Most 'overbooked' headliner

[strummer77]

5 hours ago, CaledonianGonzo said:

Any specific examples?

Well Radiohead was a good example around me to begin. People chatting away loudly and the odd person complaining about song choices - at this point they had played two off OK Computer out of the first four, and went on to play almost all the big songs. I had to move away because it was so distracting. That said I think the fact headliners now start in daylight doesn't help  either.

Also know people who had it with others - notably Arcade Fire who were mentioned here - although I was in a good place myself.

But the point really was that if Arcade Fire weren't 'big' enough to headline then we really do have a problem because we're going to be struggling for acts big enough soon.

Edited January 23, 2018 by strummer77

[CaledonianGonzo]

I'd say Arcade Fire were big enough  No-one in the booking team could know that they were soon to deliver two turkeys in a row.

As for Radiohead, I dunno if previous big  headline bookings have much to do with half of their audience growing restless and wandering off.

[dentalplan]

1 hour ago, CaledonianGonzo said:

As for Radiohead, I dunno if previous big  headline bookings have much to do with half of their audience growing restless and wandering off.

Radiohead were never keeping that crowd though. Such a massive number were there to say they’ve seen them and when it turned out they didn’t actually give a shit, they started making their own fun.

More contemporary headliners playing when they should have headlined rather than twenty years later and you’ve got acts that people actively listen to or won’t be arsed about not seeing. Improved atmosphere at the expense of the fantasy fest bucket list bonanza.

This probably isn’t strummer’s point but I get carried away.

[CaledonianGonzo]

But if the fantasy bucket list headliners actually deliver a set that people want to see then it's a best of both worlds scenario.

[strummer77]

39 minutes ago, dentalplan said:

Radiohead were never keeping that crowd though. Such a massive number were there to say they’ve seen them and when it turned out they didn’t actually give a shit, they started making their own fun.

More contemporary headliners playing when they should have headlined rather than twenty years later and you’ve got acts that people actively listen to or won’t be arsed about not seeing. Improved atmosphere at the expense of the fantasy fest bucket list bonanza.

This probably isn’t strummer’s point but I get carried away.

Links to my point. There's a lot of people going to these 'big' headliners, in the broad daylight, hearing a few songs and then getting restless. People are expecting a Blur or a Rolling Stones calibre headliner every time. If big bands like Radiohead aren't given room to breathe by lots then I wonder how the next generation of headliners are going to fare? Certainly as we run out of the bands who have these huge back catalogues of huge hits.

27 minutes ago, CaledonianGonzo said:

But if the fantasy bucket list headliners actually deliver a set that people want to see then it's a best of both worlds scenario.

But my fear is there aren't many of these fantasy headliners left who haven't done it before, certainly outside of the pop acts. In terms of big bands, with wall to wall hits, who could headline... I can't really think of many? 

[CaledonianGonzo]

Guns n Roses, Madonna, Fleetwood Mac are three that spring to mind.

I honestly don't think Radiohead boring the arse off of a lot of people is symptomatic of much beyond the fact that it's been 20 years since they've released a universally popular jam that's reached beyond their own fanbase.

[eFestivals]

13 minutes ago, CaledonianGonzo said:

Radiohead boring the arse off of a lot of people

they balls-up with the screens. That alone would probably have been enough for many to have stayed.

Edited January 23, 2018 by eFestivals

[CaledonianGonzo]

It certainly wouldn't have helped.

I'm willing to concede that there's maybe been a wider shift in the culture - exacerbated by social media - where attention spans aren't what they once were.  40 years ago audiences would be more charitable towards a band like Floyd taking their time over things, whereas now oppening a headline set with a song like Daydreaming automatically places you on the back foot.

[giantkatestacks]

1 hour ago, CaledonianGonzo said:

Guns n Roses, Madonna, Fleetwood Mac are three that spring to mind.

 

Just made a small middle-aged sound of longing. I am officially Past it.

[nikkic]

3 hours ago, CaledonianGonzo said:

It certainly wouldn't have helped.

I'm willing to concede that there's maybe been a wider shift in the culture - exacerbated by social media - where attention spans aren't what they once were.  40 years ago audiences would be more charitable towards a band like Floyd taking their time over things, whereas now oppening a headline set with a song like Daydreaming automatically places you on the back foot.

That definitely plays a part. As well as the fact there is just so much on offer at the festival these days, you really don’t need to be spending time doing things that are boring you. 

 

[Amy Lawn]

5 hours ago, dentalplan said:

Radiohead were never keeping that crowd though. Such a massive number were there to say they’ve seen them and when it turned out they didn’t actually give a shit, they started making their own fun.

Radiohead not keeping their crowd was entirely their fault. Can't blame those outside the barriers for not enjoying the show when the band are giving the impression that they aren't playing it to them.

[Ohinever]

On 23/01/2018 at 12:44 AM, strummer77 said:

I’d be far more up for some of these bands mentioned who are ‘too small’. Increasingly many Pyramid headliners are getting worse atmospheres than they deserve because people expect wall to wall huge hits. Yes the bands should be big, but it doesn’t have to be karaoke throughout  

 

Disagree actually. I think at a festival, where by definition the crowd isn't yours, you should by and large stick to well known tunes. With your own crowd, in your own venue, you can play as many crap b sides as you want, and justifiably so. 

[strummer77]

21 hours ago, eFestivals said:

they balls-up with the screens. That alone would probably have been enough for many to have stayed.

