Football 18/19

[jyoung]

Also, think Gareth Southgate deserves a lot of credit for giving us a team that has really captured the nation. Himself and Steve Holland (whose influence definitely cannot be underestimated) have the almost impossible job but they're having a damn good go.

[JSmurphy]

What a night .

[The Nal]

Some of the south American teams are really letting themselves down in this world cup in terms of play acting. Neymar and Suarez have been a disgrace. Colombia too last night. 

[ThomThomDrum]

20 minutes ago, The Nal said:

Some of the south American teams are really letting themselves down in this world cup in terms of play acting. Neymar and Suarez have been a disgrace. Colombia too last night. 

If it has worked in the past for them then they will continue to try and get away with it, unless a hard line is taken to try and stamp it out (which I dont see happening anytime soon). And it happens everywhere in football, not just South America. 

Sure Henderson threw himself on the ground unnecessarily from the "headbutt" instance and was being applauded for doing so. Some said he has every right to do so. Yeah he was caught, but he was obviously acting in his reaction to it and there is no way what happened him floors him.

If peoples attitudes are "its OK when its my team" or "its OK in certain circumstances" then is will always be in the game. Thats professionalism and winning a all costs for you.  

[dentalplan]

41 minutes ago, jyoung said:

Also, think Gareth Southgate deserves a lot of credit for giving us a team that has really captured the nation. Himself and Steve Holland (whose influence definitely cannot be underestimated) have the almost impossible job but they're having a damn good go.

I think Gareth is the hero of our World Cup whatever happens. He has come into this job with his heart and mind in it, like it’s been his dream to manage England rather than an interesting vacay from club management. Probably the England manager I hoped Shearer would be, then Neville, then probably about forty others above Southgate.

[jyoung]

Last 10 results vs Sweden

• Sweden 4-2 England (2012 friendly)
• Sweden 2-3 England (Euro 2012)
• England 1-0 Sweden (2011 friendly)
• Sweden 2-2 England (World Cup 2006)
• Sweden 1-0 England (2004 friendly)
• England 1-1 Sweden (World Cup 2002)
• England 1-1 Sweden (2001 friendly)
• England 0-0 Sweden (Euro 2000 qualifier)
• Sweden 2-1 England (Euro 2000 qualifier)
• England 3-3 Sweden (1995 friendly)

[TheGayTent]

33 minutes ago, jyoung said:

Last 10 results vs Sweden

• Sweden 4-2 England (2012 friendly)
• Sweden 2-3 England (Euro 2012)
• England 1-0 Sweden (2011 friendly)
• Sweden 2-2 England (World Cup 2006)
• Sweden 1-0 England (2004 friendly)
• England 1-1 Sweden (World Cup 2002)
• England 1-1 Sweden (2001 friendly)
• England 0-0 Sweden (Euro 2000 qualifier)
• Sweden 2-1 England (Euro 2000 qualifier)
• England 3-3 Sweden (1995 friendly)

Handy that - I now no longer remember Euro 92...

[jyoung]

2 minutes ago, TheGayTent said:

Handy that - I now no longer remember Euro 92...

Whoops!

[dentalplan]

5 hours ago, eFestivals said:

nope, ITV. As turgid as ever.

I love the ITV coverage. Cracking group of guys. They’ve secured my viewership for the final... and if it’s McCoist and Champion commentating I might even tape it!

[eFestivals]

33 minutes ago, dentalplan said:

I love the ITV coverage. Cracking group of guys. They’ve secured my viewership for the final... and if it’s McCoist and Champion commentating I might even tape it!

McCoist is alright.

Hoddle makes Shearer look smart.

[Hugh Jass]

2 hours ago, ThomThomDrum said:

If it has worked in the past for them then they will continue to try and get away with it, unless a hard line is taken to try and stamp it out (which I dont see happening anytime soon). And it happens everywhere in football, not just South America. 

Sure Henderson threw himself on the ground unnecessarily from the "headbutt" instance and was being applauded for doing so. Some said he has every right to do so. Yeah he was caught, but he was obviously acting in his reaction to it and there is no way what happened him floors him.

