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Football 18/19

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2 hours ago, eastynh said:

Have Liverpool never had any fortune to be invested in by rich people???

They have and they continue to have. However it’s all relative to others in the league. You chose pretty much the only metric which would suggest Liverpool are outspending City, the reality is that the 2 biggest spenders in the league are the 2 Manchester clubs. Throughout Europe leagues are won by teams with the top 2 biggest wage bills, Liverpool have a chance to buck that trend. As someone who couldn’t care less which team wins the league I think that deserves credit. As I said City good fortune in getting the investment is way more of a factor in the title race then fuck ups from keepers. However as I also state I don’t begrudge City the fortunate investment, football was no more intersesting when United and Arsenal were trading titles.

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City used to be sound but now most people think they’re a soulless shower of blerts. Mancs *gagging* for them to prevent Libpule from winning the league. Funny that.

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12 hours ago, eastynh said:

No it doesn't. The only people who have broken the law are the ones who have hacked private emails. Not once have Der Spiegel suggested City have broken any laws. 

That article is a load of nonesense. Der Spiegel are suggesting that a large proportion of Citys sponsors contributions was given to them by Abu Dhabi. Even if they did, that is not fraud and nor has it broken any laws. UEFA ruled that the level of Citys sponsorship was fair. When the sponsors get their funds from is no business of UEFA. Etihad have unequivocally denued any funds coming from City and UEFA has no right what so ever to audit the books of Etihad.

There is a world of difference between finding ways round UEFAS rules and commiting fraud.

so what you're saying is there's the spirit of the law and then there's city and their fans who don't give a fuck...?

Edited by eFestivals

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12 hours ago, eastynh said:

Have Liverpool never had any fortune to be invested in by rich people???

nope, just businessmen in for a profit, who aren't willing to spunk billions on a plaything to flatter their vanity.

Edited by eFestivals

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11 hours ago, pink_triangle said:

They have and they continue to have. However it’s all relative to others in the league. You chose pretty much the only metric which would suggest Liverpool are outspending City, the reality is that the 2 biggest spenders in the league are the 2 Manchester clubs. Throughout Europe leagues are won by teams with the top 2 biggest wage bills, Liverpool have a chance to buck that trend. As someone who couldn’t care less which team wins the league I think that deserves credit. As I said City good fortune in getting the investment is way more of a factor in the title race then fuck ups from keepers. However as I also state I don’t begrudge City the fortunate investment, football was no more intersesting when United and Arsenal were trading titles.

Is Liverpools wage bill not higher than City's.

2 hours ago, eFestivals said:

so what you're saying is there's the spirit of the law and then there's city and their fans who don't give a fuck...?

No I don't particulary give a fuck. City have not broken any laws nor commited any crimes. What they may have done and there is no evidence to prove they have yet, is found away round rules that were brought in, in attempt to stifle competiveness at the behest of a select few clubs at the top. Now Der Spiegel are saying the emails suggest that City got Abu Dhabi to gift Etihad the money for the sponsorship. Now UEFA ruled the Etihad deal as fair value. Where Etihad get their money from to fund their deals is no one elses business. No laws have been broken and nothing will come of this investigation. Now I like the way people have been taking what Der Spiegel say as gospel even though their journalists have been proved to be making up stories recently. Maybe it just fits peoples bitter and jealous narrative. 

No one was screaming for the implementation of FFP when Madrid were being bank rolled by the Spanish monarchy. People are acting like these rules have been part of football since year dot. No they haven't. Apparently they were going to stop things like Portsmouth happening. Well thats a load of bollocks, just have a look at whats going on at Bolton and Wigan for example. All the bitter and jealous arseholes moaning about City don't care about whats going on at them clubs and they are the clubs FFP is apparently there to protect. They only care that their team are nit winning anymore. I suppose when you are a glory hunter and you only support a club because it was always winning, reactions like this should be expected.

1 hour ago, eFestivals said:

nope, just businessmen in for a profit, who aren't willing to spunk billions on a plaything to flatter their vanity.

Go catch up on Liverpools history. Have a look at how they started and then later on the Moore's family. Then come back and tell me that sentence you have written above does not apply to them.

Edit- Just to add, your post above does not make sense. If Citys owners were to sell City yoday, they would make far more money on their investment than Liverpools owners would.

Edited by eastynh

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5 minutes ago, eastynh said:

Now Der Spiegel are saying the emails suggest that City got Abu Dhabi to gift Etihad the money for the sponsorship.

oh come on. That suggestion didn't need any emails to be seen. It's pretty damned obvious.

