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Are Tories welcome at Glastonbury

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17 minutes ago, T-Mouse said:

I'm beginning to see a pattern... Are Kaiser Chiefs essentially the right wing version of Billy Bragg?

I don't know their later stuff much but they always came off as more left wing in what they sang about. Mind you, their general style of deeply conservative trad rock might appeal to your average Tory more than Run the Jewels. 

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It's difficult to see why posters on here can't see the obvious contradictions of very wealthy people preaching to a well heeled audience about poverty.Everyone else does.

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3 minutes ago, Lad said:

It's difficult to see why posters on here can't see the obvious contradictions of very wealthy people preaching to a well heeled audience about poverty.Everyone else does.

:lol: Go on, why not explain those contradictions to us? You seem like such a smart chap after all, it'll be fascinating to hear your pearls of wisdom. I don't think "everyone else" shares your small minded views. Not by a long stretch. 

Can only poor people talk about poverty? Maybe only American people can talk about Donald Trump. Or maybe only black people can talk about black music. 

Of course a wealthy person can talk about poverty. Otherwise pretty much no politician would be able to talk about poverty, since they're all pretty much well off themselves. Maybe that's just the way you'd like it though.

And surely an audience that is largely "well heeled" as you put it should be exactly the audience that needs to hear about poverty? 

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11 hours ago, Mash011 said:

Check the replies to this on twitter if you want to see the kind of people you're all so keen to welcome to the festival!

Oddly there is also a David Wernick, from Wickford in Essex who is chairman of the Wernick group, which has an estimated worth of £110 million. The company supplies portable buildings to a range of trades including the festival industry, and previously supplied portable buildings to a certain Glastonbury festival. David Wernick has also appeared on a number of national political programmes.

Could only imagine how annoying it must be for a multi millionaire to be trying to enjoy a quiet weekend camping at Glasto with his mates, enjoying the music when a bloody Politician appears on stage  

I'm sure this is just coincidence though and there is no way the letter writer and this multi millionaire happen to share the same name and live in the same town on Essex

Edited by phil the shrew
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35 minutes ago, arcade fireman said:

:lol: Go on, why not explain those contradictions to us? You seem like such a smart chap after all, it'll be fascinating to hear your pearls of wisdom. I don't think "everyone else" shares your small minded views. Not by a long stretch. 

Can only poor people talk about poverty? Maybe only American people can talk about Donald Trump. Or maybe only black people can talk about black music. 

Of course a wealthy person can talk about poverty. Otherwise pretty much no politician would be able to talk about poverty, since they're all pretty much well off themselves. Maybe that's just the way you'd like it though.

And surely an audience that is largely "well heeled" as you put it should be exactly the audience that needs to hear about poverty? 

If you can't see the contradiction in very wealthy people giving lectures about poverty I can't help you.Look at like a drunkard preaching abstinence it might give you an insight.You're just yet another determined to believe what's fed to you.There's a difference in having a view on black music or prattling on about how Motown got it so wrong and heres how they could've been great.I'm  sure your advice to Chicago is invaluable and you could pass it on to the White House.

 

Are you saying that poverty was unknown until Corbyn and Eavis announced in the festival?Behave.

Cheers for the recognition of my wisdom though.If only they could all see it.:lol:

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41 minutes ago, phil the shrew said:

Oddly there is also a David Wernick, from Wickford in Essex who is chairman of the Wernick group, which has an estimated worth of £110 million. The company supplies portable buildings to a range of trades including the festival industry, and previously supplied portable buildings to a certain Glastonbury festival. David Wernick has also appeared on a number of national political programmes.

Could only imagine how annoying it must be for a multi millionaire to be trying to enjoy a quiet weekend camping at Glasto with his mates, enjoying the music when a bloody Politician appears on stage  

I'm sure this is just coincidence though and there is no way the letter writer and this multi millionaire happen to share the same name and live in the same town on Essex

It's not a well heeled audience though.:)

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2 minutes ago, Lad said:

Look at like a drunkard preaching abstinence it might give you an insight.

Or an idiot preaching wisdom. 

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2 minutes ago, Lad said:

If you can't see the contradiction in very wealthy people giving lectures about poverty I can't help you.Look at like a drunkard preaching abstinence it might give you an insight.You're just yet another determined to believe what's fed to you.There's a difference in having a view on black music or prattling on about how Motown got it so wrong and heres how they could've been great.I'm  sure your advice to Chicago is invaluable and you could pass it on to the White House.

 

Are you saying that poverty was unknown until Corbyn and Eavis announced in the festival?Behave.

Cheers for the recognition of my wisdom though.If only they could all see it.:lol:

You still haven't explained the contradiction. You're just saying you can't help me. This much is apparent. 

