70 replies to this topic

[TentOnFire]

"Glastonbury festival organiser Michael Eavis has revealed he is considering introducing a new micro-chipped wristband system in 2013."

Reported on nme.com: http://www.nme.com/n...astonbury/61454

Apparently they used it at Eurosonic Noorderslag festival in the Netherlands.  Anyone experienced it?

Edited by TentOnFire, 16 January 2012 - 12:03 PM.

[5co77ie]

eFestivals' lead story (nice of you to notice!)

http://www.efestival...2/120116b.shtml

[tonyblair]

Michael seems suitably sceptical of the negative side to it...

me?.. anything that could reduce the 6 hour queueing in the rain of last year seems worthy of some discussion

[TentOnFire]

5co77ie, on 16 January 2012 - 12:09 PM, said:

eFestivals' lead story (nice of you to notice!)

http://www.efestival...2/120116b.shtml

I did check, must have crossed over!  Great info as always. Particularly liked "The system is robust to UK festival weather conditions with the entrance hardware fully waterproof and the portals can even be submerged up to 18 inches."

If it's as flexible as it sounds, it could be brilliant for the punters and for keeping the festival site safe.  Would probably stick to carrying cash, but agree with tonyblair that if it costs about the same but reduces queuing times in the sun (no r@!n in 2013 obviously) then it gets my vote.

Edited by TentOnFire, 16 January 2012 - 12:34 PM.

[Keef]

I really like this idea, if only to reduce queuing times at the gates.

If it were just introduced with the minimum 'right of entry' information I don't think anyone would have much of an argument against it.  I think we can cope with a little more info though (at the punters discretion of course) - the idea of "like" stations at the stages (particularly the smaller ones) is a great idea.  I've often seen a band at some random stage at some random time that I've liked but completely forgotten by the following day let alone by the time I get home.

[5co77ie]

I was sceptical too TBH but that comes from remembering this http://www.boycotttesco.com/ (it's possible Eavis also remembers the campaign) rather than anything to do with festivals - so i did ask for more information about the wristbands.

The amount of info the database has about you will depend upon the amount of info you submit to each festival i guess, it's also up to each festival organiser/promoter using the system to decide what you can do with your wristband. The chips do last years - so they could also be useful for years afterwards.

[fatyeti24]

im not really seeing how it would reduce time at the gates.

unless they post the wristbands out to you, you'll still have to queue up to get one won't you?

i stayed outside of the festival last year and exit and re-entry times were minimal.  as i arrived on wednesday evening, so were the initial queues to get in.

surely it's the amount of people all arriving to get in at the same time that causes the queues, not the wrist-technology so either people do not all arrive for first doors, or there are more gates, but a microchip on your arm isn't going to help much at all, unless i'm missing something here?

i can imagine it may help in 'arena' style festivals, and it may have other benefits (or not, depending on your view of the surveillance society), but reducing queues is one im struggling to see.

Edited by fatyeti24, 16 January 2012 - 02:15 PM.

[fatyeti24]

and unrelated to the above, but the Eurosonic Noorderslag festival sadly isn't what i was hoping it was.  ah well.

[5co77ie]

fatyeti24, on 16 January 2012 - 02:08 PM, said:

im not really seeing how it would reduce time at the gates.

unless they post the wristbands out to you, you'll still have to queue up to get one won't you?

i stayed outside of the festival last year and exit and re-entry times were minimal.  as i arrived on wednesday evening, so were the initial queues to get in.

surely it's the amount of people all arriving to get in at the same time that causes the queues, not the wrist-technology so either people do not all arrive for first doors, or there are more gates, but a microchip on your arm isn't going to help much at all, unless i'm missing something here?

i can imagine it may help in 'arena' style festivals, and it may have other benefits (or not, depending on your view of the surveillance society), but reducing queues is one im struggling to see.

wristbands are sent before the event - and as far as I understand it - these can then be  activated as you pass one portal (this could be let's say in the car park or on the road on the way in - then either instantly or further down the 'entrance corridor' you are instantly checked that you are sending a signal without the need to stop you (unless you aren't sending a signal), check your ticket, or put a wristband on you. The advantage of organisers being able to see where the queues are and re-route people earlier to less busy gates.

Once inside a festival like say Glastonbury - your wristbands act as a constant crowd density monitor which would send a signal with all the others of exactly where everyone is - to help organisers know how busy places like the late night areas are, or the paths between the main and other so crowd safety crews can be deployed.

Edited by 5co77ie, 16 January 2012 - 02:40 PM.

[rexclark]

Sounds very interesting, especially the crowd density monitoring. If it does actually work without any bugs then it could be a verty useful piece of kit.

[5co77ie]

To clarify having just re-heard Michael's interview on Radio6 - I think - Michael says that the some of the applications on offer with the wristbands are "too commercial" not the wristbands are too commercial.

