said:

It’s not that vast. And fortunately there is an increasing consensus about it. That’s the best thing to have come from the #metoo movement in my opinion. 

We just had our own great consensus moment.  Even Neil joined in to point out that TS was spouting some hot air  

Just joshing Neil, you're very cuddly really  

[Hugh Jass]

2 hours ago, Thunderstruck said:

Was there for this, it was indeed brilliant. Not that you'll believe I believe that I'm sure ?

 

[Havors]

Pass the dutchie pon the left hand side....

 

That is all.