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Are Tories welcome at Glastonbury


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27 minutes ago, Watergirl said:

I am a big Frank fan but was never fond of that song either ('Glory hallelujah').  I couldn't bring myself to sing the chorus, which was awkward as I do front row quite a bit.  He has now finally dropped it out off his set, after playing it for about five years!

Oh he has? Super news :D just always found it crosses the line into 'smug w*nker' territory which he normally does well at not doing.

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Kingpin, 

a decent education helps. So if the Conservative party could start funding schools properly and providing the right platform for schools to prosper then perhaps even more children from all backgrounds might be able to meet their full potential or at least have a fighting chance.

Edited by adjwholovesmusic
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`It is a pity as Tory supporters prob make up a massive proportion of the Glasto festival goers,`

if your not a troll your a fucking idiot........ps respect breeds tolerance I dont respect the tory party and ill be tolerant towards members of the tory party and their supporters when they stop fucking up my country and my kids futures. as explained many many times before. 

You want to talk tolerance? my local tory mps son is currently under investigation for assault for attacking people who questioned his mother at a local hustings, the same mp by the way who basically slandered anyone in her constituency who opposed her as marxist loving thugs....... another local tory to this region is the one heard talking about `ni**ers` in a woodpile and she hasnt even been sacked from the party for such a disgustingly backwards racial slur which says all that it needs to.

as others have said we have gone `far` past `tolerance` people have been tolerant of the tory party for to fucking long and look where its gotten us.

As for Glastonbury its widely known the fest has a left wing political side to it....if you go to the festival and get offended by that then I have to ask why are you coming to the festival? its been that way for a long time mate why should it change for you?  For the record ive been going since 2013 and other then corbyn being on stage I havnt seen any `more` political presence then I have any other years, youve always had the green side of things, always had a cnd presence, always had an anti tory feeling to a point........fuck me good job you didnt come in 2016 and see the anger after the brexit vote youd have been even more offended, bless :P

Edited by waterfalls212434
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2 hours ago, eFestivals said:

No one is expected to have an interest in all subjects. If a topic isn't for you, the clue is normally in the title.

Normally is the key word there!

I know I'm going to regret sticking my oar in here, but it's a conversation I had with my wife quite recently. We were discussing luck vs hard work as it applied to us, and my take on it was that luck, providence, good fortune, whatever you want to call it meant that:

I was born into one of the wealthiest and most developed countries in the world

I was born into a family that wasn't excatly wealthy but always provided a stable environment, a roof over my head, food on the table, and a lot of love.

I have parents who have always had a very strong work ethic, a pretty solid sense of right and wrong, and valued education.  They did their utmost to drill those things into me, and they did a pretty good job of it.

I was born with a pretty decent brain.  I've never found learning particularly difficult, and I've been able to do most things I set my mind to. My parents worked bloody hard to be able to support me through university, and I went just as tuition fees were starting to be a thing, so it was still manageable.

Those are all things over which I had absolutely no control, so they can only be put down to luck on my part. I'm lucky to have been born with all of the above, which created a world full of opportunity.

What I've then done with those opportunities is down to me and the choices I've made.  I worked hard at school and worked summers, holidays and weekends to get the grades and the cash to make it to the university I wanted to go to. I worked hard enough (!) at university to get a reasonable degree.  I've worked hard since then to earn a decent salary and buy a house. Go me.

But I always try to remember that had any of the circumstances I was dropped into through no effort or choice of my own been different, things could have been very different for me.  So yeah, I've earned what I've got, but I'm always fucking grateful for the good fortune that put me down that road.

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3 minutes ago, Quark said:

Normally is the key word there!

I know I'm going to regret sticking my oar in here....

Not with me. I personally disagree with none of that. I agree that there's loads of luck (for some people anyway - such as you and I), and I agree that people 'make their own luck' too, to add extra benefit on top.

It's the first bit of 'luck' that needs addressing the most, so that everyone has a wealth of opportunities open to them. For what they do from there, I'm happy for people to 'make their own luck' to a significant degree, as it will be less of the "I'm here because of the luck of my starting point" than is the case currently, and more based on actual merit.