Unless you think it was just a lucky coincidence that an airline not making huge amounts of money with the same owners as City signed the world's biggest sponsorship deal? :lol: 

7 minutes ago, eastynh said:

rules that were brought in, in attempt to stifle competiveness at the behest of a select few clubs at the top.

Yup, that's why the rules were brought in.

And Bolton, or 'Arry, are the reasons why rules something like that are needed in some form - because otherwise it just becomes a wallet waving competition.

Liverpool won the league with fewer points than they have now with 8(?) games to go. Saying money has always decided the league isn't the whole story.

10 minutes ago, eastynh said:

Now UEFA ruled the Etihad deal as fair valueÔĽŅ.

probably after a few brown envelopes.

11 minutes ago, eastynh said:

No laws have been broken

the spirit of those laws has been broken.

11 minutes ago, eastynh said:

No one was screaming for the implementation of FFP when Madrid were being bank rolled by the Spanish monarchy.

the effect of money was much lower as demonstrated by the higher competitiveness all down the leagues. 

As the effect of money has grown the need for FFP has grown. Any other take is self-justifying bollocks.

14 minutes ago, eastynh said:

All the bitter and jealous arseholes moaning about City don't care

 

14 minutes ago, eastynh said:

I don't particulary give a fuck.

:rolleyes: 

Not bitter and jealous. A statement of fact, you don't give a fuck about the game, you give a fuck about your bought success only.

16 minutes ago, eastynh said:

I suppose when you are a glory hunter and you only support a club because it was always winning, reactions like this should be expected.

and for those who aren't glory hunters and don't support a club? How do you explain them?

(cue some made-up bollocks about how XYZ is my club :rolleyes: ).

17 minutes ago, eastynh said:

Go catch up on Liverpools history. Have a look at how they started and then later on the Moore's family. Then come back and tell me that sentence you have written above does not apply to them.

:rolleyes: 

Are you too dumb to know the very real difference...????

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16 minutes ago, The Nal said:

Can't not give Ole the job eh?

Something fundamentally wrong with the United board, I reckon. Do you have a DOF? There needs to be someone with more of a football brain involved (Chelsea need the same). Dodgy transfers and new contracts for the likes of Jones and Smalling says it all. There needs to be someone who has a better idea of and is more capable of identifying what is needed in the squad. Plenty of talent there, just too much filler for a club like United.

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6 minutes ago, jyoung said:

Something fundamentally wrong with the United board, I reckon. Do you have a DOF? There needs to be someone with more of a football brain involved (Chelsea need the same). Dodgy transfers and new contracts for the likes of Jones and Smalling says it all. There needs to be someone who has a better idea of and is more capable of identifying what is needed in the squad. Plenty of talent there, just too much filler for a club like United.

Utd have never had a director of football. Always been the manager and a couple of good chairman in creepy Martin Edwards and then Gill.  Woodward is an accountant. They are looking to hire at the moment which would keep Woodward away from transfers which is good. 

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32 minutes ago, The Nal said:

Can't not give Ole the job eh?

Blimey give the guy a chance, after all you gave jose more than 2 years.

I thought united played well last night, missed 3 headed sitters and at least went for it when they were down to 10. Jose would of retreated and parked the bus with 11 never mind 10. Lets be honest Wolves are not a shabby side either.

Hopefully Solskjaer will build and rip the side up, the Spanish contingent have to go for starters. 

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18 minutes ago, jyoung said:

Something fundamentally wrong with the United board, I reckon. Do you have a DOF? There needs to be someone with more of a football brain involved (Chelsea need the same). Dodgy transfers and new contracts for the likes of Jones and Smalling says it all. There needs to be someone who has a better idea of and is more capable of identifying what is needed in the squad. Plenty of talent there, just too much filler for a club like United.

They get criticised for players running down there contracts, then they get criticised when they protect themselves by getting players signing new deals.

The board have invested enough in the past 5 years, its not there fault van gaal and Mourinho signed garbage. As I have said for years, its the transfer policy that's tripe and needs to change before united improve. If it does not then united will still be around the 3rd-6th area of things.

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the surprise of the season has got to be Arsenal in 3rd with a month to go, hasn't it?

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7 minutes ago, thetime said:

They get criticised for players running down there contracts, then they get criticised when they protect themselves by getting players signing new deals.

The board have invested enough in the past 5 years, its not there fault van gaal and Mourinho signed garbage. As I have said for years, its the transfer policy that's tripe and needs to change before united improve. If it does not then united will still be around the 3rd-6th area of things.

I'm not even digging out United, I've got nothing against them. The board have invested in those dodgy transfers, that's exactly what I'm saying. You can't pin all the clubs misfortunes on some unlikable bosses. Ultimately it's the board who sign off these things and perhaps a DOF or someone who knows the club could be in a better position to advise. 

