Your (potentially) Contraversial Changes to Glasto

[DeanoL]

4 minutes ago, GrumpyRaver said:

Mixing up two different strands of debate here, aren't you?  That was in response to the 'all late night areas are dance areas' bollocks.  My opposition to a blanket 3am finish comes from not being boring and wanting to actually have some fun for as much of the short time I'm on the Farm every year.  And the fact that there isn't a decent club in the land that closes at 3am.

Well if you're defining "late night" as after 3am then it is all dance music.

Obviously with what I suggested you'd also start the Pyramid an hour earlier to compensate for finishing an hour earlier, so you'd get the exact same amount of entertainment, just shifted back a bit. Although yes, that was all based on assuming Shangri-la wraps up at 5am. If it carries on after then it doesn't apply.

6 minutes ago, GrumpyRaver said:

ALSO, do that mean that Kanye was a total waste of time too and shouldn't have been let near the Pyramid?

Yes. Although Kanye did have a live band, they just were just hidden away.

44 minutes ago, GrumpyRaver said:

AND when exactly did main stages finish at 1am?  Not in my memory...

Back before the SE corner was a thing. If you check the 2004 timings you'll see the Pyramid headliners didn't start until nearly 11pm and certainly didn't only do an hour. https://www.theguardian.com/music/2004/jun/01/glastonbury2004.glastonbury1 - it might not have 1am every night but it was in that 12.30-1am range back before the license changed.

[rpfranks]

Just now, eastynh said:

Jamie XX is a dj and he is not getting prime spots on main stages at Glastonbury.

Technically he just subbed Radiohead.

[GrumpyRaver]

3 minutes ago, eastynh said:

You ignored the part where i said I am all for giving Grime it's spot. 

Yeh, because you followed it up with that.  That's like saying "I'm not homophobic, but..."

[The Nal]

14 minutes ago, GrumpyRaver said:

Well, yes... I get ya. It was more of a point about whether people who use backing tracks should be banished though rather than any specific endorsement of Yeezy's Pyramid breakdown

I'd love to see Sleaford Mods on the Pyramid some day.

[GrumpyRaver]

5 minutes ago, DeanoL said:

Well if you're defining "late night" as after 3am then it is all dance music.

I'm not defining late night as after 3am.

 

5 minutes ago, DeanoL said:

Obviously with what I suggested you'd also start the Pyramid an hour earlier to compensate for finishing an hour earlier, so you'd get the exact same amount of entertainment, just shifted back a bit. Although yes, that was all based on assuming Shangri-la wraps up at 5am. If it carries on after then it doesn't apply.

I don't really understand what you're suggesting, but why on earth would i want to wake up an hour earlier everyday?  I struggle enough to get to the early stuff I want to see as it is...  Also, comparing what happens 11am on the Pyramid stage with what happens at 4am in NYCDL is crazy.  They are obviously totally different experiences.  I like them both, and want to have them both and there is absolutely no reason why that shouldn't happen.

5 minutes ago, DeanoL said:

Back before the SE corner was a thing. If you check the 2004 timings you'll see the Pyramid headliners didn't start until nearly 11pm and certainly didn't only do an hour. https://www.theguardian.com/music/2004/jun/01/glastonbury2004.glastonbury1 - it might not have 1am every night but it was in that 12.30-1am range back before the license changed.

None of those sets on the Other Stage in 2004 went on long after midnight.  You're gonna have to produce more than that to convince me this isn't just a figment of your imagination.

[GrumpyRaver]

9 minutes ago, rpfranks said:

Technically he just subbed Radiohead.

Somebody please upvote this man.

[DeanoL]

2 minutes ago, GrumpyRaver said:

I don't really understand what you're suggesting, but why on earth would i want to wake up an hour earlier everyday?  I struggle enough to get to the early stuff I want to see as it is...  Also, comparing what happens 11am on the Pyramid stage with what happens at 4am in NYCDL is crazy.  They are obviously totally different experiences.  I like them both, and want to have them both and there is absolutely no reason why that shouldn't happen.

Because what's going on at 11am on the Pyramid would now be happening at 10am. And what's going on at 4am in NYCDL would now be happening at 3am. And you would be going to be an hour earlier so you'd be getting up an hour earlier. It's not that hard to fathom. The only difference is you'd see an hour's more daylight.

Quote

None of those sets on the Other Stage in 2004 went on long after midnight.  You're gonna have to produce more than that to convince me this isn't just a figment of your imagination.

Sure.

2004: Pyrmaid line-up showing Oasis coming on at 22:50: https://www.theguardian.com/music/2004/jun/01/glastonbury2004.glastonbury
Full Oasis set clocking in at 2 hours from live BBC broadcast: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Swrz5dWGVGM

 

 

[rpfranks]

Just now, DeanoL said:

Because what's going on at 11am on the Pyramid would now be happening at 10am. And what's going on at 4am in NYCDL would now be happening at 3am. And you would be going to be an hour earlier so you'd be getting up an hour earlier. It's not that hard to fathom. The only difference is you'd see an hour's more daylight.

Sure.

