1556 replies to this topic

[minute5072]

Bloody typical. Perfect weather for football on Saturday by all accounts, game moved to Monday night for Sky coverage and it gets called off...

[Kowalski]

Quote

BBC Scotland has uncovered evidence which suggests Rangers owner Craig Whyte may have lied in court.

During a civil case last year, he told Glasgow Sheriff Court his seven-year ban from being a company director did not relate to treatment of creditors.

But the judge who imposed the ban said company assets were "put out of the reach of the creditors".

The Rangers owner accused the BBC of a "witch-hunt" and said the matter would be dealt with robustly by his lawyers.

Details of Mr Whyte's seven-year disqualification, imposed in 2000, were revealed by a BBC Scotland investigation - Rangers: The Inside Story - which was broadcast in October.

The programme heard allegations that Mr Whyte controlled a company called Re-Tex Plastic Technology despite his ban, an offence which could incur a two-year jail term.

Re-tex Plastic Technology was later wound up in 2003.

Following the documentary, Mr Whyte denied all the claims "in the strongest possible terms" and said he would be launching legal action against the BBC.

The corporation has, as yet, not received a writ.

[Gothenburg83]

bye bye Rangers

[Kowalski]

Rangers go into Administration

[metallimuse]

Sad times.

[Kowalski]

HMRC move to take control of matters!

http://www.bbc.co.uk...w-west-17026172

[eFestivals]

Kowalski, on 14 February 2012 - 11:49 AM, said:

HMRC move to take control of matters!

http://www.bbc.co.uk...w-west-17026172

Good to see HMRC taking action to not get shafted. Rangers under the old owner tried to avoid taxes via an illegal tax avoidance scheme, so they should pay up.

What's rather unfortunate about all this is that the current owner isn't the one whose run off with the money saved.

Then again, Whyte got Rangers on the cheap because this was always in the background and always going to pan out as it's panning out, so he shouldn't really complain that it's impacting on him. He took a chance that it wouldn't and he'd get rich if he got lucky, so it's fair enough really that he suffers the consequences of the chance he took.

I doubt he'll personally be out of pocket at the end of things, cos these sorts of bastards rarely are.

[Kowalski]

eFestivals, on 14 February 2012 - 11:54 AM, said:

Good to see HMRC taking action to not get shafted. Rangers under the old owner tried to avoid taxes via an illegal tax avoidance scheme, so they should pay up.

What's rather unfortunate about all this is that the current owner isn't the one whose run off with the money saved.

Then again, Whyte got Rangers on the cheap because this was always in the background and always going to pan out as it's panning out, so he shouldn't really complain that it's impacting on him. He took a chance that it wouldn't and he'd get rich if he got lucky, so it's fair enough really that he suffers the consequences of the chance he took.

I doubt he'll personally be out of pocket at the end of things, cos these sorts of bastards rarely are.

Indeed.  Whyte hasn't handled things very well and only this week has he appeared (at least in public) to be trying to address the issue.  He's getting an awful lot of flak from the Rangers fans at the moment, but it was the previous regime (David Murray) that have got the club into this mess, and cheated the tax man and Scottish Football.

I'm glad the HMRC have called their bluff though.  This could go all the way to liquidation.

Currently the SPL relies on two votes to pass things though (i.e. the Old Firm vote together).  I think Rangers may lose their voting priveledges if/when they go into administration which makes it easier for the rest of the SPL to get a fairer deal.

[Kowalski]

Decent piece in the Guardian...

Quote

Rangers' demise might not be such a bad thing

The club's slide into administration could help rid Scottish football of ritualised bigotry and intergenerational hatred

Mike Small guardian.co.uk, Tuesday 14 February 2012 11.00

Rangers are a quintessentially British institution. This is the Queen's XI. Their fans sing Rule Britannia and God Save the Queen – but they are in deep trouble, and may well fold completely before it's time to launch the Jubilee barge. Football writer and Rangers fan Graham Spiers has called this the club's "bitter harvest", and railed against the club's inability to cope with its own sectarian songsheet, which has been the source of grief and resentment for years.