4 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

the surprise of the season has got to be Arsenal in 3rd with a month to go, hasn't it?

Yep. Shows how rubbish United and Chelsea have been at points this season and well, Tottenham being Tottenham. It won't last long or become a regular occurrence though*.

*says prayer

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11 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

the surprise of the season has got to be Arsenal in 3rd with a month to go, hasn't it?

Tough run in, 5 away games out of 7. 

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Just now, thetime said:

Tough run in, 5 away games out of 7. 

hasn't their away form been excellent? (I might be wrong).

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19 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

hasn't their away form been excellent? (I might be wrong).

Not not really, only won 5 games away from home. Only beaten Huddersfield away in 2019, only beat Bournemouth and palace away outside of the bottom 3 sides. So that’s there Achilles heel this season. 

Got some tough ones on paper with Everton, Watford, Wolves and Leicester away. 

They certainly need to improve there away form to consolidate there position. 

 

Edited by thetime

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2 hours ago, eFestivals said:

oh come on. That suggestion didn't need any emails to be seen. It's pretty damned obvious.

Unless you think it was just a lucky coincidence that an airline not making huge amounts of money with the same owners as City signed the world's biggest sponsorship deal? :lol: 

Yup, that's why the rules were brought in.

And Bolton, or 'Arry, are the reasons why rules something like that are needed in some form - because otherwise it just becomes a wallet waving competition.

Liverpool won the league with fewer points than they have now with 8(?) games to go. Saying money has always decided the league isn't the whole story.

probably after a few brown envelopes.

the spirit of those laws has been broken.

the effect of money was much lower as demonstrated by the higher competitiveness all down the leagues. 

As the effect of money has grown the need for FFP has grown. Any other take is self-justifying bollocks.

 

:rolleyes: 

Not bitter and jealous. A statement of fact, you don't give a fuck about the game, you give a fuck about your bought success only.

and for those who aren't glory hunters and don't support a club? How do you explain them?

(cue some made-up bollocks about how XYZ is my club :rolleyes: ).

:rolleyes: 

Are you too dumb to know the very real difference...????

So basically after all your replies you are still spouting nonesense. 

City have not commited any crime what so ever and have in fact been good for the game. 

What do you prefer? The City model of taking outside investment and putting it into the game, or the United model of fleecing the fans and taking that  cash out of the game.

The way City has been run has been absolutely perfect. The ideal way to run a football club and the perfect way to run a business. Yes the owner had to invest heavily at the outset but they are now self sustaining and worth far more than the initial investment.

Some traditional big clubs have had their noses put out and they don't like it. So what? They then try to implement restrictive rules to cement their places at the top. City find a way round them. Where Etihad get their cash from is no ones business. Where is the moral outrage at Liverpools sponsorship deals?

You want a level playing field then there should be a spending cap in relation to transfers and wages. I am all for that. The problem is that the elite clubs don't want that, they want the field skewed in their favour. 

I hope City win all four trophies just to see the moral outrage.

Edit - Also Neil I am clearly not dumb. If you wish to discuss football issues with me then fine. Don't lower yourself to insults though just because I have a different opinion to you. I would not insult you, please do not insult me.

Edited by eastynh

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1 minute ago, eastynh said:

 

I hope City win all four trophies just to see the moral outrage.

 

I would rather Liverpool win the league than that happening.¬†ūüėÉ

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5 minutes ago, eastynh said:

So basically after all your replies you are still spouting nonesense. 

City have not commited any crime what so ever and have in fact been good for the game. 

What do you prefer? The City model of taking outside investment and putting it into the game, or the United model of fleecing the fans and taking that  cash out of the game.

The way City has been run has been absolutely perfect. The ideal way to run a football club and the perfect way to run a business. Yes the owner had to invest heavily at the outset but they are now self sustaining and worth far more than the initial investment.

Some traditional big clubs have had their noses put out and they don't like it. So what? They then try to implement restrictive rules to cement their places at the top. City find a way round them. Where Etihad get their cash from is no ones business. Where is the moral outrage at Liverpools sponsorship deals?

You want a level playing field then there should be a spending cap in relation to transfers and wages. I am all for that. The problem is that the elite clubs don't want that, they want the field skewed in their favour. 

I hope City win all four trophies just to see the moral outrage.

Edit - Also Neil I am clearly not dumb. If you wish to discuss football issues with me then fine. Don't lower yourself to insults though just because I have a different opinion to you. I would not insult you, please do not insult me.