2004: Pyrmaid line-up showing Oasis coming on at 22:50: https://www.theguardian.com/music/2004/jun/01/glastonbury2004.glastonbury
Full Oasis set clocking in at 2 hours from live BBC broadcast: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Swrz5dWGVGM

 

 

Pyramid actually started at 10:30am and 10:45am this year. I don't want to be watching things at 9:30am on the Pyramid and I'm really not sure what kind of correlation you are trying to form by everything starting 1 hour early for the SE corner to close 1 hour earlier? Why does it bother you that much whether SE corner closes at 6, 5 or 4am?

[kh24]

.....anyway, getting back to thinking about changes, I've also been thinking about the Park. Hard to believe it's ten years old! That field is actually where I camped in my first year. I quite like the variety and 'self-contained' feel to the Park area - a bit of everything (actually for a few years it used to be quite a good compromise for our group for those who wanted to stay up but not necessarily for SE corner naughtiness).  As someone mentioned a few pages back, I have also been wondering how much longer the Rabbit Hole can claim to be all weird and 'quirky' seeing as everyone knows about it, and it also is pretty much fully programmed as a stage in its own right. I wouldn't be surprised if this is an area also earmarked for a bit of a refresher after reaching its milestone. As long as they keep a decent mix of things up there (stalls, different types of venues with different genres) I think this could be a good thing.

[DeanoL]

22 minutes ago, rpfranks said:

Pyramid actually started at 10:30am and 10:45am this year. I don't want to be watching things at 9:30am on the Pyramid and I'm really not sure what kind of correlation you are trying to form by everything starting 1 hour early for the SE corner to close 1 hour earlier? Why does it bother you that much whether SE corner closes at 6, 5 or 4am?

Because we were discussing how the SE corner relates to Silver Hayes, with both catering to late night dance, and the possibly of merging them, but if you did that at the current SH location you would be constrained by the current licensing times for that part of the site, which would be 3am finish. 

Edited June 30, 2017 by DeanoL

[GrumpyRaver]

29 minutes ago, DeanoL said:

Because we were discussing how the SE corner relates to Silver Hayes, with both catering to late night dance, and the possibly of merging them, but if you did that at the current SH location you would be constrained by the current licensing times for that part of the site, which would be 3am finish. 

Which shows exactly why it's such an awful idea...

[GrumpyRaver]

1 hour ago, rpfranks said:

Pyramid actually started at 10:30am and 10:45am this year. I don't want to be watching things at 9:30am on the Pyramid and I'm really not sure what kind of correlation you are trying to form by everything starting 1 hour early for the SE corner to close 1 hour earlier? Why does it bother you that much whether SE corner closes at 6, 5 or 4am?

Any correlation between Pyranid start time and SE finish time is totally unneccasary. Watching bands at 9:30 is frankly ridiculous. I go to bed at 3am on some wekknights when I'm just sat around at home - why would I want to finish my night before I want to at what's supposed to be the most fun place on Earth? Or have the camping chairs brigade won and we're just gonna totally sanitise the whole place? And I don't shell out hundreds of pounds to see more daylight...

Edited June 30, 2017 by GrumpyRaver

[GrumpyRaver]

59 minutes ago, DeanoL said:

 

Sure.

2004: Pyrmaid line-up showing Oasis coming on at 22:50: https://www.theguardian.com/music/2004/jun/01/glastonbury2004.glastonbury
Full Oasis set clocking in at 2 hours from live BBC broadcast: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Swrz5dWGVGM

 

 

I must have totally wiped the knowledge of that from my memory. Fair play.

[DeanoL]

13 minutes ago, GrumpyRaver said:

Which shows exactly why it's such an awful idea...

Which is the point of the thread!

[GrumpyRaver]

6 minutes ago, DeanoL said:

Which is the point of the thread!

Is it? I read cntroversial, not absolutely awful and pointless...

[eastynh]

1 hour ago, rpfranks said:

Technically he just subbed Radiohead.

I seen the XX mate. Now I was half cut but from what I remember he was using a pad style midi controller to trigger the drum loops and then triggering the samples from the controller to build up the tunes layer by layer. He was using the controller as an instrument. He was performing. That was worlds away from what Wiley was doing. He had his dj just pressing play. Now if Liam Gallagher had his brother Paul just pressing play on an Oasis cd and Liam sang over the top then people would have not been happy. Yet that would have been no different to what Wiley did.

Now I am not criticising Grime or saying that it should not be at the festival. What I am criticising is Wileys performance. He made zero effort what so ever to try and recreate his songs for the live environment. If I wanted to listen to a Wiley cd then I could have done that at home. I would not mind, he did not even remove the vocals from his backing tracks. Seriously whats the point?

[GrumpyRaver]

3 minutes ago, eastynh said:

I seen the XX mate. Now I was half cut but from what I remember he was using a pad style midi controller to trigger the drum loops and then triggering the samples from the controller to build up the tunes layer by layer. He was using the controller as an instrument. He was performing. That was worlds away from what Wiley was doing. He had his dj just pressing play. Now if Liam Gallagher had his brother Paul just pressing play on an Oasis cd and Liam sang over the top then people would have not been happy. Yet that would have been no different to what Wiley did.

