The curious question of attendance figures

[John the Moth]

I often wonder exactly what the attendance levels of the festival actually are. I see widely varying numbers reported all the time, from the 135,000 "Tickets sold" on the glasto website to 203,000 "capacity" on efestivals glasto page.

What's the real attendance? How does it get uplifted from the tickets sold number?

I guess (no basis for this) there can be no more than 10,000-15,000 tickets reserved for nearby residents / Sunday day tickets, so do the remaining people include volunteers, workers, crew, artists, hangers-on etc. being classed as attendees?

Just curious 

[musky]

That's exactly it - the difference between the two figures accounts for those working at the festival. Note that the higher figure is for those licensed to be at the festival, not the actually figure of those on site. The new licence allowed for some wiggle room over the coming years to allow for increased regulation (and hence a greater number of staff required).

[the beadle]

3 minutes ago, musky said:

That's exactly it - the difference between the two figures accounts for those working at the festival. Note that the higher figure is for those licensed to be at the festival, not the actually figure of those on site. The new licence allowed for some wiggle room over the coming years to allow for increased regulation (and hence a greater number of staff required).

which means there will be more jobs available

[MilkyJoe]

Don't forget that children under 12 don't require a ticket but also figure into the final numbers too.

Shaun.

[John the Moth]

Cheers folks, I will sleep soundly tonight 

[bamber]

With children, security, workers, performers, volunteers, freeloaders, Sunday ticket holders and those smuggled in, I recon the true full attendance is close to 250,000 though it will not be quite there as a momentary maximum attendance.

[incident]

2 hours ago, John the Moth said:

I often wonder exactly what the attendance levels of the festival actually are. I see widely varying numbers reported all the time, from the 135,000 "Tickets sold" on the glasto website to 203,000 "capacity" on efestivals glasto page.

What's the real attendance? How does it get uplifted from the tickets sold number?

I guess (no basis for this) there can be no more than 10,000-15,000 tickets reserved for nearby residents / Sunday day tickets, so do the remaining people include volunteers, workers, crew, artists, hangers-on etc. being classed as attendees?

Just curious 

The total licenced capacity is 203,000. It breaks down like this -

135,000 weekend tickets sold to the public

5,000 Sunday Only tickets sold to residents of certain postcodes in Somerset

63,000 Staff & Performer and other non directly sold tickets / passes / etc

The staff/etc number (and so also the overall number) needs a caveat though - The number of Staff/etc tickets allowed for in the licence is deliberately set much higher than is currently needed to allow for future growth without having to apply for a new licence. I can't remember the exact number, but during the 2015 Festival, the official total number of people on site was slightly over 180,000.

 

 

58 minutes ago, bamber said:

With children, security, workers, performers, volunteers, freeloaders, Sunday ticket holders and those smuggled in, I recon the true full attendance is close to 250,000 though it will not be quite there as a momentary maximum attendance.

While I'm sure the real number is higher than the official 180,000ish, there's absolutely no chance it's anywhere near that high. Basically except the people smuggled in, all of the people you mention are specifically accounted for under the Staff/Performer/Misc allocation (even kids under 12). Though I think the licence uses the term "hospitality" rather than freeloader.

So the real question is how many people are smuggled in without being counted? There's no doubt that some people definitely sneak through - but if the number was high enough to make a significant difference to site density then the Festival would be getting some serious problems from Mendip Council. As far as I'm aware that's not happened since the fence has gone up, so on that basis my assumption is that the number won't be too high. Maybe 10,000ish at the absolute most? Any more than that would be very noticeable.

[John the Moth]

Cheers @incident!

My missus will be there for the first time, so I've been asked about crowd size a number of times from her family and friends. I've always said "roughly 200k" but seeing differing numbers being tossed around I worry that I was wrong.

I hate being wrong... I "hate" quite often 

[glasto-worker]

in the late 80's or early 90's it was claimed that Mendip Council hired a Spotter Plane - the radio station at that time was called Radio Avalon and they used to warn people - to stay in their tents when the plane was spotted - this went on for a few years - one has to wonder how many they estimated to be there - 

I wonder if the Spotter Plane was about in 1995 and 2000 { police claimed there was a extra 100,000 that year } as they would have had a field day.

[clarkete]

4 hours ago, glasto-worker said:

in the late 80's or early 90's it was claimed that Mendip Council hired a Spotter Plane - the radio station at that time was called Radio Avalon and they used to warn people - to stay in their tents when the plane was spotted - this went on for a few years - one has to wonder how many they estimated to be there - 

I wonder if the Spotter Plane was about in 1995 and 2000 { police claimed there was a extra 100,000 that year } as they would have had a field day.

He he, I remember such tales, although I always thought it was a police copter

[eFestivals]

8 hours ago, musky said:

That's exactly it - the difference between the two figures accounts for those working at the festival.

It's a bit more than just those 'working'

It includes artists and their guests, under-12 kids, hospitality tickets and probably more.

[glasto-worker]

53 minutes ago, clarkete said:

He he, I remember such tales, although I always thought it was a police copter

I am sure they do ' now ' but there was a few times I did spot a light plane - I used to wave up at them - you can just imagine the task - how many times did they miscount as it would be a impossible task - I do know that in recent years GFL has been keeping records on how many staff arrive by coach as last year my crew coach was counted three times as they walked though with their little clickers - I suspect that was in response to a joker with a crew minibus who was selling seats on that minibus and just driving them though and then picking more up - they now use laptops or iwhatever to keep track so that dodge cant be used any more.

