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2 minutes ago, stuartbert two hats said:

Not nice, but at least it serves to put to bed the bullshit theory that NYC Downlow only gets away with it because they're all gay.

But highlights that people think it's ok to happen at NYCD as everyone on the thread about the piano bar were disgusted, not so in here.

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55 minutes ago, babyblade41 said:

I just don't really think it's necessary , why would you want an area to make people feel uncomfortable ? it just puts a certain section of a community in a bad light .  Like I said my daughters friends weren't oK with it as they thought it put the LGBT community even further back to have it hidden and made into some sort of freak show 

Just seems not a wise choice especially if some of the stories of gaining entry are true... put into another festival with another section of a minority group and I'm pretty sure views would be different 

It casts LGBT in a bad light to you, but I, and clearly thousands of others thought it was fabulous. Raw, interesting, made me think. Just what I'm after from Glastonbury. Horses for courses and all that. 

Edited by themuel
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1 hour ago, babyblade41 said:

ust spoke to my youngest and asked her if she went with her friends as one couple are in a civil marriage.  She said they had a look but wasn't for them , 

The word you are after there is married. 

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This thread escalated quickly, my.

Went to NYCD for the first and only time in 2014, I'm straight but there was quite a few DJ's I wanted to see one night there. Had an amazing time. The atmosphere was great. I haven't been since due to it being hyped up so much the queues are unbearably obscene.

I have no problem with the dark room. I have to agree with others though on the comments about groping men and asking them to get their dick out is damn right out of order. Everyone knows full well if this was to happen to a female then there'd be outcry and uproar with sexist remarks. Even just humiliating people in the queue 'because it's part of the act' doesn't sit right with me. Everyone goes for a good time regardless of sexual preference. No one expects to be asked to get their dick out for free entry if that makes them uncomfortable.

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Getting kinda tired of LGBT communities being allowed one venue to themselves and then a straight crowd coming in and criticising it.

NYC downlow is just like anywhere in SE corner, replicating something that challenges your mentality and shows you the sub cultures of humanity.

It's a representation of a culture that exists in society, and if you have a problem with it you've got the entirety of the festival to go elsewhere. Some people enjoy something you don't wanna do... that's fine, leave it at that.

I imagine the dick door policy is to weed out those who would probably go inside and end up gawking at two men having a little bit of a kiss.

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2 minutes ago, Matt42 said:

NYC downlow is just like anywhere in SE corner, replicating something that challenges your mentality and shows you the sub cultures of humanity.

Howssat? 

Shangri-la KINDA sure, but very much in theme with other bits of the festival - the rest?

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My view is the NYCD is a safe space for all sexualities, but also exists to highlight the history of gay culture. As a venue, it's wonderful. It's dark, it's sweaty, the atmosphere is great and the music is amazing.

that said, jut before I entered, one of the guys said to me "we've got one rule for guys in here. Tops off, dicks out".  While I found the exchange funny and not to be taken too seriously, I can understand how those less accepting (not necessarily homophobic, just not been exposed to the scene) could find it threatening somewhat. Especially when hearing here that men had been coerced to or been fondled, that seemed to cross a line, especially if the roles were reversed and a woman was told to get naked or inappropriately touched, an uproar would be guaranteed.

while I'm glad that spaces like this exist and thoroughly enjoy them, I can't help but think that some people view it like a safari. However, that is always a risk that a place that pushes boundaries takes I suppose.

tl:dr it's a good place. If it's not your cup of tea, don't go. Simple.

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There seem to be two separate issues that keep cropping up. The first: the dark room. Dark rooms have been a part of gay clubbing for decades, as clubs become more gentrified and rely more and more on money from straight guests to keep afloat you see fewer of them. That said I can think of four clubs/bars on Canal Street in Manchester that still operate dark rooms. The reality is that NYCD operates as a late 80s NYC gay dive bar, that would have had a darkroom. If you're not LGBT and this causes you discomfort I don't care, you're a tourist in a temporary queer space. It doesn't matter how many "gays you know" or if you used to go to lesbian bars decades ago, it's not your space. If you are LGBT and it bothers you do some reading on our history and get a sense of perspective.

 

The issue with people being invited to flash body parts rather than pay to get in? A couple of people I know were offered this, did so and didn't feel violated. That said it's probably a little on the nose and it'd be easy to cross the line from bit of a joke to seriously upsetting someone. As far as I know nobody was ever denied entry for refusing, instead they just paid the charity entry fee. Regardless hopefully they drop it next time around.

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4 hours ago, stuartbert two hats said:

Not nice, but at least it serves to put to bed the bullshit theory that NYC Downlow only gets away with it because they're all gay.

It's not quite comparable though, is it? That alleged ugliness at the Piano Bar seemed to be the result of a couple of arsehole security guys. The alleged ugliness at NYC Downlow seems to be entry policy (although you can count me among the people who never saw or heard of it before reading it here). NYC Downlow would presumably defend themselves, as others have come close to defending them here, by justifying it based on the theme of the venue. Now, I wasn't attending warehouse gay clubs in NYC in the 1980's, but I'd say if they required you to expose yourself to get free entry then, that would have been as unacceptable then as it is now.