Now I am not criticising Grime or saying that it should not be at the festival. What I am criticising is Wileys performance. He made zero effort what so ever to try and recreate his songs for the live environment. If I wanted to listen to a Wiley cd then I could have done that at home. I would not mind, he did not even remove the vocals from his backing tracks. Seriously whats the point?

I don't think you're target audience mate.

[eastynh]

1 hour ago, GrumpyRaver said:

Yeh, because you followed it up with that.  That's like saying "I'm not homophobic, but..."

I have no idea what you are talking about. I have not criticised Wileys music, Grime or the validity of Grime at Glastonbury. What I have criticised is Wileys performance. What I said is that if Wiley is not going to at least make some effort to recreate his music for the live environment then he should not get a peak time on a major stage at Glastonbury. Wiley made zero effort, he just had a bloke press play and he sang over his own recorded vocals. Now if any other artist was to do that then they imo should not get the opportunity to play on a major stage at Glastonbury.

Now if you can't comprehend what i am actually saying then it is utterly pointless us discussing music as you seem to have gone on one for absolutely no reason what so ever.

[GrumpyRaver]

Just now, eastynh said:

I have no idea what you are talking about. I have not criticised Wileys music, Grime or the validity of Grime at Glastonbury. What I have criticised is Wileys performance. What I said is that if Wiley is not going to at least make some effort to recreate his music for the live environment then he should not get a peak time on a major stage at Glastonbury. Wiley made zero effort, he just had a bloke press play and he sang over his own recorded vocals. Now if any other artist was to do that then they imo should not get the opportunity to play on a major stage at Glastonbury.

Now if you can't comprehend what i am actually saying then it is utterly pointless us discussing music as you seem to have gone on one for absolutely no reason what so ever.

I totally understand what you're saying, you just don't seem to have gone to a grime show before.

[eastynh]

2 minutes ago, GrumpyRaver said:

I totally understand what you're saying, you just don't seem to have gone to a grime show before.

Its not a grime show though mate, it is a major stage at Glastonbury. I would not go to a SHM gig or Creamfields and then moan if they just pressed play. I would not have moaned if Wiley had done his PA @ Arcadia. Yet for a main stage at Glastonbury I thought his performance was very poor. It would not be too difficult for him to make an effort to recreate his music for a live environment, yet he made zero effort. To not even remove the vocals on his backing tracks is shambolic.

[GrumpyRaver]

10 minutes ago, eastynh said:

Its not a grime show though mate, it is a major stage at Glastonbury. I would not go to a SHM gig or Creamfields and then moan if they just pressed play. I would not have moaned if Wiley had done his PA @ Arcadia. Yet for a main stage at Glastonbury I thought his performance was very poor. It would not be too difficult for him to make an effort to recreate his music for a live environment, yet he made zero effort. To not even remove the vocals on his backing tracks is shambolic.

It's a grime artist doing a show. It's a grime show.  Or are you going to start arguing that some genres don't belong at Glastonbury?

Edited June 30, 2017 by GrumpyRaver

[gfest2009]

Can't we all just get along??

[Penrhos]

5 minutes ago, GrumpyRaver said:

I totally understand what you're saying, you just don't seem to have gone to a grime show before.

And not many other people did either - I legged it from Ed at the Pyramid to the Other stage and the crowd for BBK barely reached back to the sound desk, hung around for "Shutdown" then legged it to West Holts to catch the end of Justice - There were more people at Justice.

Silver Hayes just doesn't work it needs a total revamp or scrapping. Put anyone good in "The Blues" and it becomes a total crush (Kolsh was a fine example this year). Sonic isn't great either.

What about just having the JP tent and BBC introducing in Silver Hayes and having Acoustic sets in the JP tent until 3AM? And moving Sonic and the silent disco to where the JP tent is currently located.

I was camped in Oxlers this year and the Spider looked fantastic as usual, Glade had a great lineup as did spaceport & lovebullets. but where was the big draw for Silver hayes? Fatboy Slim (Again....).

I'd love some "live" non-DJ music until the wee-small hours that didn't involve wading through piles of "clubbers" to get to it. Or even some ambient/chill out nights sometimes. 

 

Maybe I'm just old/unfit but this year's post headliner hangouts were the Engine room, Arcadia and the Glade complex. SE corner still felt stale mainly because of the music and people there not the creative ideas.

[GrumpyRaver]

8 minutes ago, gfest2009 said:

Can't we all just get along??

I'd love to. But I think the fact different types of music and shows are equally catered for and accepted is a pretty central pillar of Glastonbury.

[arcade fireman]

1 hour ago, GrumpyRaver said:

I'd love to. But I think the fact different types of music and shows are equally catered for and accepted is a pretty central pillar of Glastonbury.

I don't think it is. Indie rock and electro/dance have always been far more catered for than anything else. Whether you think that's right or not is your opinion, but different types of music being equally catered for is not a central pillar of Glastonbury.