But this is a story about financial stupidity more than cultural insolvency. The emerging collapse of Rangers football club is an allegory for a different game that's not so beautiful anymore, where we can't run failed institutions just because it's what we've always done. Rangers may go bust owing the tax man almost £50m.

How did this happen? After the loyalty she has been shown over the years, how can Her Majesty allow her Revenue & Customs to behave in this manner? The reality dawning on the Scottish sports press and supporters of Rangers FC (two groups that are not always entirely distinct) is that the Scottish champions are perilously close to administration and, potentially, liquidation.

Rangers chairman Craig Whyte (himself currently under investigation by the government's intelligence and enforcement directorate for his acquisition of the Ibrox club) said there is no "realistic or practical" alternative to getting ready for administration. The problem relates to a claim by HMRC for unpaid taxes over a period of several years dating back to 2001, which could result in massive liabilities.

The collapse of such a footballing giant after decades of mismanagement tells us a story not just about football as a bloated dysfunctional cultural spectacle, but of feral businessmen, media collusion, and a society witnessing key institutions collapse and teeter while desperately denying that such a thing is happening.

As bitter reality dawns, other certain truths are clung to amid the wreckage. Two of these stand out. One is that Craig Whyte is a shrewd guardian with a secret plan. Rumours swirl that Graeme Souness waits in the wings like a moustachioed Sauron. A Blue Knight to replace Craig Whyte. The second is that Rangers will emerge from the ordeal stronger, and, er, leaner.

Establishment voices mutter confidently of the club's fanbase and that the ""club will never die". Such macho posturing is a default setting from the club's supporters (who numbered 17,822 at the recent home defeat to Dundee United), but the full extent of the club's debts are unknown. Closely tied to this belief that RFC will re-emerge is the notion (repeated like a mantra on all broadcast frequencies) that "the Scottish Premiere League without Rangers is unthinkable", and "Scottish football couldn't survive without the Old Firm". But this idea was quashed by Celtic's chief executive Peter Lawwell only this week, when he stated plainly that his club "don't need Rangers" to flourish financially. Lawwell said the eventuality of their Old Firm rivals going bust "would have no material effect on Celtic".

The idea that the two clubs are mutually dependent persists only because the idea of Rangers and Celtic is so deeply embedded not just in Scottish culture, but also in Scottish press circulation. The Old Firm flog papers. But, in reality, the idea that splitting the Old Firm would be a travesty for Scottish football is upheld only by people who have vested interests in our (already) hopelessly failing game. Scotland's Sky TV deal is already pitiful, and BBC Scotland's coverage is reduced to a poorly produced highlights package.

Michael Grant of the Herald wrote: "Celtic and Scottish football could live without Rangers but, boy, it would be as dull as dishwater." For the absent-minded and unobservant, Scottish football has been in dire terminal decline for some time now. The idea that it would be worse in a league that would immediately present more opportunities for success is patently absurd. It's the sort of logic that could only be expressed by members of a closed group.

Life After Rangers Football (Larf) would mean for every other club a chance that the thousands who migrate towards Ibrox from towns across Scotland every other Saturday might show an interest in their local team. They would have realistic hope of winning trophies. But the positive reality of a Scottish game without Rangers is not primarily about a sport rid of a substantial element of ritualised bigotry and sustained intergenerational hatred, but the prospect of top-quality football being played by young Scotsmen in an atmosphere of optimism. That's something worth aspiring to.

The mainstream press have been fatally blindsided on the impending crisis at Ibrox despite excellent blog coverage. But let's not blame the clubbable journos. The real culprits are the management and board of the club who piled profligacy upon spending spree, from Dick Advocaat's dubious £12m Tore Andre Flo to David Murray's gigantic vanity project. But who'd blame them? Our culture lauds these dodgy geezers. Murray, the club's previous owner, was quoted as saying: "For every £5 Celtic spends I'll spend £10." That doesn't seem so clever now.

[Paul ™]

Kowalski, on 14 February 2012 - 12:32 PM, said:

Currently the SPL relies on two votes to pass things though (i.e. the Old Firm vote together).  I think Rangers may lose their voting priveledges if/when they go into administration which makes it easier for the rest of the SPL to get a fairer deal.

A Fairer deal for what?