If peoples attitudes are "its OK when its my team" or "its OK in certain circumstances" then is will always be in the game. Thats professionalism and winning a all costs for you.  

They tried but Neymar just screamed and rolled around a lot.

[jyoung]

Ronaldo to Juve for 88 mil?

[jump]

8 minutes ago, jyoung said:

Ronaldo to Juve for 88 mil?

Even with his age I'd thought he'd go for more than that. The amount of shirts they'd sell will be huge.

Edited July 4, 2018 by jump

[DareToDibble]

5 minutes ago, jump said:

Even with his age I'd thought he'd go for more than that. The amount of shirt they'd sell will be huge.

I thought the same. This news has come out of nowhere, too. You'd think there would have been rumours involving one of the best evver players changing club.

This World Cup has England written all over it!

[jump]

23 minutes ago, DareToDibble said:

I thought the same. This news has come out of nowhere, too. You'd think there would have been rumours involving one of the best evver players changing club.

This World Cup has England written all over it!

I wouldn't say out of nowhere, there has been talk ever since the CL final, with Paris Saint-Germain & Man U being the likely spots. Once he moves this will trigger a domino effect of loads of big money transfers.

Edited July 4, 2018 by jump

[dentalplan]

Isn't it just his usual flex to get a new contract? Or do Real actually want rid? The latter seems hard to believe even with potential replacements in the news.

[TheGayTent]

27 minutes ago, jump said:

Even with his age I'd thought he'd go for more than that. The amount of shirts they'd sell will be huge.

One of the biggest football myths ever is shirt sales - both in terms of how many get sold in relation to a particular player, and in terms of how much revenue and profit they create for a football club. It’s (relative) peanuts to them. 

[jyoung]

12 minutes ago, TheGayTent said:

One of the biggest football myths ever is shirt sales - both in terms of how many get sold in relation to a particular player, and in terms of how much revenue and profit they create for a football club. It’s (relative) peanuts to them. 

Correct - https://www.independent.co.uk/sport/football/transfers/neymar-transfer-psg-barcelona-latest-shirt-sales-world-record-198m-a7874731.html

[chemica]

2 hours ago, dentalplan said:

Isn't it just his usual flex to get a new contract? Or do Real actually want rid? The latter seems hard to believe even with potential replacements in the news.

I think I read somewhere his agent was engineering this, to be honest. But seemingly does hold a bit of weight. 

 

Especially if the Mbappe story coming out of France today is legit. 

[pink_triangle]

I didn’t watch the England match yesterday as I was attending another English tradition Wimbledon! However some of the reporting seems a bit ott.

When walking to the tube stop I said to my wife (hearing it was extra time) I bet England win on penalties, my reasoning being law of averages says they are bound to win one day. I wake up to reports that winning a shootout was evidence of the teams “character “. If you need character to win a shootout, what if both teams have character or neither do? When I first got into football penalties were seen as a lottery, now I think we have moved away from appreciating the influence of luck. A crap penalty can go in if the keeper dives the wrong way.

I also heard a lot about how different this team are from the “golden generation “ using this World Cup as evidence. I have no doubt that the golden generation could have progressed in a tournament if a draw had opened up like this one.

As I have said I think England have played a great game in expectation management. In terms of squad players England are probably in the top 8 in terms of amount of top 4 major league players, yet quarter finals is seen as a big success. For all this talk about England knockout record, I can only remember them losing a knockout match to a team worse than Columbia once which was Iceland. I think your look at the Columbia team and only a couple of players make the England team. I don’t think beating a team with worse players should be treated as a surprise. I think England will beat Sweden easily.

In terms of going forward there is no reason England can’t win the World Cup, they aren’t the best in the world, but it’s not a fair tournament. If England play to their potential and take advantage of their good luck, they probably only need to beat one top side. They would probably be the worse World Cup winners of recent history, but I’m sure Greece don’t mind being the worse ever winners of the Euros!

