Two weeks on, is this the worst Glastonbury cleanup ever?

[J.B.]

From the Guardian: https://www.theguardian.com/music/shortcuts/2016/jul/10/two-weeks-on-is-this-the-worst-glastonbury-cleanup-ever?CMP=share_btn_tw

[stuartbert two hats]

Thread on video mentioned in article here:

 

[swede]

The link to the video from the Monday is shocking enough.  I'm not condoning the mess but as the festival has become more mainstream this is the nature of the people it attracts, people who don't understand the ethos of the festival and don't care that a festival that size has to be cleaned up afterwards and at the end of the day it's farmland.

Its out of sight out of mind mentality, people who don't give a thought to the mess once they're out of the gates and on the way home.

Me and the wife always take our tents ect home with us, rubbish gets bagged up on a Monday morning and put in the appropriate piles and the off chance we don't take things home we'll always put them in the bay's to recycle ect.

i think part of the respect for the place does come with being a regular and realising the effort that goes into making glasto an amazing place, I won't even litter and get mad if any of my group does, there's no need, bloody bins everywhere. 

 

[Nobody Interesting]

When you have some of the attitudes in the thread below then I think this sport of headline will only get more common!

 

[incident]

19 minutes ago, Nobody Interesting said:

When you have some of the attitudes in the thread below then I think this sport of headline will only get more common!

Wow - given that I assume that comment is at least partially directed at me, I have to ask - did you bother to actually digest the points being made, or just jump straight to conclusions? Because I can't see anyone claiming that leaving your shit behind is a good thing.

The point being made that you seem to be basing that statement on was my (and others) concern that that one particular potential approach to tackling the problem might be counterproductive and seen to sanction people leaving their stuff behind - ie by creating a "I'm paying for it, I can do what I want" attitude. Others have then said that it doesn't really seem to have that effect at Boomtown - I've not been so I'm happy to accept their word on that.

But I can't see anyone with the "attitude" that it's acceptable to leave shit behind. I'll absolutely stand by my own record on this at Glastonbury - I generate little waste, and dispose of it in the correct fashion as I go. By the time I get to the end of the Festival I'll take a few odds and ends to the disposal pen in the campsite, and my pitch is left entirely clear. Not just this year, but every festival this decade (I'll admit to not being perfect in the 00s).

[Nobody Interesting]

16 minutes ago, incident said:

Wow - given that I assume that comment is at least partially directed at me, I have to ask - did you bother to actually digest the points being made, or just jump straight to conclusions? Because I can't see anyone claiming that leaving your shit behind is a good thing.

The point being made that you seem to be basing that statement on was my (and others) concern that that one particular potential approach to tackling the problem might be counterproductive and seen to sanction people leaving their stuff behind - ie by creating a "I'm paying for it, I can do what I want" attitude. Others have then said that it doesn't really seem to have that effect at Boomtown - I've not been so I'm happy to accept their word on that.

But I can't see anyone with the "attitude" that it's acceptable to leave shit behind. I'll absolutely stand by my own record on this at Glastonbury - I generate little waste, and dispose of it in the correct fashion as I go. By the time I get to the end of the Festival I'll take a few odds and ends to the disposal pen in the campsite, and my pitch is left entirely clear. Not just this year, but every festival this decade (I'll admit to not being perfect in the 00s).

What is it they say, if the cap fits!

You do seem to have taken it very personally and if, as you are at pains to say, this is not you then why react in that way?

[incident]

1 minute ago, Nobody Interesting said:

What is it they say, if the cap fits!

You do seem to have taken it very personally and if, as you are at pains to say, this is not you then why react in that way?

Sorry but what? You've claimed people are saying something they didn't. Why shouldn't I respond to that?

[Nobody Interesting]

1 minute ago, incident said:

Sorry but what? You've claimed people are saying something they didn't. Why shouldn't I respond to that?

I have responded to that in the other thread by quoting what it was you said.