Actually a "drunkard" preaching abstinence would be of some value. Chances are they know how much more about how chronic alcoholism has destroyed their life than the average person. So not sure your analogy really works here. Also it's a logical fallacy, abstinence is someone saying "don't drink alcohol". Whereas Corbyn, a relatively wealthy MP isn't saying "don't earn money". Indeed he's not having a go at those who are on a good wage. He's just highlighting the plight of those less well off in our society. Isn't that what politicians ought to be doing? 

The sheer irony of a simpleton believing everything that's fed to him through the Tory press and telling others they believe what's fed to them is quite something. I've had lengthy arguments on here where I've criticised Corbyn at length, but you're the one believing whatever the Mail tells you. Everyone knows poverty exists, but unless you've grown up in it or live in it (neither of those apply to me but I see it the effects day in, day out in my job) then it's difficult to get a concept about its effects. 

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5 minutes ago, arcade fireman said:

You still haven't explained the contradiction. You're just saying you can't help me. This much is apparent. 

Actually a "drunkard" preaching abstinence would be of some value. Chances are they know how much more about how chronic alcoholism has destroyed their life than the average person. So not sure your analogy really works here. Also it's a logical fallacy, abstinence is someone saying "don't drink alcohol". Whereas Corbyn, a relatively wealthy MP isn't saying "don't earn money". Indeed he's not having a go at those who are on a good wage. He's just highlighting the plight of those less well off in our society. Isn't that what politicians ought to be doing? 

The sheer irony of a simpleton believing everything that's fed to him through the Tory press and telling others they believe what's fed to them is quite something. I've had lengthy arguments on here where I've criticised Corbyn at length, but you're the one believing whatever the Mail tells you. Everyone knows poverty exists, but unless you've grown up in it or live in it (neither of those apply to me but I see it the effects day in, day out in my job) then it's difficult to get a concept about its effects. 

If you think I read or take any notice of the mail you're a bit thick.Thats your default position when someone  dares to question your sacred cows.Theres not many politicians that I remember who've said you're skint and that's the way it should be.Is there?

 

The point of the drunkard is that nobody would listen to one who's just polished off a bottle of whisky and then waxed lyrical about the demons of drink.Its a nice earner and career path to show concern for the lower orders from a big house in Dorset? like some.

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22 minutes ago, MattDavies__ said:

Or an idiot preaching wisdom. 

If that's the case you'd be better logging off knobhead.

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8 minutes ago, Lad said:

If you think I read or take any notice of the mail you're a bit thick.Thats your default position when someone  dares to question your sacred cows.Theres not many politicians that I remember who've said you're skint and that's the way it should be.Is there?

 

The point of the drunkard is that nobody would listen to one who's just polished off a bottle of whisky and then waxed lyrical about the demons of drink.Its a nice earner and career path to show concern for the lower orders from a big house in Dorset? like some.

Actually I take the Mail reference back, your posts seem like they're lifted straight from the Sun letters page. Mail readers come across as being a little better educated for all their ignorance. My apologies.

What on earth do you think my "sacred cow" is? Go on, you made the reference so tell me what you think it is? Old Jezza? I can assure you he isn't my sacred cow, indeed I find the hero worship of him a bit weird as much as I would agree with a lot of what he said at the festival. 

No, your "drunkard" reference is still stupid. It might have been vaguely on point had he said anything whatsoever in his speech about the evils of owning one London property and having a well paid job. But there was absolutely nothing in his speech where he said that. Indeed the "drunkard" talking about the dangers of alcoholism is logically far closer to someone who is poor talking about the harms of poverty, not someone who is well off talking about poverty. Even then though it's not even comparable because it's a stupid analogy. 

Politicians can't talk about poverty according to your stupid rules - since almost all of them are well off. Who, then, is allowed to talk about poverty to big crowds in your book? Or should everyone just shut up about it and let those worse off in society just accept their lot? 

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1 hour ago, Lad said:

It's difficult to see why posters on here can't see the obvious contradictions of very wealthy people preaching to a well heeled audience about poverty.Everyone else does.

I'm not sure you understand what a contradiction is.

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=contradiction

I think you might have meant ironic

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=ironic

But in reality it's just more typical right wing bollocks. The left wing has no problem with anyone having money - the problems are with how they act and go about it. Someone can be a successful businessman and make a lot of money without abusing their workers and while paying them a decent wage, someone can be very rich and also dedicate their life and efforts to improving other's lots - none of these things are contradictory at all.
It's just pathetic - because you've no decent argument against the points made instead you're attacking the person making them and their right to say anything in what is known as an "ad hominem" fallacy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ad_hominem

Crawl back under your rock.

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1 hour ago, arcade fireman said:

I don't know their later stuff much but they always came off as more left wing in what they sang about. Mind you, their general style of deeply conservative trad rock might appeal to your average Tory more than Run the Jewels. 

their fifth LP was an anti-war concept album and the bassist is always banging on about Corbyn

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53 minutes ago, Lad said:

It's not a well heeled audience though.:)

That makes the assumption the letter writer was actually in the audience at all. 