"But it was like that back then!" is a shitty excuse. We've evolved a bit, socially. Revelling in an unfortunate stereotype isn't going to do the gay community any favours.

NYC Downlow prides itself on being a gritty club and that's entirely their right. But it's my right to be affronted by being given a condom and lube on entry before being ushered into the most average venue in the SE corner. Full disclosure: I've worked in sex clubs in LA in my time and have seen more than I can imagine goes on in NYC-D in not so dark rooms, so I'm no prude. But context is everything. I'm far less interested in a venue which seems to indulge in masturbatory shock tactics than I am in a venue more interested in putting on a good time for everyone.

Edited by kalifire
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just caught up and Kalifire has got it spot on.  No excuse for this at all and if those who are involved in the LGBT community agree with this door policy you should be ashamed

Insisting on such behaviour is tantamount to assault and I'm surprised someone didn't end up with black eye , the excuses given " it was how it was " is lame at best 

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31 minutes ago, CaledonianGonzo said:

It's worth remembering that the folk getting their auld lads out were just doing it to dodge paying a charity donation.  I'm not getting the impression that this was being forced on anyone.

Exactly, from what I can glean from this thread nobody was forced to do anything they felt uncomfortable with. There were three options; get it out, pay the two quid or turn around and walk away. Are people really being "humiliated" if they are choosing to do it?

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32 minutes ago, CaledonianGonzo said:

There was a fourth option, where I got it out and was paid two quid to put it away again.

 

27 minutes ago, Sack truck said:

With the amount of class A's consumed it was hard enough finding it at the urinals, never mind in front of a load of folk in a queue for a club. Maybe would've got in half price (or more like quarter price) :lol:

Both deserve upvotes but I'm all out!

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3 hours ago, babyblade41 said:

just caught up and Kalifire has got it spot on.  No excuse for this at all and if those who are involved in the LGBT community agree with this door policy you should be ashamed

Insisting on such behaviour is tantamount to assault and I'm surprised someone didn't end up with black eye , the excuses given " it was how it was " is lame at best 

To be honest, having read all the threads on here and seen your many posts, I'm really struggling to see what you get out of Glastonbury or even if you understand the festival at all. You're either (a) a very dedicated poster who takes up a 'traditional conservative' approach for shits and giggles or (b) someone who has previously seen Glasto through the narrow BBC coverage, thought the whole site was like the gentle, safe environment of the Pyramid stage and are outraged that left politics dominate and non mainstream life areas exist or (c) you really are a fun sponge.

If it's (a) then whilst I'd admire the commitment, the faux outrage is getting a bit tiring now.

If it's (b) then Glasto has done it's 'job' of opening peoples minds to alternatives lifestyles and political opinions. You might not like or agree with them or what goes on but that's your problem not Glastonbury's. You seem genuinely shocked that an openly gay venue, specifically designed to replicate a gritty 80's NYC venue and specifically built to provide a space for gay people, is doing exactly that. Have a read about the idea behind it - https://www.residentadvisor.net/features/2778.

If it's (c) then to be honest, you're probably better off going to another festival as you don't come across as particularly enjoying what Glastonbury represents. The idea you should get a reduction in the fee was particularly comical.

 

You have strong opinions on NYCD despite apparently not going. The 'dicks out' on entry was an alternative to paying the £2 entrance fee, similar to Snakepit's 'get your tattoo out or pay'. Nobody was forced to do it, it's part of the fun. And I'd argue that if you're good humoured enough and comfortable with 'getting it out' for some strangers then in the context of an openly gay nightclub where you've just got your dick out for entry it's odd to suddenly feel humiliated or violated if they then 'cop a feel'. I don't for a minute believe it was done in an sexual aggressive way and not heard or seen anything to suggest otherwise.

Glastonbury exists for everyone. 

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Haven't posted in ages but felt I needed to log back in to contribute to this thread.

Regarding the darkroom, these are part and parcel of gay culture and no-one forced you to go in, I'm straight and I didn't bother, but my missus and one of our friends went in but didn't see anyone going at it. I assumed it was only a joke darkroom but clearly it wasn't!

The cocks out thing was clearly a joke, no-one was forced or refused entry if they didn't do it. It was an alternative to paying 2 pounds for a moustache.

As for the Downlow itself, I think its completely a victim of its own success, this was my 4th Glasto(2010,2011 and 2013 previously) and each time I've had a glastonbury "Moment" in there. It was the place I raved about to my friends when I convinced them all to go in 2013 and its the place I always want to go back to, btu this year,it was jammers every night, the queue to get in was always massive, and the toilet situation was a bit of a pain in the hole, they shut off the urinals on the Friday night which meant having to join a huge queue. 