If you did not mean what you posted then maybe explain what you actually meant so I and others might understand?

[stuartbert two hats]

45 minutes ago, Nobody Interesting said:

I have responded to that in the other thread by quoting what it was you said.

If you did not mean what you posted then maybe explain what you actually meant so I and others might understand?

Have you not read all the other follow up posts explaining in painstaking detail what he meant? I even understood from the first post that @incident wasn't advocating leaving shit behind( use of conditional words like 'should' or 'could', he was suggesting that having a 'tidy up' deposit could have a counter productive effect. A plausible, if debatable point.

The cap might have looked like it fit initially, but didn't - as pretty much all his subsequent posts have shown.

[Calvin Klein]

I took all my stuff (tent, sleeping bags, bed, etc) from Buenos Aires to London to Glastonbury to London to Dorset, Glastonbury (Town), Cardiff, Dolgellau, Oxford and now I'm back home with all my stuff. How is it possible so many people can't be bothered'

[DeanoL]

1 hour ago, Nobody Interesting said:

I have responded to that in the other thread by quoting what it was you said.

If you did not mean what you posted then maybe explain what you actually meant so I and others might understand?

He was using an oratorial device to make a point and you let it sail right over your and instead decided to assume the worst in someone instead of making an effort to comprehend it.

Maybe you're actually the one missing some of the Glastonbury attitude of openness and acceptance? It's about far more than just not leaving litter.

[Spindles]

1 hour ago, stuartbert two hats said:

The cap might have looked like it fit initially, but didn't - as pretty much all his subsequent posts have shown.

This.  I understood the point being made and, to an extent agreed with it.  Some would take it as an excuse to not bother cleaning up (in the same way as many who just abandoned tents then went home and told people they 'donated them') as they might feel they have legitimately donated to charity and, as someone mentioned in the other thread, some were happy to give their bond over to others rather than bother themselves.

I'm all in favour of anything we can do to reduce waste and a discussion on that, but obviously that means admitting the weaknesses in worthwhile schemes as much as lauding them.

[grumpyhack]

Calm down gang.  I think we can all agree that leaving waste is not a good thing.  Similarly tidying up after you is a positive thing to do.

So the question is how to reduce waste and the amount of rubbish left behind.

One way might be to ban alcohol and all drugs from the site so we don't have a load of wasted people on Monday who just want to go home.  Another way would be to ban all rain from the site so people don't have to worry about wet and muddy things to take home.  We could make everyone travels by car with only one or two people in each vehicle to make sure there's enough space to take rubbish home.  The festival could be re-sited to a waste disposal dump so anything left behind is at least in the right place.

Unfortunately shit happens but that shouldn't prevent us from trying to stop it hitting the fans.

Seriously, I don't know what can be done to realistically cut the amount of waste and filth left behind.  This year, in theory, we had Worthy Warriors but half the stewards didn't seem to know about them. We've had the Green Police, who were great fun, Giais Guardians, Leave No Trace appeals in the programme and on the big screens.

It really saddens me to see the amount of rubbish left behind so any discussion about new approaches that might help has to be a good thing.

 

[Teddington]

Nothing to do with the "Ethos of the Festival", it's basic good manners.

How people  can leave stuff behind in a  field is beyond me.

[Tyonks]

Our campsite is always a fucking tip during the festival BUT we always clean everything and dispose of it at the end of the festival. Not hard really - even when you have a stinking hangover. 

[Gary]

The green tent on the far left past the white tent is some silly friends of mine.

[DeanoL]

50 minutes ago, Tyonks said:

Our campsite is always a fucking tip during the festival BUT we always clean everything and dispose of it at the end of the festival. Not hard really - even when you have a stinking hangover. 

Other people would consider your campsite being a tip during the festival an issue too - unpleasant for your neighbours, rubbish can and will blow away or get trampled into the ground...

People always seem to drawn the line at whatever they personally do, and don't tend to see other viewpoints.