 

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22 minutes ago, waterfalls212434 said:

`It is a pity as Tory supporters prob make up a massive proportion of the Glasto festival goers,`

if your not a troll your a fucking idiot........ps respect breeds tolerance. ill be tolerant towards members of the tory party and their supporters when they stop fucking up my country and my kids futures. as explained many many times before. 

You want to talk tolerance? my local tory mps son is currently under investigation for assault for attacking people who questioned his mother at a local hustings, the same mp by the way who basically slandered anyone in her constituency who opposed her as marxist loving thugs....... another local tory to this region is the one heard talking about `ni**ers` in a woodpile and she hasnt even been sacked from the party for such a disgustingly backwards racial slur which says all that it needs to.

as others have said we have gone `far` past `tolerance` people have been tolerant of the tory party for to fucking long and look where its gotten us.

And I know I'm going to regret this, but .....

I agree with you.

In many ways I do, I know exactly where you're coming from. But anger and intolerance is not the way to a better society, that's the way to a bitter society.

For Glastonbury, I very much want tories to be welcome - because exposing them to things which they've not experienced before stands the chance of altering their view points, and more-so than calling them a c**t does.

Edited by eFestivals
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24 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

And I know I'm going to regret this, but .....

I agree with you.

In many ways I do, I know exactly where you're coming from. But anger and intolerance is not the way to a better society, that's the way to a bitter society.

For Glastonbury, I very much want tories to be welcome - because exposing them to things which they've not experienced before stands the chance of altering their view points, and more-so than calling them a c**t does.

Well based on this thread it doesn't.

It just makes them moan about how Glastonbury should change to suit their political opinion.

Fuck that, go be a tory at some other festival. Might I recommend V fest? Middle of the road pop music made solely to make money with no artistic integrity at all complete with other fantastic ways to fleece you out of your money (no set times released in advance, only way to find out is buying a lanyard there etc). Completely money orientated

Sounds like a conservative heaven.

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2 minutes ago, jonodillieono said:

Might I recommend V fest? Middle of the road pop music made solely to make money with no artistic integrity at all complete with other fantastic ways to fleece you out of your money (no set times released in advance, only way to find out is buying a lanyard there etc). Completely money orientated

Seriously?!

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40 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

For Glastonbury, I very much want tories to be welcome - because exposing them to things which they've not experienced before stands the chance of altering their view points, and more-so than calling them a c**t does.

That, exactly THAT. Teach them not allienate them.

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9 minutes ago, jonodillieono said:

Well based on this thread it doesn't.

It just makes them moan about how Glastonbury should change to suit their political opinion.

I think that's slightly unfair on this topic. This topic is here for anyone to comment in, and (the OP aside) they're possibly expressing things that wouldn't be said if this topic wasn't here discussing it.

 

9 minutes ago, jonodillieono said:

Fuck that, go be a tory at some other festival. Might I recommend V fest? Middle of the road pop music made solely to make money with no artistic integrity at all complete with other fantastic ways to fleece you out of your money (no set times released in advance, only way to find out is buying a lanyard there etc). Completely money orientated

Sounds like a conservative heaven.

In many ways I don't disagree with you, but tories can like <insert favour band here> too, and anyway, if we're not trying to broaden people's minds so they might (in our opinion) be better informed, how are we going to change anyone's mind so that things might be better?

 

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2 hours ago, elias said:

I think the clue is in your last line. 'A long time'. I get the feeling many of the posters in this thread will not have been around in the 80's when the festival was something very different to what it is now.
Festival going back then was for those on the (left leaning) edges of society rather than the mainstream or at least Glastonbury was. Politics was interwoven into the very fabric of the festival. It might have become lessened over time, but surely we don't have to lose it altogether? Glastonbury has ALWAYS been about much more than music.

Personally I don't care if you voted Tory - attend and have a great time, but please don't expect the festival to change because you don't like its politics.

Out of rep points unfortunately. I haven't read all of this thread but I don't think anyone has said the festival needs to change. However, I do think the vast majority of the people who now attend do so purely because its a music and art festival and not for it's political content.  You could remove politics completely from the festival and it would still sell out every year (although it would a lesser festival as a result). 

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1 hour ago, Quark said:

Seriously?!

Yep, V fest was my first festival experience. I was stood in the queue, saw people walking up and down selling the lanyards - bought one (think it was a bloody tenner) only to realise when I got in that I had bought an unofficial one and all the times were wrong! 