I do think the screens were a big issue at the start in fairness. Posted about it a few times.

The set was pretty universal by the end and most reviews were great, but they did lose people there.

 

21 hours ago, CaledonianGonzo said:

It certainly wouldn't have helped.

I'm willing to concede that there's maybe been a wider shift in the culture - exacerbated by social media - where attention spans aren't what they once were.  40 years ago audiences would be more charitable towards a band like Floyd taking their time over things, whereas now oppening a headline set with a song like Daydreaming automatically places you on the back foot.

Yeah I think this was meant to be my point really. I worded it a bit strongly in a mood, but I think sometimes there is less breathing room. I think there are other problems though.

2 hours ago, Ohinever said:

Disagree actually. I think at a festival, where by definition the crowd isn't yours, you should by and large stick to well known tunes. With your own crowd, in your own venue, you can play as many crap b sides as you want, and justifiably so. 

I think a lot of this is because headlines sets are too long for almost all bands to play just hits. How many bands have 2.5 hours of hits? As much as I don't mind seeing say Radiohead do 2.5 hours, I don't think many casuals would know that much - even the Foos had to have Dave Grohl talking for half the set to fill it!

Start in the dark, have shorter sets, and if there's as many flags as Glastonbury: use the screens!

Edited January 24, 2018 by strummer77

[Fishman]

9 minutes ago, strummer77 said:

I think a lot of this is because headlines sets are too long for almost all bands to play just hits. How many bands have 2.5 hours of hits? As much as I don't mind seeing say Radiohead do 2.5 hours, I don't think many casuals would know that much - even the Foos had to have Dave Grohl talking for half the set to fill it!

Start in the dark, have shorter sets, and if there's as many flags as Glastonbury: use the screens!

An interesting article on the shorter festival set from last Spring ....

https://www.theguardian.com/music/2017/may/14/music-festivals-enormous-backlash-gigs

 

[Ohinever]

I used to joke about a "money shot" festival, where acts come on for half an hour, play their hits and go. 

[fatyeti24]

I'm all for shorter sets. I like the daytime 40-50 mins.  Headliners could do 60 or 75 tops. 

I'm not into standing there for two hours plus.  Get in, get it done, get off. 

[CaledonianGonzo]

Millennials with their Snapchat and their avocado toast and their short attention spans.

[strummer77]

2 hours ago, Fishman said:

An interesting article on the shorter festival set from last Spring ....

https://www.theguardian.com/music/2017/may/14/music-festivals-enormous-backlash-gigs

 

Interesting point but I didn't mean really short sets, just meant that two hours is probably enough for a huge headliner and 1.5 hours definitely enough in most cases. 

[maelzoid]

Looking at headliners in the 90s and saying they were over booked is ridiculous. The festival simply wasn't as big back then, either in physical size, attendance or cultural acumen.  The idea of stadium size bands going to Glastonbury or indeed any festival was just not considered, so you never would have had the likes of U2, Springsteen or GNR of whoever else was at that stage back then.

At the time, the Black Crowes were a totally credible headliner. Lenny was pushed up because RHCP dropped out but still nailed it.

[maelzoid]

7 hours ago, strummer77 said:

even the Foos had to have Dave Grohl talking for half the set to fill it!

...And end every single song with a 5-minute drum solo!

[parsonjack]

6 hours ago, CaledonianGonzo said:

Millennials with their Snapchat and their avocado toast and their short attention spans.

Lol....have an upvote 

[John the Moth]

On 1/25/2018 at 12:58 AM, Ohinever said:

I used to joke about a "money shot" festival, where acts come on for half an hour, play their hits and go. 

Some of the council run free festivals are just that. Godiva festival in Coventry is leading the way now, but I saw some great, really short sets at the now defunct rock stage at Birmingham’s Art Festival.

[shuttlep]

I know I will be hated for this

 

but Muse, they can fuck right off, warbling bastards. managed to miss every time they have played / headlined. wouldn't go to a gig with a free ticket let alone waste a night watching them in the rain

[russycarps]

On 1/22/2018 at 2:57 PM, dentalplan said:

Moby is someone you’d have to notice at the time to identify as a headliner. Saying that though, they need more overbookings (zeitgeisty shunts up the lineup) than overbookings in the other sense (repeats, legacy acts doing all the festivals, etc).

However, I can’t believe Skunk Anansie were ever big enough. They must’ve known where the bodies were buried.

Moby was absolutely massive though at the time. Every man and his dog bought Play. Although maybe he was a couple of years past his peak when he played (Play was out in the 90s wasnt it?)

I listened to the bootleg of that set recently. I adored it at the time, but I fear it might actually have been a bit rubbish. I sacrificed Doves for that tit too.

 

 

[dentalplan]

8 minutes ago, russycarps said:

Moby was absolutely massive though at the time. Every man and his dog bought Play. Although maybe he was a couple of years past his peak when he played (Play was out in the 90s wasnt it?)

I listened to the bootleg of that set recently. I adored it at the time, but I fear it might actually have been a bit rubbish. I sacrificed Doves for that tit too.

 

 

For sure. I think my dad had that album in the car even, and he’s never been a fan of dance music and has barely tolerated music at all in my lifetime.

It’s just by today’s standards they pulled the trigger too fast on him headlining, as when you look at headliners now - or the missteps detailed in this thread - they have to be with either the biggest names in pop or bands with at least a decade of headlining festivals under their belt else they’re nobodies.