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Evilmonkeydan

Prepping for sales day, similar festival/event sold on seetickets?

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18 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

although - in theory, at least - it'll make naff-all difference to having just one IP address.

It does... you have 3 chances of connecting as opposed to 1..... they use IP rate limiting so 3 browsers on 1 IP is pointless... but 3 IP's have 3 times the chance of getting a connection.

Unless you mean in the grand scheme of things though yeah haha it is not much more of a chance in real terms :)

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1 minute ago, Havors said:

they use IP rate limiting

To date, nobody has found any evidence to suggest that's true. And it's incredibly unlikely given that it'd, for example, effectively screw over anyone using a network that uses NAT and/or a proxy server which has multiple devices trying for tickets. So students on their University/College wifi would have virtually no chance of tickets as you'd potentially have 10,000 to 40,000 people using a single public IP amongst other scenarios..

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12 hours ago, incident said:

It's actually more difficult to answer than you might expect.

At the most basic level, an IP address is per-computer so essentially in that context you'll have 2 - 1 for your home PC used by both IE and Chrome, and one for your work PC.

However, where it gets very complicated is that multiple computers using the same network can share public IP addresses - so for example if you have 2 computers set up at home and a tablet all connected to the same wifi, then as far as the seetickets servers are concerned they'll probably all appear as being from the same IP address. The same is possible if multiple people are connecting via your work network but that depends how the organisation has configured it.

Basically, I'd say don't worry about it too much. Shit like that gets massively overanalysed on here, and isn't nearly as important or relevant as it may seem. I think unique browser sessions are a far more important/useful factor.

Thanks. Last year I just came into work with 5 sessions open on chrome and just F5'ing between them all. I was on in 10 mins. But that is the first time getting tickets in 3 years of trying.

Work have said I can come in again.... so may do that instead and bring a few pals with me.

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51 minutes ago, incident said:

To date, nobody has found any evidence to suggest that's true. And it's incredibly unlikely given that it'd, for example, effectively screw over anyone using a network that uses NAT and/or a proxy server which has multiple devices trying for tickets. So students on their University/College wifi would have virtually no chance of tickets as you'd potentially have 10,000 to 40,000 people using a single public IP amongst other scenarios..

this. :)

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1 hour ago, incident said:

To date, nobody has found any evidence to suggest that's true. And it's incredibly unlikely given that it'd, for example, effectively screw over anyone using a network that uses NAT and/or a proxy server which has multiple devices trying for tickets. So students on their University/College wifi would have virtually no chance of tickets as you'd potentially have 10,000 to 40,000 people using a single public IP amongst other scenarios..

Including mobile networks which use multi layered NAT and everyone swears by them

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3 hours ago, incident said:

To date, nobody has found any evidence to suggest that's true. And it's incredibly unlikely given that it'd, for example, effectively screw over anyone using a network that uses NAT and/or a proxy server which has multiple devices trying for tickets. So students on their University/College wifi would have virtually no chance of tickets as you'd potentially have 10,000 to 40,000 people using a single public IP amongst other scenarios..

Fair play. There must be some rate limiting though surely? or it would be very easy to DDoS them??  It's not my area of expertise to say the least. 

I presume they most definitely use cookies in some way, that can be proved my hitting the 60 per minute limit on 2 tabs of same browser. Hitting that limit is a big no no and clicking refresh while you are on the 20 second refresh warning page is a big no no... it resets the counter. Once you let that 20 seconds pass it will take you back and from there you can hit F5 again at a speed less than once per second. 

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3 hours ago, incident said:

To date, nobody has found any evidence to suggest that's true. And it's incredibly unlikely given that it'd, for example, effectively screw over anyone using a network that uses NAT and/or a proxy server which has multiple devices trying for tickets. So students on their University/College wifi would have virtually no chance of tickets as you'd potentially have 10,000 to 40,000 people using a single public IP amongst other scenarios..

I've tested this to some degree. Exceeding a 1s refresh rate over a rolling 60s will throw you a 'busy' page. Exceeding the rate between 2 browsers on the same device will also throw the 'busy' page.  Hammering away on 3 different browsers is therefore pretty pointless if between them you are constantly exceeding the 1s rate and seeing a 'false' busy page.  You may as well use one browser and tab (as has been recommended...) and controlling the F5 rate to stay within the limit. 

Ref NAT I can only assume that they inspect packets at Layer 2 to ensure they don't block every device on a single NAT IP. 

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1 hour ago, parsonjack said:

I've tested this to some degree....

and if you're correct, to go back to what was just said...

Having one IP or multiple IPs makes no difference, as any limiting is done at the browser level and not at the IP level.

:)

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I shouldn't think they use any sort of rate limiter since the whole ticket sale would look like a DDoS attack ;)

The multiple IP address thing is a pretty dead end thing I reckon as there is so much NAT going on between you and the front end load balancer IP(s).

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3 minutes ago, Pinhead said:

I shouldn't think they use any sort of rate limiter since the whole ticket sale would look like a DDoS attack ;)

Quite - if the Eavii/See ever wanted to crash anyone else's systems, they need only redirect 'glastonbury.seetickets.com' for a few minutes early one October Sunday morning...