THe music was still great and I love the drag queens, but I didn't enjoy it as much as in previous years, so didn't bother going back on Saturday at all

I think with all of the hype,  a lot of people feel that they have to go there to see, so they queue, stay for half an hour and then leave, saying "I don't get it", and I definitely felt there was more of that than ever this year.  

If you don't like House music or Disco music then I don't see why you would bother personally. Its like me queuing for half an hour to get into the acoustic tent and then complaining that its all people with guitars.

 

 

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8 minutes ago, Keithy said:

To be honest, having read all the threads on here and seen your many posts, I'm really struggling to see what you get out of Glastonbury or even if you understand the festival at all. You're either (a) a very dedicated poster who takes up a 'traditional conservative' approach for shits and giggles or (b) someone who has previously seen Glasto through the narrow BBC coverage, thought the whole site was like the gentle, safe environment of the Pyramid stage and are outraged that left politics dominate and non mainstream life areas exist or (c) you really are a fun sponge.

If it's (a) then whilst I'd admire the commitment, the faux outrage is getting a bit tiring now.

If it's (b) then Glasto has done it's 'job' of opening peoples minds to alternatives lifestyles and political opinions. You might not like or agree with them or what goes on but that's your problem not Glastonbury's. You seem genuinely shocked that an openly gay venue, specifically designed to replicate a gritty 80's NYC venue and specifically built to provide a space for gay people, is doing exactly that. Have a read about the idea behind it - https://www.residentadvisor.net/features/2778.

If it's (c) then to be honest, you're probably better off going to another festival as you don't come across as particularly enjoying what Glastonbury represents. The idea you should get a reduction in the fee was particularly comical.

 

You have strong opinions on NYCD despite apparently not going. The 'dicks out' on entry was an alternative to paying the £2 entrance fee, similar to Snakepit's 'get your tattoo out or pay'. Nobody was forced to do it, it's part of the fun. And I'd argue that if you're good humoured enough and comfortable with 'getting it out' for some strangers then in the context of an openly gay nightclub where you've just got your dick out for entry it's odd to suddenly feel humiliated or violated if they then 'cop a feel'. I don't for a minute believe it was done in an sexual aggressive way and not heard or seen anything to suggest otherwise.

Glastonbury exists for everyone. 

really ???  all I can say is you have a different morality code to me...  I went to the festival for the first time this year.  I didn't find it overtly political apart from the obvious.

 

I went for a few days break and to see a few good bands.. nothing more nothing less.  I think that door policy that a few were subjected to was at best in really bad taste .

I'm sorry for those that felt upset by it especially if they didn't know and some due to influence may have been coerced into going .

I'm not sure what this area was hoping to achieve apart from shock value which to me is a bit low and this sort of behaviour which allegedly happened elsewhere was totally met with outrage.  Why is it different just because it was LGBT ?. My perception from the few people I know did not condone it either 

 

Some people regard GF can do no wrong , it's a music and beer fest to a lot of people certainly those that I know who go frequently  not trying to get their minds altered, opened or whatever.

The statement that it was for charity could anyone who went say what charity it was for and how much was raised ??

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4 minutes ago, babyblade41 said:

 

The statement that it was for charity could anyone who went say what charity it was for and how much was raised ??

From this article: http://mixmag.net/feature/block9s-nyc-downlow-might-just-be-the-best-festival-arena-on-the-planet 

The £2 every Downlow clubber pays for a stick-on moustache has raised £57,000 for causes close to Block9’s heart over the last decade, such as Médecins Sans Frontières, the Human Dignity Trust and the Mother Of Mercy HIV AIDS hospice in Zambia.

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3 minutes ago, babyblade41 said:

really ???  all I can say is you have a different morality code to me...  

My moral code is strongly based around not judging others for how they enjoy themselves (within reason) and not getting wound up by things that have absolutely nothing to do with me.

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5 minutes ago, babyblade41 said:

The statement that it was for charity could anyone who went say what charity it was for and how much was raised ??

https://thenycdownlow.com/about-the-nyc-downlow/

Moustaches Save Lives

www.thenycdownlow.com is managed by The Downlow Radio – a charitable limited company which raises money for good causes through the sharing of music. Income streams include (but are not limited to):

The collection of donations (and the giving of stick-on moustaches) at The NYC Downlow

The sale of merchandise online and at live events

Online advertising

Since 2007 more than £63,000 has been given to good causes including:

Vision Zambia – For the The Mother of Mercy, a Zambian HIV/AIDS hospice and orphanage.

Medecins Sans Frontieres – Providing medical aid where it is needed most

Human Dignity Trust – Challenging legislation that criminalises consensual sexual activity between same sex adults in West Africa, West Indies & Caribbean

HIV AIDS Alliance – Advancing combination HIV prevention

Disasters Emergency Committee – Helping those impacted by disaster around the world

Sexual Minorities Uganda – SMUG advocates for the protection and promotion of human rights of Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual and Transgender Ugandans

Sea Watch – Rescuing refugees and migrants attempting to cross the Mediterranean Sea

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