[kaosmark2]

1 hour ago, pink_triangle said:

I didn’t watch the England match yesterday as I was attending another English tradition Wimbledon! However some of the reporting seems a bit ott.

When walking to the tube stop I said to my wife (hearing it was extra time) I bet England win on penalties, my reasoning being law of averages says they are bound to win one day. I wake up to reports that winning a shootout was evidence of the teams “character “. If you need character to win a shootout, what if both teams have character or neither do? When I first got into football penalties were seen as a lottery, now I think we have moved away from appreciating the influence of luck. A crap penalty can go in if the keeper dives the wrong way.

I also heard a lot about how different this team are from the “golden generation “ using this World Cup as evidence. I have no doubt that the golden generation could have progressed in a tournament if a draw had opened up like this one.

As I have said I think England have played a great game in expectation management. In terms of squad players England are probably in the top 8 in terms of amount of top 4 major league players, yet quarter finals is seen as a big success. For all this talk about England knockout record, I can only remember them losing a knockout match to a team worse than Columbia once which was Iceland. I think your look at the Columbia team and only a couple of players make the England team. I don’t think beating a team with worse players should be treated as a surprise. I think England will beat Sweden easily.

In terms of going forward there is no reason England can’t win the World Cup, they aren’t the best in the world, but it’s not a fair tournament. If England play to their potential and take advantage of their good luck, they probably only need to beat one top side. They would probably be the worse World Cup winners of recent history, but I’m sure Greece don’t mind being the worse ever winners of the Euros!

I think penalties can be a mental burden. There is of course an element of luck in them (one of Columbia's pens was awful but Pickford went the wrong way), but there is still a skill to take them, and the pressure will have been there.

I completely agree that the "golden generation" could have done better in tournaments with draws like this. I also think that in Euro 2004 England had the best team on paper.

I said it a few pages back, but I think your definition of "top 4 players" is stretching it. Delph/Jones/Stones/Lingard/Dier/Rashford/Young are very much squad players for their teams. Kane/Alli/Sterling/Henderson are IMO the only 4 key players for big teams England have. Maybe Trippier/Walker but there's not the same "huge player" status for these as there was for Lampard/Gerrard/Beckham/Scholes/Owen/Ferdinand/Campbell/Cashley/Neville/Terry/Rooney and the England team from that era. A bit-part England player of that time like Joe Cole would walk into this England team. I agree that expectations have been lowered beyond reason, but that's largely because the team isn't brimming with quality.

I don't think it's ridiculous to say that England are in the 2nd tier of teams on the world stage. So are Argentina and Portugal. The difference is England seem more organised than they do and have had better luck with the draw.

[TheGayTent]

1 hour ago, pink_triangle said:

I didn’t watch the England match yesterday as I was attending another English tradition Wimbledon!

I know the World Cup is on, and we’re through to the Quarter Finals but I hadn’t realised the LTA were that desperate they were even letting in Welshmen....standards have dropped 

Edited July 4, 2018 by TheGayTent

[TheGayTent]

1 hour ago, pink_triangle said:

When I first got into football penalties were seen as a lottery, now I think we have moved away from appreciating the influence of luck. A crap penalty can go in if the keeper dives the wrong way.

 

Nothing has changed. 

They were a lottery then, they’re a lottery now, they were about character then, they’re about character now. As well many other things, bottle, temperament, gamesmanship, skill, etc etc 

[TheGayTent]

1 hour ago, pink_triangle said:

I also heard a lot about how different this team are from the “golden generation “ using this World Cup as evidence. I have no doubt that the golden generation could have progressed in a tournament if a draw had opened up like this one.

This team is very different to the ‘golden generation’, but that’s got diddly squat to do with progression in a World Cup. 

Indeed the 2002 squad (which was in the era of the ‘golden generation’) got to the quarter finals. If England lose against Sweden they will have gone out at the same stage to a far worse team. 

The current squad will still be very different to the ‘golden generation’. 

[thetime]

Liverpool FC statement says doctors have confirmed that Henderson had concussion from the Colombian headbutt that happened a few minutes before he missed his penalty