Tons of posts bemoaning expensive tents left behind but then saying something like "I'd have taken it myself if I'd had the energy/time to take it down and get it to the car" - that can somehow comprehend the idea of not wanting to trudge a tent all the way back to a car, but can't comprehend someone else feeling that way about a tent they own.

[Tyonks]

2 minutes ago, DeanoL said:

Other people would consider your campsite being a tip during the festival an issue too - unpleasant for your neighbours, rubbish can and will blow away or get trampled into the ground...

Neighbours i've mingled with at various festivals have never appeared to have an issue, certainly never mentioned it when we have been chatting to them- but def see your point though.

I do believe though as long as your site is spotless when it comes to Monday (even crap that's been trampled into the ground) it allows for some leeway during the festival when you're a little.. worse for wear.   

[kalifire]

Did they have the Young Greens communities again this year? They had a few on Pennards Hill in 2015 and I thought they were a really good idea. They provided a sense of togetherness, actively encouraged tidiness and provided a safe environment. I'll definitely look to park myself next to one of those in the future.

I've always left between 5-6am on Monday so I tend to avoid the peak madness. I'm not sure I'd confront anyone leaving their stuff, though. I mean I'd want to, but wouldn't want to finish the festival in a heated argument.

[RobertProsineckisLighter]

Would be interesting to compare tonnages with a urban area of a similar size over a week. 

I'm in noway condoning the state of the land afterwards but you can't say it's a farm, because for a week and more it's basically a fully functioning urban settlment. 

 

[ian the worm]

11 hours ago, Gary said:

The green tent on the far left past the white tent is some silly friends of mine.

Can you send them a link to the video?  And get them on board fir next year?

[ian the worm]

4 hours ago, RobertProsineckisLighter said:

Would be interesting to compare tonnages with a urban area of a similar size over a week. 

I'm in noway condoning the state of the land afterwards but you can't say it's a farm, because for a week and more it's basically a fully functioning urban settlment. 

 

It not a problem leaving rubbish.  That is expected and the festival hire rubbish collection lorries (from London by the way - I know this as I gave a hitcher a lift to Castle Cary who had just driven one in) to gather it all up.  Its the not leaving things respectfully tidy people that are the problem.

[RobertProsineckisLighter]

2 hours ago, ian the worm said:

It not a problem leaving rubbish.  That is expected and the festival hire rubbish collection lorries (from London by the way - I know this as I gave a hitcher a lift to Castle Cary who had just driven one in) to gather it all up.  Its the not leaving things respectfully tidy people that are the problem.

"According to the Glastonbury Free Press, this year’s attendees left 500,000 sacks of rubbish, 57 tonnes of reusable items and 1,022 tonnes of recycling on the 1,000-acre site."

this part

 

[stuartbert two hats]

10 minutes ago, RobertProsineckisLighter said:

"According to the Glastonbury Free Press, this year’s attendees left 500,000 sacks of rubbish, 57 tonnes of reusable items and 1,022 tonnes of recycling on the 1,000-acre site."

this part

 

What about that part?  Are you saying the rubbish left is a problem because those numbers seem big?

[DeanoL]

 

26 minutes ago, RobertProsineckisLighter said:

"According to the Glastonbury Free Press, this year’s attendees left 500,000 sacks of rubbish, 57 tonnes of reusable items and 1,022 tonnes of recycling on the 1,000-acre site."

this part

Could be interesting.

Portsmouth has a population of 211,758 which I think is near Glastonbury levels.

For 14/15, Portsmouth City Council reported 77904 tonnes household waste, 60997 tonnes of that not recycled.
https://data.gov.uk/dataset/local_authority_collected_waste_management_statistics

That's annual, so works out at 1067 tonnes over five days, with 836 tonnes recycled, so 201 tonnes of recycling. So it does seem significantly higher (5x), though I don't know if that's because there's far more being recycled.