It is if it's made up and from the same source as the owners...

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Just now, zahidf said:

It is if it's made up and from the same source as the owners...

Not if Uefa rule the deal fair value, which they did.

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7 minutes ago, eastynh said:

What do you prefer? The City model of taking outside investment and putting it into the game, or the United model of fleecing the fans and taking that  cash out of the game.

I prefer something more even than both. 

 

7 minutes ago, eastynh said:

Some traditional big clubs have had their noses put out and they don't like it. So what?

I've no problem with that happening and I certainly don't want new comers locked out.

But that doesn't mean i want huge amounts of money to corrupt everything of football eirher.

 

7 minutes ago, eastynh said:

They then try to implement restrictive rules to cement their places at the top.

something City is now doing too, don't forget.

 

7 minutes ago, eastynh said:

Where Etihad get their cash from is no ones business. Where is the moral outrage at Liverpools sponsorship deals?

The Etihad one is very obviously taking the piss. You know it and I know it.

There's no other easily-identifiable pisstaking deals as far as I'm aware, but feel free to wise me up if there are.

 

7 minutes ago, eastynh said:

You want a level playing field then there should be a spending cap in relation to transfers and wages. I am all for that. The problem is that the elite clubs don't want that, they want the field skewed in their favour. 

but you've just said it's OK to find ways around rules like that. :lol: 

Either you agree that ways should be found to try and reduce the effect of money, or you agree that it's OK to take the piss out of the spirit of the law.

Just because the current rules might not be perfect doesn't mean you should think it's OK for the spirit they're written in to be undermined.

 

7 minutes ago, eastynh said:

I hope City win all four trophies just to see the moral outrage.

I think you're rather over-playing the importance anyone is placing on City. :) 

 

7 minutes ago, eastynh said:

Edit - Also Neil I am clearly not dumb. If you wish to discuss football issues with me then fine. Don't lower yourself to insults though just because I have a different opinion to you. I would not insult you, please do not insult me.

I said that while crediting you as smart, not dumb.

I think you're smart enough to know that the etihad deal is a pisstake way around the FFP rules. 

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7 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

I prefer something more even than both. 

 

I've no problem with that happening and I certainly don't want new comers locked out.

But that doesn't mean i want huge amounts of money to corrupt everything of football eirher.

 

something City is now doing too, don't forget.

 

The Etihad one is very obviously taking the piss. You know it and I know it.

There's no other easily-identifiable pisstaking deals as far as I'm aware, but feel free to wise me up if there are.

 

but you've just said it's OK to find ways around rules like that. :lol: 

Either you agree that ways should be found to try and reduce the effect of money, or you agree that it's OK to take the piss out of the spirit of the law.

Just because the current rules might not be perfect doesn't mean you should think it's OK for the spirit they're written in to be undermined.

 

I think you're rather over-playing the importance anyone is placing on City. :) 

 

I said that while crediting you as smart, not dumb.

I think you're smart enough to know that the etihad deal is a pisstake way around the FFP rules. 

The thing you are forgetting though is that when these alleged violations were commited, City did in fact fail FFP and were punished. There is absolutely no suggestion that they have done anything wrong since. They are now the perfectly run football club. They don't have the highest wage bill, nor the most expensive squad and our highest transfer fee is nowhere near the highest in English football, nevermind Europe.

As of this point, there is absolutely no evidence to suggest City have done anything wrong. Everyone is taking the word of a German newspaper who have just had to apologise for their reporters making up stories as gospel.

As for the fraud accusation from Wooderson, I am surprised you have not deleted that as it is clearly libellous. At no point ever have there been any suggestion that City have broke the law.

Lets leave this convo till the efests meet. It is one for over a beer. It is going to be a dramatic end to the season, lets enjoy that for now.

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1 hour ago, thetime said:

Blimey give the guy a chance, after all you gave jose more than 2 years.

Jose was a proven winner. Ole, club legend and all but hes only managed in Norway and a disastrous few months at Cardiff. Hes very very underqualified. Beat a few lower teams with Utd and has now lost 3 of the last 4. 

Ill reserve judgement but they should've waited until the end of the season.

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6 minutes ago, eastynh said:

As for the fraud accusation from Wooderson, I am surprised you have not deleted that as it is clearly libellous.

in law the individual is responsible for their own words. Responsibility only becomes mine if there's there a complaint from the organisation libelled that I don't act on, and then the libel is upheld in law. So no worries for me on that front.

But I am finding it incredibly weird that you've raised that, as tho it's you who've been insulted, and when I don't really think you'd raise it for similar comments about anyone else. The short and easy version would probably say something about protesting too much.

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