[stuartbert two hats]

8 minutes ago, glasto-worker said:

I am sure they do ' now ' but there was a few times I did spot a light plane - I used to wave up at them - you can just imagine the task - how many times did they miscount as it would be a impossible task - I do know that in recent years GFL has been keeping records on how many staff arrive by coach as last year my crew coach was counted three times as they walked though with their little clickers - I suspect that was in response to a joker with a crew minibus who was selling seats on that minibus and just driving them though and then picking more up - they now use laptops or iwhatever to keep track so that dodge cant be used any more.

I'd be very surprised if this isn't still being done today, but by helicopter.

[glasto-worker]

9 minutes ago, stuartbert two hats said:

I'd be very surprised if this isn't still being done today, but by helicopter.

I am sure it is.

I did chat to a Police officer at the Phoenix who did explain how they estimated crowds by splitting
up a area into a grid and then taken a count and then multiplying but of course ' it all depends where you look ' - so if they are counting tents - they are having to make up a ' average amount ' but its all at the end of the day ' a estimate ' - I have worked at day events ' where they claimed they sold ' 20,000 ' tickets but the amount of people it had to be close to 60,000 - one thing was certain ' the beer tankers were used up three times faster than the week before ' where I am sure they stuck to 20,000 ' - it was heaving at the bar when they had such a large crowd - will not say who was playing as that will give away the Promoter but I am sure they just printed the tickets three times. 

[musky]

1 hour ago, eFestivals said:

It's a bit more than just those 'working'

It includes artists and their guests, under-12 kids, hospitality tickets and probably more.

Yeah, I hadn't really considered all the under 12s, hospitality and various hangers on. Have any figures ever been released for these? There does seem to have been a very visible increase in kids attending over recent years. 

[Fishman]

Also, what are the capacities of the various stages?

How many can the Pyramid get, for example? Was it over this for the Stones? Dolly? (Crowd for Dolly was much more spread out) 

I also read Nile Rogers quoted as saying "we were only supposed to have 35,000 people in the crowd, but 55,000 turned up". How does he know?

Etc.

[Michaels denim shorts]

There's always lots of smuggled in folk about. The difference is no one is climbing over or tunnelling under or outright breaking down fences like the old days so it doesn't make a particularly good news story any more 

[cb4747]

I wonder how many people forget to cancel their ticket and get a refund and don't go. Wasting a ticket 

[Wooderson]

21 minutes ago, Fishman said:

Also, what are the capacities of the various stages?

How many can the Pyramid get, for example? Was it over this for the Stones? Dolly? (Crowd for Dolly was much more spread out) 

I also read Nile Rogers quoted as saying "we were only supposed to have 35,000 people in the crowd, but 55,000 turned up". How does he know?

Etc.

Over the years there have been various estimates for the "capacities" at the 4 main open air stages. Its inexact as you might imagine.

Pyramid ~100K

Other ~60K

Holts ~35K

Park ~20K

Think there were more people for Rolf on the Holts than Chic. Access route was closed from the circus field. Sick bastards that went down to see him.

[Flysheet]

7 minutes ago, Wooderson said:

Think there were more people for Rolf on the Holts than Chic. Access route was closed from the circus field. Sick bastards that went down to see him.

Ugh, I shook his hand the first time he played in 93 *gets out disinfectant*

 

Someone mentioned 2000 above. There were whole sections of fence down and it was just bonkers, not enough of anything to go round, including food in places. Chumbawamba were playing in a tent up near the Greenpeace bit and there must have been 30000 there alone with peeps stood in amongst the tents up on the hill.

 

The Pyramid crowds went all the way back up into the tents up on Big Ground

[Wooderson]

2 minutes ago, Flysheet said:

Ugh, I shook his hand the first time he played in 93 *gets out disinfectant*

People queued for hours to see him on the West Holts. Hours.

[___S_o_m_a__]

44 minutes ago, Fishman said:

I also read Nile Rogers quoted as saying "we were only supposed to have 35,000 people in the crowd, but 55,000 turned up". How does he know?

Etc.

I read Nile Rodgers' autobiography. He's mad on counting. Absolutely loves it. Counts this, counts that. All day long. He said ''People often ask me Niles - Why are you always counting and I tell 'em the same thing. 'Cause I like it that's why''.

He's pretty good at it by all accounts. If he says 55000 turned up then I for one believe him.

[Flysheet]

32 minutes ago, Wooderson said:

People queued for hours to see him on the West Holts. Hours.

I know, we were somewhere else till quite late on. Couldn't get anywhere near so sodded off again. He drew a huge Pyramid crowd in 2002

[Wooderson]

34 minutes ago, ___S_o_m_a__ said:

I read Nile Rodgers' autobiography. He's mad on counting. Absolutely loves it. Counts this, counts that. All day long. He said ''People often ask me Niles - Why are you always counting and I tell 'em the same thing. 'Cause I like it that's why''.

He's pretty good at it by all accounts. If he says 55000 turned up then I for one believe him.

Rodgers is doing maths all day long, isnt he.

Whilst that field was jammed, they didnt shut it down as per Rolf.

[ghostdancer1]

he really likes blowing his own trumpet though too, ask him now and he'll probably tell you it was 70,000.