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1 hour ago, Lad said:

If you can't see the contradiction in very wealthy people giving lectures about poverty I can't help you.Look at like a drunkard preaching abstinence it might give you an insight.You're just yet another determined to believe what's fed to you.There's a difference in having a view on black music or prattling on about how Motown got it so wrong and heres how they could've been great.I'm  sure your advice to Chicago is invaluable and you could pass it on to the White House.

 

Are you saying that poverty was unknown until Corbyn and Eavis announced in the festival?Behave.

Cheers for the recognition of my wisdom though.If only they could all see it.:lol:

Lol u iz well fik Ennit fam

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3 minutes ago, T-Mouse said:

Lol u iz well fik Ennit fam

Fam?That's what we call glorhunters for LFC.Either that or Vanilla  Ice is back.Typical posh boys they all squeal like pigs when they're not the ones giving out the stick.:lol:

 

30 minutes ago, frostypaw said:

I'm not sure you understand what a contradiction is.

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=contradiction

I think you might have meant ironic

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=ironic

But in reality it's just more typical right wing bollocks. The left wing has no problem with anyone having money - the problems are with how they act and go about it. Someone can be a successful businessman and make a lot of money without abusing their workers and while paying them a decent wage, someone can be very rich and also dedicate their life and efforts to improving other's lots - none of these things are contradictory at all.
It's just pathetic - because you've no decent argument against the points made instead you're attacking the person making them and their right to say anything in what is known as an "ad hominem" fallacy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ad_hominem

Crawl back under your rock.

I'm glad you didn't stoop to attacking the person.:D

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4 minutes ago, Lad said:

I'm glad you didn't stoop to attacking the person.:D

Apart from a guess about where you usually live where did I do that? Otherwise great refutation, put all those points to bed.

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Personally I'd say the ability to pay our MP's well would be a sign of a well functioning system. Were it not for all the poverty. 

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5 minutes ago, frostypaw said:

Apart from a guess about where you usually live where did I do that? Otherwise great refutation, put all those points to bed.

So crawl back under your rock is a term of endearment.:DYou don't have any idea of what you're going on about .

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As a left leaning person it sometimes frustrates me how confrontational people with otherwise similar views can be (personally I don't see that as the way to win people over) However I saw no abuse of tories at any point, the corbyn speech, radiohead mentioning Theresa, Jeremy corbyn song etc.

I wore a labour t-shirt on the first day and a guy looked at me incredulously and said 'for the many not the few mate' in an aggressive tone. I replied yes politely and carried on having a lovely old time. 

Tories are welcome, no abuse is welcome. The festival has political roots and I enjoyed seeing them being celebrated this year like they hadn't for a while. It is unfortunate for tories that the best large UK music festival is directly against their politics but it can easily be respectfully ignored... or they can go to other festivals.

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44 minutes ago, Lad said:

So crawl back under your rock is a term of endearment.:D 

Nope, but I didn't use that as a reason to ignore your argument so it's irrelevant here. Anyway let's not needlessly prolong this, you clearly have no actual comeback.

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30 minutes ago, DJL said:

. It is unfortunate for tories that the best large UK music festival is directly against their politics but it can easily be respectfully ignored... or they can go to other festivals.

Well it's their own party's fault. No sympathy.

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8 hours ago, frostypaw said:

I'm not sure you understand what a contradiction is.

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=contradiction

I think you might have meant ironic

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=ironic

But in reality it's just more typical right wing bollocks. The left wing has no problem with anyone having money - the problems are with how they act and go about it. Someone can be a successful businessman and make a lot of money without abusing their workers and while paying them a decent wage, someone can be very rich and also dedicate their life and efforts to improving other's lots - none of these things are contradictory at all.
It's just pathetic - because you've no decent argument against the points made instead you're attacking the person making them and their right to say anything in what is known as an "ad hominem" fallacy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ad_hominem

Crawl back under your rock.

I was giving up on this thread as a refuge for blinkered fuckwits but this is actually quite sensible; nice one @frostypaw

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12 hours ago, arcade fireman said:

Tony Benn was from the aristocracy 

Not true Tony Benns father was an MP who was elevated to the house of lords in 1942 as a viscount, a hereditary title.  On his fathers death he inherited the title and was barred from being an MP. He had to fight to change the law to renounce his title.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tony_Benn

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3 minutes ago, alanr said:

Not true Tony Benns father was an MP who was elevated to the house of lords in 1942 as a viscount, a hereditary title.  On his fathers death he inherited the title and was barred from being an MP. He had to fight to change the law to renounce his title.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tony_Benn

You've just said "not true" and yet explained that Tony Benn's father was a hereditary viscount thus proving he was from the aristocracy. Tony Benn's grandfather was a Baronet. You don't get that much more aristocratic than where Tony Benn came from.

It shouldn't diminish his politics at all, but despite him renouncing his title he was still from an aristocratic family. 

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