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Oh no - another festival right after the election!


Wickedfaerie
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3 minutes ago, RichardWaller said:

Why are you unwilling to share your proof that Momentum are manipulating the bookies?

 

why do you expect me to be your political tutor? :rolleyes:

The info is out there. If you really care, you're presumably capable of finding it yourself. You'd be doing nothing different to what you expect me to do.

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1 minute ago, eFestivals said:

Yep. But that's my opinion where I'm coming from a different place to the person who appointed them.

But did the people who appointed them think them incompetent? Or did the people appointing them think them the most-competent for that role?

Only a moron would appoint someone to a job who they didn't feel was the best person for the job.

They don't appoint the biggest arse-licker, they appoint the person who is (ITO) the most competent for the role (and perhaps considered with how much of an arselicker they are, but not purely on arselicking).

It's competence before arselicking.

Like I said, it depends on what you think is competent. 

Can you save the NHS?

Can you demolish it?

Both are competent to someone.

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Just now, eFestivals said:

why do you expect me to be your political tutor? :rolleyes:

The info is out there. If you really care, you're presumably capable of finding it yourself. You'd be doing nothing different to what you expect me to do.

I'm expecting you to make your claims stand up. Is that unreasonable?

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2 minutes ago, RichardWaller said:

Like I said, it depends on what you think is competent. 

Can you save the NHS?

Can you demolish it?

Both are competent to someone.

can Jezza save the NHS?

To do so he has to transfer wealth from the rest of society towards the NHS.

Which requires everyone in society to give up things to instead be put towards the NHS.

Saying "i'll save the NHS" does none of that.

Can he persuade people to have less, to go towards the NHS instead? Not very well, not by enough.

So he can't save the NHS.

 

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2 minutes ago, RichardWaller said:

PM me, I want to know what the fuck your problem is.

You don't need a PM for me to tell you - again - that I have more important things than you to do, and that I think you're capable enough to find out things yourself once you've had some pointers about them to know they exist.

If you're not capable enough, that's fine, just say ... but that doesn't change what i'll deo, because if you're not that capable to find them yourself you won't be capable enough to understand what I'd find for you.

Now, shall we move on, and with you moving on to a bit of self responsibility too?

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Just now, eFestivals said:

You don't need a PM for me to tell you - again - that I have more important things than you to do, and that I think you're capable enough to find out things yourself once you've had some pointers about them to know they exist.

If you're not capable enough, that's fine, just say ... but that doesn't change what i'll deo, because if you're not that capable to find them yourself you won't be capable enough to understand what I'd find for you.

Now, shall we move on, and with you moving on to a bit of self responsibility too?

I thought you might've been a bit more civil and respectful in PM without showing off on here, that's all. 

Do you think burden of proof doesn't apply to you? Do you think nobody has the right to ask you for proof, and if they do it proves they're incapable of looking themselves? I think you're the most unreasonable person I've ever tried to have a reasoned debate with, you tell people they're saying things they're not, you deliberately misrepresent and then you get personal, talking about what you think of people's intelligence. It's pathetic.

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here's one for those who aren't capable of googling "momentum betting on Corbyn"

http://www.momentumhackney.com/news/50-days-work-labour-victory

Oh, but it's proven nothing, right? after all, it's just someone saying something. :rolleyes:

Then more intelligence is required, Are you clever enough for it, or does that need me too?

FFS. :lol:

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Just now, eFestivals said:

nothing to say about the evidence that was beyond your googling abilities?

I didn't try to find it, so why are you talking about abilities? 

Like I said aaaaaaages ago, I don't care if you're Corbyn, May, Fallon, any of the co-leaders of Greens, whoever's running UKIP these days, it's completely understandable that people will try to distort polls and odds in their favour in the hope it influences people to support them. Bit crafty and underhand mind, but that's politics. 

How about a bit of an olive branch, bit of respect, or are you going to carry on being antagonistic and condescending?

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8 minutes ago, RichardWaller said:

I didn't try to find it, so why are you talking about abilities? 

because you wanted mine instead of using your own. :rolleyes:

While claiming there was an obligation on my to prove what i'd said, yet you've been quite happy to work from zero evidence in dismissing what i've said.

 

8 minutes ago, RichardWaller said:

Like I said aaaaaaages ago, I don't care if you're Corbyn, May, Fallon, any of the co-leaders of Greens, whoever's running UKIP these days, it's completely understandable that people will try to distort polls and odds in their favour in the hope it influences people to support them. Bit crafty and underhand mind, but that's politics. 

it's also manipulating the facts because the real facts are too inconvenient.

You know, fact rejection. 

The line of morons, whether its the tories doing it or labour supporters.

 

8 minutes ago, RichardWaller said:

How about a bit of an olive branch, bit of respect, or are you going to carry on being antagonistic and condescending?

i can't respect sheep, not even served in a curry. :)

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1 hour ago, eFestivals said:

I don't have to convince you. You already know it.

And I'm not convincing anyone else either. There's those who reject evidence to go with faith-only who won't be convinced by me, and there's those who do do facts who are already convinced t5h4e same as me.

It changes nothing to speak the truth.

Those who speak the truth gain the credibility to perhaps convince people of Labour next time.

(just to be clear, that last line isn't a self-reference, but a comment about how those in the party machine who said Jezza would fail will be the ones who come thru in the future)

I think Jeremy has a shot. Not a great one but there's still a chance he rolls a natural 20.

But I do think it's damaging to perpetuate the idea it's a foregone conclusion because people will hear that and decide it isn't worth voting. I also think Labour should be supporting Jeremy unreservedly in this election, because in the likely circumstance he does lose, you need to leave no room for the "oh but his own party opposed him, they're responsible for us losing." And him wanting to stay on. 

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2 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

because you wanted mine instead of using your own. :rolleyes:

While claiming there was an obligation on my to prove what i'd said, yet you've been quite happy to work from zero evidence in dismissing what i've said.

I didn't dismiss anything, I was suspicious and asked for proof... They're different things, how can you still not get that?

Quote

it's also manipulating the facts because the real facts are too inconvenient.

You know, fact rejection. 

The line of morons, whether its the tories doing it or labour supporters.

You can see it that way. We're still talking about one poll and some odds at the bookies. I'm fuck all to do with Momentum and I don't know that many types either, are people turning around and saying this one poll is right, those fifty are wrong? If people are saying that, they're daft.

If people are saying oh look at these, he's more popular than you thought.. then that's more of an attempt of fact creation. And why not?

Quote

i can't respect sheep, not even served in a curry. :)

Boring.

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2 minutes ago, DeanoL said:

I think Jeremy has a shot. Not a great one but there's still a chance he rolls a natural 20.

didn't you agree above that if he won it would be because of external events and not anything to do with Jezza? I thought you had.

 

2 minutes ago, DeanoL said:

But I do think it's damaging to perpetuate the idea it's a foregone conclusion because people will hear that and decide it isn't worth voting.

because you're clever but everyone else is a sheep?

It's not a line I buy. I credit you with the intelligence to decide on your own vote for your own good reasons, and I credit everyone else with the same too.

 

2 minutes ago, DeanoL said:

I also think Labour should be supporting Jeremy unreservedly in this election

Like Jezza always supported Labour unreservedly...? :lol:

 

2 minutes ago, DeanoL said:

, because in the likely circumstance he does lose, you need to leave no room for the "oh but his own party opposed him, they're responsible for us losing." And him wanting to stay on. 

He's already made clear he's staying on.

That's how much of a c**t he is.

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