 

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7 hours ago, eFestivals said:

Oh, FFS. :rolleyes:

You said...
It's strange - how did we once afford students at all? 

I said
by having 80% less of them, and sending that other 80% out to do productive work that benefits the wealth of the country as well as tax revenues...?

You said
Though why you'd imagine a business that's capable of being profitable in private hands is incapable of being profitable in public hands mystifies me.

I said
Erm ... income from outside sources?  
A self-funding enterprise can never be a profitable enterprise.

You said
I think you're a bit confused Neil - being publicly owned doesn't mean you can't charge people for a thing. Obviously.

Etc, etc, etc. :rolleyes:

I pointed out that we afforded students in the past by having far fewer students. 

Where does "a business that's capable of being profitable in private hands is incapable of being profitable in public hands" come in to anything I said, apart from in your own imagination?

Go on, clear up my confusion by telling me where I'm confused. :)

 

Totally agree.

 

If 5% of people go to University and study "proper" subjects then we can avoid tuition fees.

 

If 50% of people go to "University" and study Coronation Street studies, we cannot (and should not) avoid tuition fees.

 

Not a difficult concept to grasp.

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48 minutes ago, Zac Quinn said:

According to my Mum he told her to vote for Theresa May. 

Next time, stand outside her room at night and say "vote Labour" in a suitably God like voice.*

 

 

*He sounds like Keith Richards. 

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8 hours ago, babyblade41 said:

that's all well and good but my priority will always be to my children above anything else and they would rather have me alive rather than a stress related heart attack due to ongoing health issues in that dept. Dr's told me I'd be dead within 5 years if I didn't slow down. 

Fair enough. Now can't you acknowledge that other people might also have health issues and have to stop but were unlucky enough to have them when they were younger, so didn't get to build a big private pension to live off? What are they meant to do? Indeed, what is someone in your situation who doesn't have the money meant to do? Die? 

4 hours ago, Watergirl said:

I am a big Frank fan but was never fond of that song either ('Glory hallelujah').  I couldn't bring myself to sing the chorus, which was awkward as I do front row quite a bit.  He has now finally dropped it out off his set, after playing it for about five years!

That's the point of the song though, it's a worship song for atheists. Though my atheism doesn't stop me singing along with Christmas carols either...

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The biggest issue I have with a lot on here is the binary nature of their arguments.

In actual fact most, if not all, our political views are shades of grey.  One might have a view that is considered "left wing", another that is considered "right wing".

One might have a perfectly sensible personal reason for holding a particuar view, another might have a deeply illogical reason for holding a counter view.  Does the illogical reason hold favour with the reader just because it may coincide with theirs?

 

Tory Scum, Lefitie Scum.  Tells you more about the poster than those that they wish to label.

 

Views and opinions will often differ depending upon circumstance.

For example there is no doubt that I would have been a Labour supporter (or at the very least a reforming Liberal) in 1900.  The situation that miners faced was disgusting (in my opinion of course.  Others might have found it acceptable, but that is their right and it's not for me to judge).   On this policy alone I would have found myself  campaigning against the "Tories".

 

Fast forward 100 years and things have changed enough for me not to consider voting Labour.  The safety issues which would have compelled me to vote Labour are long gone.  There is universal education, universal health care and the very poorest in society are more likely to die of over eating than malnutrition.  

For me that change in circumstance is enough to swing my vote away from Labour.  For others it might take a little more, for some it would take a lot more.  The point is this is a grey area, not black and white.

 

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12 minutes ago, Teddington said:

Totally agree.

 

If 5% of people go to University and study "proper" subjects then we can avoid tuition fees.

 

If 50% of people go to "University" and study Coronation Street studies, we cannot (and should not) avoid tuition fees.

 

Not a difficult concept to grasp.

Graduate tax. Let everyone pay for their university education, but only in retrospect. More students means you make more in the future, so can fund more students.

Don't saddle people with debt, saddle them with an obligation to help others in the future. 

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14 minutes ago, DeanoL said:

Graduate tax. Let everyone pay for their university education, but only in retrospect. More students means you make more in the future, so can fund more students.

Don't saddle people with debt, saddle them with an obligation to help others in the future. 

You do know that that's how the current system works right?

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