I guess that means he's interested in using the technology but not taking up the more commercial aspects on offer like Facebook details or cash on the card - at a guess I think that means if Glastonbury uses the wristband the chip would carry at most no more details than our registration number - or just send an uncoded signal to stop fake wristbands. And that it's the crowd control aspects of the wristband he finds most 'clever' i seem to remember last year's Glastonbury phone app had a similar - show where it's busy tool.

Edited by 5co77ie, 16 January 2012 - 03:24 PM.

[MEGABOWL]

5co77ie, on 16 January 2012 - 02:39 PM, said:

wristbands are sent before the event - and as far as I understand it - these can then be  activated as you pass one portal (this could be let's say in the car park or on the road on the way in - then either instantly or further down the 'entrance corridor' you are instantly checked that you are sending a signal without the need to stop you (unless you aren't sending a signal), check your ticket, or put a wristband on you. The advantage of organisers being able to see where the queues are and re-route people earlier to less busy gates.

Once inside a festival like say Glastonbury - your wristbands act as a constant crowd density monitor which would send a signal with all the others of exactly where everyone is - to help organisers know how busy places like the late night areas are, or the paths between the main and other so crowd safety crews can be deployed.

I like a lot of the thinking behind these but couldn't they just be sold on without any kind of Photo checks? I admit I've been working nights so may be missing something really obvious here.

[5co77ie]

MEGABOWL, on 16 January 2012 - 05:50 PM, said:

I like a lot of the thinking behind these but couldn't they just be sold on without any kind of Photo checks? I admit I've been working nights so may be missing something really obvious here.

Say the chip's 'key' is your registration number - then your details can be called up and checked at any point after the chip is activated by someone with access to the registration database as soon as your chip is in range. So just like the tickets each one is individual to your details you've already submitted - it's just you can no longer see the details or the photo 'attached' to the wristband - i guess that makes using the wrong one even more risky.

[mikeb]

5co77ie, on 16 January 2012 - 06:43 PM, said:

Say the chip's 'key' is your registration number - then your details can be called up and checked at any point after the chip is activated by someone with access to the registration database as soon as your chip is in range. So just like the tickets each one is individual to your details you've already submitted - it's just you can no longer see the details or the photo 'attached' to the wristband - i guess that makes using the wrong one even more risky.

Must admit that I've always liked these kinda systems from a technical point of view and they could quite easily be made to work and work very well with minimal personal data potentially being available for subsequent (mis)use.  Assuming that there would be a similar number of stewards/security on the gates somehow checking that wristbands match photo's so to speak then it would be on par with the existing paper system in so far as touting prevention and general security is concerned.  However, the use of any such system does kinda tend to imply faster and automated entry with no doubt significantly less in the way of manual checks ... which therefore kinda suggests that it would perhaps be easier to gain entry with a totally genuine but dubiously acquired wristband. Not a problem for just about any other festival of course because they generally speaking do not have intentionally personalised entry tickets and don't give a toss about touting but Glasto does and it does for a very good reason.

HOWEVER, the addition of a tiny weeny li'l camera on each turnstile practically guarantees that every wristband allowed through is being worn by the rightful owner of course by using real-time face recognition to accurately compare the registration photo and the ugly mug happy face wandering towards said camera !  That should start an interesting panic debate methinks Not something that I would have any particular problem with if it ever happened TBH but I can well understand that some peeps might perhaps have substantially different views on 'up close and personal' active CCTV and a certain amount of personal info held in a handy database being available as/when required on site

Sorted

Edited by mikeb, 16 January 2012 - 07:55 PM.

[guypjfreak]

more big brother

[5co77ie]

Presumably at festivals in the future where they do use these wristbands and leave the chips active presumably any crime reported can be tracked back to the wristbands that were there at the time

[Mr. Cowbell]

I like the idea of being able to monitor crowds and be able to have the right amount of safety stewards on hand to cover any largely populated areas of the site.

In regards to queuing times, using the regular wristbands is it absolutely necessary for them to issue you with one as soon as you are walking into the site?

At Leeds and I presume Reading, when I've been there in the past you gain entry with your ticket then go to a tent away from the entrances to get your wristband, couldn't this be done at Glastonbury? It would save so much time rather than having to wait to get your wristband at the entrance.

Also are the electronic chip wristbands cost effective? Surely it would cost at least 4/5 times as much as the regular wristbands?

[5co77ie]

the chips only cost a few pennies extra apparently - i can't see that's true.

[Mr. Cowbell]

If that's true then I don't see any reason not to be using them. If it could also help reduce the amount of crime then surely it's only a good idea.

[MEGABOWL]

5co77ie, on 16 January 2012 - 06:43 PM, said:

Say the chip's 'key' is your registration number - then your details can be called up and checked at any point after the chip is activated by someone with access to the registration database as soon as your chip is in range. So just like the tickets each one is individual to your details you've already submitted - it's just you can no longer see the details or the photo 'attached' to the wristband - i guess that makes using the wrong one even more risky.

AH I'm with you. The person checking the tickets can see the photo etc. on their handset. There'd still be ticket checks but a lot quicker as it'd just be a scab rather than faffing with the wristband

I knew it'd be obvious