[Kyelo]

If Rangers go down. I can see 1 of 2 things happening: 1.Celtic persue an exit from SPL for EPL or that Atlantic League 2.Celtic stay in SPL which rapidly drops down UEFA coefficient rankings which in turn makes it difficult for teams to get into Europe/money gets cut.

With both outcomes all of Scottish football loses money and will struggle to get into Europe. There isn't many people who would watch the SPL without the old firm, Sky will basically say 'GTFO'.

[Paul ™]

Rangers have gone into administration. Club deducted 10 SPL points. Duff and Phelps appointed administrators.

[eFestivals]

Paul ™, on 14 February 2012 - 02:55 PM, said:

Rangers have gone into administration. Club deducted 10 SPL points. Duff and Phelps appointed administrators.

I think the speed of that - so soon after HMRC tried to make moves so they controlled the situation - pretty much confirms that there's a stitch-up going on.

Here's betting that the outcome of everything is a 'pre-pack' buy-back of the club by Whyte, with all the creditors getting shafted to ensure he remains in control.

[Kowalski]

Paul ™, on 14 February 2012 - 02:25 PM, said:

A Fairer deal for what?

Mainly football money.

I see the HRMC were on their way to court yesterday to put Rangers into Administration but Craig Whyte applied first, so things have moved very quickly in the last 24 hours.

[Paul ™]

Am not really sure of the in's and out's of it all Neil, sad day for Rangers fans and Scottish football as a whole.

Who knows what happens next? I really think Liquidation is very possible now

[Kowalski]

Suggestions that the police have requested urgent meeting with Rangers & SPL over policing costs which are already due, and costs which will be incurred over the upcoming matches.

No money = no police = no matches = kicked out?

Its not a sad day for Scottish football as far as I'm concerned.  They have been cheating the rest of the league and the tax man for 10 years.  Every time they knocked somebody out of a cup, they have cheated that team out of money.  I just hope the other chairmen in the SPL (including Aberdeen's) remember this if it comes to any kind of vote about keeping them in the SPL.

A split in the old firm leading to increased competition between the other teams, including the possibility of Champions League football, can only be a good thing IMHO.  There will be more bums on seats at the likes of Dundee Utd, Hearts and Aberdeen suddenly believe they could finish ahead of one of the old firm.

[Kowalski]

Quote

Strathclyde Police: We are seeking an urgent meeting with the administrators to ensure that any payment for policing costs at future Rangers games is guaranteed. "Until we have such a guarantee we would not be in a position to commit public resources to policing an event unless we had a reassurance that our costs would be met."

[Paul ™]

Nonsense.... if there is to be no OF then I can't see Sky hanging about to show St Mirren v Dunfermline as their deal is based on 4 OF games a year... hardly a money spinning fixture for them to advertise is it?

Along with the lower income clubs would face without 2 home games to Rangers, smaller clubs like the above rely on that income, along with the TV revenue.

You really think crowds would increase at other grounds in today's current financial climate?

And let's not forget the people who will unfortunately loose their jobs out of this whole sorry mess... yes blame the previous ownership for not doing things by the books, but not the fans of the team who are suffering due to it all.

[eFestivals]

Paul ™, on 14 February 2012 - 03:24 PM, said:

Am not really sure of the in's and out's of it all Neil, sad day for Rangers fans and Scottish football as a whole.

Who knows what happens next? I really think Liquidation is very possible now

Nothing about what's going on is new. Private Eye have been detailing it all for around 5 years.

Murrey sold out knowing he'd fucked over the club. Whyte 'bought' the club knowing it was fucked - but he's a chancer and chanced it panning out his way.

Things like this aren't really the fault of the fans, but if the fans have taken so little interest in what's been repoted for years then they're fools.

As foir bad for scottish football, it might well p[rove to be the opposite if Rangers died. You might actually have a competition worthy of the name.

[Paul ™]

eFestivals, on 14 February 2012 - 03:53 PM, said:

As foir bad for scottish football, it might well p[rove to be the opposite if Rangers died. You might actually have a competition worthy of the name.

It would soon get stale if Celtic were winning the league every year by 30-40 points with no competition.