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34 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

and if you're correct, to go back to what was just said...

Having one IP or multiple IPs makes no difference, as any limiting is done at the browser level and not at the IP level.

:)

Yup.  If your chances of being gifted a session are increased by the number of times you request one then there *could* be a very slight advantage from using multiple devices on different IPs...but it's probably balanced out by the difficulty in one person trying to manage them all simultaneously.

One device, one browser, one tab, one finger.....worked pretty well so far for me.

31 minutes ago, Pinhead said:

I shouldn't think they use any sort of rate limiter since the whole ticket sale would look like a DDoS attack ;)

The multiple IP address thing is a pretty dead end thing I reckon as there is so much NAT going on between you and the front end load balancer IP(s).

The firewall is probably open to all requests for the URL but the load balancers will throttle by limiting the amount of concurrent sessions available....otherwise it would all be over in 2 minutes...assuming the booking engine and database could process at the rate.

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The backend session manager would deal with this and pass back to the front end load balancer to say which server was busy and which was open to new transactions. Yes, given sufficient resource, the sale could be over in minutes in theory. But I don't think they want it like that...

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But have the efestival servers been beefed up in preparation for T day?

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37 minutes ago, Pinhead said:

 But I don't think they want it like that...

Yup....I seem to remember some confirmation of that being the case sometime in the past.

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1 minute ago, morph100 said:

But have the efestival servers been beefed up in preparation for T day?

It's not my area but these days it's more than likely the app servers are all VM's....so that if things get overloaded, bearing in mind that the load will be throttled to avoid it, then it's pretty simple to spin up another VM to ease things.

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3 hours ago, eFestivals said:

and if you're correct, to go back to what was just said...

Having one IP or multiple IPs makes no difference, as any limiting is done at the browser level and not at the IP level.

:)

Does this mean you can open multiple windows and hammer away at F5? Then when one gives you a busy screen open another browser (Or private session browser)?

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All this is well above my head. Getting down to brass tacks - what do people think is the best strategy? 

One machine and one browser, plus another machine, via mobile network, one browser. Plus lucky pants? 

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and is it easier with 2 people trying for 2 tickets?  ..... or 6 for 6 tickets based on the data entry times and the fact that maybe 3 of those 6 won't be putting in there same effort?

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11 hours ago, morph100 said:

But have the efestival servers been beefed up in preparation for T day?

a much more powerful front-end server was installed in April. Weirdly it runs at a higher load in normal circumstances than the previous one did, but hopefully will cope with the big loads better.

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10 hours ago, semmtexx said:

Does this mean you can open multiple windows and hammer away at F5? Then when one gives you a busy screen open another browser (Or private session browser)?

It's impossible to say with certainty because we can really only speculate about how things are set-up at See's end.

But from logically thinking it thru, three different browsers* on one device should give no meaningful advantage or disadvantage to three different browsers on three different devices.

(* that's different web browsers, not 3 windows of the same web browser)

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11 hours ago, semmtexx said:

Does this mean you can open multiple windows and hammer away at F5? Then when one gives you a busy screen open another browser (Or private session browser)?

Literally all you need it one browser and refresh the shit out of it. I've known as instance before where one browser got through and when a 2nd finally did it upset the 1st.

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Got early bird tickets for Bearded this morning, they use See Tickets too.

09:00 - Tickets not available
f5 once - Buy tickets
Done by 09:02

More of this sort of thing please!

Apparently there have been problems for a few people though, getting to the end, saying payment has not gone through, then getting an email saying payment has been taken. Some claiming they've ended up with multiple orders.

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On 9/14/2018 at 4:42 PM, Havors said:

Hitting that limit is a big no no and clicking refresh while you are on the 20 second refresh warning page is a big no no... it resets the counter. Once you let that 20 seconds pass it will take you back and from there you can hit F5 again at a speed less than once per second. 

I don't know what this means and it's confusing me....which this close to T-Day is quite stressful. There's a 20 second refresh warning page????

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7 hours ago, Gnomicide said:

Got early bird tickets for Bearded this morning, they use See Tickets too.

09:00 - Tickets not available
f5 once - Buy tickets
Done by 09:02

More of this sort of thing please!

Apparently there have been problems for a few people though, getting to the end, saying payment has not gone through, then getting an email saying payment has been taken. Some claiming they've ended up with multiple orders.

This has been a massive cock up today on Seetickets, many people with that issue, and still happening apparently hours later

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9 hours ago, eFestivals said:

It's impossible to say with certainty because we can really only speculate about how things are set-up at See's end.

But from logically thinking it thru, three different browsers* on one device should give no meaningful advantage or disadvantage to three different browsers on three different devices.

(* that's different web browsers, not 3 windows of the same web browser)

Yes - certainly three browsers on one machine giving no advantage makes sense. If I recall correctly when I got through in 2016 I had a few windows open, when one got through all the others got through at the same time. I only need six tickets so I didn't look what happened to the other windows after I bought my tickets. 

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